Mini Normal 2283 - Game Over!
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- Grib
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Grib Mafia Scum
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I've been taking a long break from mafia. I played offsite a bit after my last game here, but haven't played at all since sometime last year.In post 37, Firebringer wrote:hows it been grib btw i feel like i havent played with u in a long time
Happy to recognize a few people in this game. It's good to see you, and I hope we can have -some- fun.- Grib
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Why did you sign up for this game if the playerlist is meh to you?In post 42, Firebringer wrote:not to play the game but i don't know how anyone reads page 1 and get a townread on anyone. Frankly only thing i got aisa was u being weird.
pedit yeah ive been on semi hiatus too. i hope we have fun too. at least i will try to enjoy myself because why play if ur not gonna have fun.
Serious question.- Grib
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Okay, now you feel almost too scummy to be scum.
Will you tell me about your playstyle? How you tend to handle the early- mid-, and late-game? Why do people who don't know you typically scumread you, and if someone had experience with you, what would they think of your posts so far?
Sorry for the rapid-fire questions, but you intrigue me.- Grib
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Not necessarily a bad thing to generate conversation. What part lacks belief?In post 63, Firebringer wrote:feels like ur doing and saying stuff to generate conversation rather than believing it in any of it- Grib
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I meant, what peopel have to say about it when I lay out the reasons. But you're right, I don't think I'm going to get much out of waiting.
The problems I have with that vote are
1) it was waaay too early to accuse Firebringer of not wanting to have reads.
2) it was also too early to accuse scum of not wanting to fill out your survey - barely half the game had posted at that time.
3) you didn't explain why scum would or would not interact with your quiz.
4) I purposefully ignored your quiz to see what you would do about it, and you didn't react at all, which makes me think that 2 was complete bull.
5) you townreading me right after that felt appease-y.- Grib
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Literally, if it hadn't been for that vote, I think I would be townreading him here. There's too many red flags for me to give him the BOTD, but the phase is young.In post 118, Firebringer wrote:
this is how i felt about my interactions with frog in the last 2 pages after i said he was scum and he changed it to town then said i have a good read of what he is doing.In post 117, Grib wrote:5) you townreading me right after that felt appease-y.
now im just confused when half o what i said was like "ur trying to appear town and i don't know why" but i think he was going for "trying to create conversation out of nothing" agreeing with the latter but ignoring the former and was just trying to find common ground.
Im sitting her going ok. Why does it feel like ur buddying me and grib here.m.
I don't want to focus too much on frog though i think this thread could be exploding in too much posts if we just do this back and forth.
Frog doesn't make complete sense but im like less on scum lean than i was before. Still weak scum right now.- Grib
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In post 129, Frogsterking wrote:Shea scared I'm gonna catch him if he posts more than 3 times every 48 hours
This is so fucking weird.In post 142, Thestatusquo wrote:Hi I'm still not reading the thread because of baseball related vla.
I hope everyone is having a wonderful time so far.- Grib
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That's stupid. If he was going to lie, he could've just said he didn't remember. He didn't even have to bring up that he's played with you before, he did that voluntarily.In post 146, Frogsterking wrote:
I don't agree withIn post 143, Grib wrote:I think it's safe to assume people don't lie about easily verifiable and very public information. There's literally no point. What, was he banking on you not remembering?
"I think it's safe to assume people don't lie about easily verifiable information" people do that all the time and I disagree that's a "safe" assumption especially. And in
mafia I've seen scum lie about more trivial things out of convenience when it had no long term strategic benefit and then not face any consequences when they were discovered because it gets buried under wifomy reasoning like "they wouldn't do that it's too easy to check."
And to answer your question, I don't think it was calculated, I think it was just inconvenient when you asked him about my play for him to have to tell you
"I played scum with him recently and he is garbage, he's probably Town here" and allow us to consolidate a Town core together. I think if anything, he banked on no one taking it seriously if he happened to get called out on it.- Grib
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Is it a complete coincidence that you happened to start posting shortly after Frog called you out?In post 153, Thestatusquo wrote:No I can't share them with you.
You would actually be able to get a lim on me.- Grib
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I was talking about the whole "this is where I am and what I'm doing and why I'm V/LA" information, which was never in doubt.In post 168, Firebringer wrote:
pretty sure it is relevant if u want to dig into the timing of when he showed up and where he said he was doing at the times previously.In post 165, Grib wrote:None of that is relevant to your alignment, or whether or not you and Frog share a private chat.
don't know why we want to go into this route. I don't think this is really anything we can dig into without going into conspiracy theory. Nor do I think their interactions scream theatre right now.- Grib
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All I'm saying is it's a pretty big coincidence for someone who's V/LA to start posting very shortly after they're soft-mentioned in the thread -one- time.
I don't even know if I think Frog is scum. His posts are baffling, and Shea's timing is baffling.
