Then they kill you !!In post 595, Val89 wrote:And if the first one you flipped happened to be town, what then?In post 594, Shrek wrote:also i still think that one of luke/val should be flipped in the future just for safe measures
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Damn. Just tried to make a jokeI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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I thought the double exclamation marks would give it away.I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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I have my own thoughts that lie in a similar vein to that, but I will let shrek answer for themselves before I weigh inIn post 601, alstroemerial wrote:On mobile so I can’t quote, but I’m having trouble reconciling Shrek’s post about limming one of Luke or Val “for safety” with the earlier post of thinking it’s TvT. What’s up with that?I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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VOTE: shrekI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Shrek's iso feels like someone trying to stay alive, while also trying to give off the appearance of not trying to stay alive. High claims of read apptitude:
But has provided zero reads on any of these slots: Zyla, Pav, Alstro, Marci, UmlautIn post 580, Shrek wrote:because im an incredible gamer who should be eliminated asap if the mafia want to win. #1 scumhunter in the making yo
Like go to their iso, and control+f and search for any of those names, they are never mentioned, short of greeting Zyla and Pav.
Even their take on me v Val required someone to ask them.I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Been there, done that, had that conversation <3In post 619, alstroemerial wrote:In post 280, Lukewarm wrote:
@Everyone -- if I vote for anyone other then Val before the end of Day 1, please take that as a scum claim, and hammer me with impunityIn post 497, Lukewarm wrote:Just to make it clear to the thread, I think that at this pointI, Lukewarm,would be a better elim then : Zyla, Pva, and Umlaut.
If you don't want to follow me onto a Not_Mafia vote, then feel free to follow Val onto a Luke Vote
VOTE: Not_MafiaI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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I probably oversold my point to begin with tbh.
Val said something along the lines of looking forward to me trying to walk back my scum read on him / get out of this 1v1, and I was trying to say that I was not planning to walk back my scum read of him or try to get out of the 1v1.
And that is true. I still think that he is scum, I am just accepting that no one is gonna follow me for that elim today, so voting for my second choice now.I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Shrek, do you have thoughts onIn post 620, Lukewarm wrote:But has provided zero reads on any of these slots: Zyla, Pav, Alstro, Marci, Umlautof these slots?anyI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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You mean the read list that I had to ask for, because they apparently felt no need to share any reads until asked?In post 635, Umlaut wrote:That was E-1, right? ...right?
UNVOTE: Shrek
I actually like their reads post, not just because they call me hard-town (though that's probably part of it just because it surprised me a lot)
Or that the self proclaimed #1 scum hunter ended on a "voting Not_Mafia even though I don't really think he is scum, just want to look at how people positioned around him"
Or the fact that his read list does not even match up to his stated reads?
Spoiler:
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Mainly just that I have Zyla as a strong Town read rn, and did not want her to be the wagon everyone parked on while aggressively ignoring the Luke v Val 1v1In post 636, Umlaut wrote:Luke, did you ever explain why I shouldn't be voting Zyla? I changed my vote because you asked nicely but I don't get it.I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Your iso that game looks quite a bit better then your iso this game thoIn post 640, Not_Mafia wrote:
Wow I caught scum in my first post and got eliminated for itIn post 639, Umlaut wrote:
In my very first game on the site, I as scum stuck my neck out for town!Not_Mafia on Day 1 and instead pushed my scumbuddy as a better elim.In post 632, Shrek wrote:ebwop pavowski actually looks a lot better reading back on his iso specifically because he seems to preserve not mafia for now? like i legitimately dont see a mafia member sticking their neck out for him assuming he is town which is a good thing. that said if nm does flip mafia here it obviously would make pavowski look bad in retrospect and he has to know that. maybe mafia is protecting nm though still intends to lynch him later down the line to get town cred? if that makes any sense at all. i also misremembered it was zyla going for the n_m elim which is a little shady but she's been contributing a lot otherwise.
I'm not saying this is necessarily what Pavowski is doing but I felt like I should point it out anyway.I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Mainly, I have played with Zyla as scum and Zyla as town, and this feels more like the Zyla as town game.In post 642, Umlaut wrote:
Convince me of this townread?In post 638, Lukewarm wrote:
Mainly just that I have Zyla as a strong Town read rn, and did not want her to be the wagon everyone parked on while aggressively ignoring the Luke v Val 1v1In post 636, Umlaut wrote:Luke, did you ever explain why I shouldn't be voting Zyla? I changed my vote because you asked nicely but I don't get it.
Still stand by this:
Looking back over her iso there were a few things that stood out to me as well:In post 354, Lukewarm wrote:@Pav, I just did an iso on Zyla, and I would say that I am on a weak town lean there
I liked the way she did her iso read list -- it gave lots of things for people to latch on to / respond to. I think she put in a lot of work to try and pull the thread back into productive conversations -- I think it is probably my/val's fault that she did not spark several conversations all at once there.
Particularly liked the reach out to Not_Mafia
The meta check on Marci in 124 feels like a town thing to do. Like, maybe scum does it to try and paint Marci as scummy, but Scum Zyla could have just as easily never made that post once she found townie evidence for marci there.