I'm not saying there was a master plan behind this. Just the way it happened is a red flag to me.- Grib
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I do worry, though, that your hesitance to get involved in any capacity is indicative of scum. But that's a feeling that remains from playing with you once quite a while ago. What are you thinking/feeling right now?In post 205, Bellaphant wrote:Actually no.- Grib
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Sooo… I made a case for Frog being scum. As of right now none of the concerns I have have been addressed. The only “defense” I’ve seen is that Frog doesn’t play logically, which isn’t helpful at all.
That being said, he claims that he’s good at sussing scum out on Day 1, so I’m happy to let him scumhunt and reevaluate my own read based on how he does his thing.
Other than that, I really don’t have much to say. Last night more than half the player list had less posts than the mod. I think Fire is town and Frog is scum. Everyone else is a big fat question mark.- Grib
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Eh, yeah, that's about what I expected from Shea. There's always at least one player every single game who dislikes either me or my playstyle and then finds a way to scumread me for it.
Probably just going to ignore and play around that slot, to be honest, because if he's a villager there's like 0% chance he ever extends an olive branch.- Grib
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I've played with people like you before. If I think you're just not going to cooperate with me on principle (which I do), I will play around you. You were kind of rude to me before for no real reason.
The whole point of my "case" on Frog was that those things bothered me, I asked Frog to clarify, and he actively chose not to. That certainly isn't townie, and kind of lends credence to my theory that Frog isn't town.- Grib
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Actually, I'll expand on my approach here a little bit.
I'm not going to try to justify things in term of what town!Frog would do and what scum!Frog would do. That's meta; I've never played with Frog in my life and I have no intention of doing a meta dive. I asked for a brief summary of his playstyle, and some other people have chimed in, and that's what I'm working with.
So with that in mind (the main point in my mind being that Frog is Hard To Read but Catches Scum Pretty Early), I, a villager that knows next to nothing, notice some patterns in a couple of Frog's posts and I lay them out all nice and neat to see if Frog can explain why he did the things he did. He quotes the post but doesn't address anything. Several pages go by and still, nothing. What am I supposed to make of that?- Grib
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So why didn't you say so when you acknowledged my post?In post 279, Frogsterking wrote:
I +1 ElementsIn post 275, Grib wrote:The whole point of my "case" on Frog was that those things bothered me, I asked Frog to clarify, and he actively chose not to. That certainly isn't townie, and kind of lends credence to my theory that Frog isn't town.
In post 238, Elements wrote:
I think your case comes from a town mindset. I don't think your points necessarily point towards Frog scum though. I can see Frog!town wanting to sort Fire and so not paying as much attention to others doing the same, and I think Frog and Fire's early interactions point in this direction.In post 234, Grib wrote:Sooo… I made a case for Frog being scum.- Grib
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You asked about town!Frog and scum!Frog, and I answered that those are meta reads and not how I'm approaching him. Now you're generalising your question, which is fine. It's my opinion that a villager wouldn't behave the way he did because he'd be actively preventing me from getting a read on his slot. I also thought he might not know how to answer my questions in a way that would make me back off, and was hoping I'd eventually drop it.In post 294, Thestatusquo wrote:
You did not. I asked you what made the miriad of things you listed about frogger to be more likely to come from scum than town. You have not answered that.In post 282, Grib wrote:I did answer the question.- Grib
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Okay, I think you're mixing up your own posts.
This is you quoting my reasons. No question here.Spoiler:
I assume this is the question you were asking, which I answered holistically, but apparently not the way you wanted me to because it sounds like you want a line-by-line justification for thinking those reasons were scummy. Is that correct?Spoiler:- Grib
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I guess I'll go ahead and answer it that way, because if that isn't it either then I really can't imagine what you actually want from me.
Individually, they aren't slam-dunk scumtells. They're quirks in his play that actively caught my attention and made me think that he wasn't approaching the game as a villager because of how many wires he tripped (for me). 1 is a BS reason to vote someone period (slightly scummy), 2 is him ruining his own alleged gambit (his read probably isn't genine), 3 is making up a reason to scumread someone (same reason as 2), 4 circles back to 2 and makes it even less of a genuine gambit, and 5 is kind of a classical/general scumtell.- Grib
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What part of it seems town to you, and what part of his reaction moves the needle closer to scum?In post 385, Aisa wrote:Thanks BBT ^^
I think TSQ comes out of this looking towny. Tbh I feel them getting a bit of a point. I can also see this reaction from Town!BBT, but I think it's a little scum indicative overall, sorry.- Grib
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I can appreciate you playing the game in a way that makes you happy, especially if you're on my team and conribute to solving the game. But I get easily tilted when deliberately antagonized, which I don't think is going to be worth much alignment-wise. And I don't like being mad at people in a game.
Whether what I focus on has value to you isn't super relevant to me, because I have to process the game with the brain between my skull, not yours.
Not being dismissive or condescending, just laying out my position as clearly as possible to minimize friction. - Grib
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