Zyla's questions for Val in 121 and 126 and 142 felt like she was trying to sort Val. I actually questioned her for those posts at first, but 151 cleared up that she was not advocating anything, but actually digging into Val's stance.
Next was her read list full of quotes and questions that I particularly liked (starts at 255 in her iso)
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I will say that she has fallen off a bit the back half of the day, but she also said she has some irl stuff going on, so the read is mainly based on before that I guess.I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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I am not quite sure I am following this.In post 656, marcistar wrote:i also dont want a shrek elim > hes been contributing, which I think will be helpful to decide things later down the line as opposed to someone who isn't really contributing.
i don't have a read on not_mafia, so I wouldn't mind this
VOTE: not_mafia
Does "hes been contributing" = he has been townie?
You say that you don't have a read on Not_Mafia, but that would put him in null, right?
Shouldn't you vote for your biggest scum read? Or is null the worst you got right now?I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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So Shrek is also null atm?In post 658, marcistar wrote:doesnt = townie, just means that itll be easier to read him in future phases than it would be to read not_mafia.
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Just hanging out, waiting for the flip like
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That was the only part of that sentence that was incorrect? lolI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Well.... uhhhh
This is awkwardI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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That might be the worst kill the scum team could have made?I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Like, Val was definitely a possible miselim target, and they have also forced me to do a resetI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Will be re-reading the whole game before I vote, because like, obviously my entire view on everyone was tinted throughout day 1I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Jesus, I don't even know any more -- even looking back -- I do think that it is odd for Not_Mafia to look at the Val night kill and immediately go to thinking I am scum.
Also, just like thinking about the fact that if they decided to kill inside of the [Val, Luke] 1v1, and decided to go with Val, then they must have eitherreallythought that Val was a PR, or maybe they are high in my town reads, so I probably need to look back over all of those was well.
So far, I have looked back at Marci iso, it is less good then I remember, so she is down to null I guess. I think that the biggest thing keeping Marci from being a scum lean is my play history with her. We have played 2 games together, with her being scum in one and town in the other. And imo, she was super townie in her scum game, and a bit scummy in her town game. Like, she tried really hard as scum to not let her teammate down, so if anything my brain wants to say "scummy marci is a town marci" and vice versa
Also, looked back at Zyla, and I think I am gonna keep Zyla in my town reads atm.
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If you did not shorten my quotes down so misleadingly, the answer would be right there for you. smhIn post 699, marcistar wrote:
so what do u think i am?In post 697, Lukewarm wrote:And imo, she was super townie in her scum game, and a bit scummy in her town game. Like, she tried really hard as scum to not let her teammate down, so if anything my brain wants to say "scummy marci is a town marci" and vice versa
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It was less that I knew why they would have a reason to think that he was a PR, and more that I am trying to figure out why they would have killed him.In post 702, Umlaut wrote:
Can you elaborate on this?In post 697, Lukewarm wrote:Also, just like thinking about the fact that if they decided to kill inside of the [Val, Luke] 1v1, and decided to go with Val, then they must have eitherreallythought that Val was a PR, or maybe they are high in my town reads, so I probably need to look back over all of those was well.
Why would the Mafia think Val is a PR?
(Everyone else please leave this question alone and let Luke answer)
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I went from reading most people as town, to suddenly everyone seems scummier.I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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The convenient and easy choice would be jumping on the Not_Mafia wagon, but I am instead choosing to try and figure this game out, but that is making my head hurtI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Yeah, I did not read those posts that way.In post 720, Umlaut wrote:
So the reason I asked this is that Val was pretty obviously hinting at a PR yesterday with posts like 248 and 276 and 282. I thought it was quite blatant, in fact, and while I tried to be at least somewhat subtle about why I didn't think he was a good wagon for the day I thought I was pretty obvious as well, to the point where I am very surprised that anyone didn't see this. I assume that baiting the NK was precisely his goal, so scum saw it at least. Did you seriously miss this?In post 703, Lukewarm wrote:
It was less that I knew why they would have a reason to think that he was a PR, and more that I am trying to figure out why they would have killed him.In post 702, Umlaut wrote:
Can you elaborate on this?In post 697, Lukewarm wrote:Also, just like thinking about the fact that if they decided to kill inside of the [Val, Luke] 1v1, and decided to go with Val, then they must have eitherreallythought that Val was a PR, or maybe they are high in my town reads, so I probably need to look back over all of those was well.
Why would the Mafia think Val is a PR?
(Everyone else please leave this question alone and let Luke answer)
And thinking he was a PR is a reason why they might try to kill him despite our 1v1
I read 276 and 282 to mean once he dies.
Like, 276, "I can see it now, if I get eliminated, then you will have to back pedal" and 282, he was responding to alstro talking about me looking bad if we miselimed Val
Which, at the time, I took as him trying to scare me off of pushing him
Looking back at 282 specifically, I do see now that it makes more sense as a PR softI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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The urge to lolhammer Not_Mafia is strong, because, well, he is Not_Mafia lolI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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But I think Zyla has something to say?In post 725, Zyla wrote:I've got to head out for a bit though, so I'll make more in depth posts when I can
So, I will wait for thatI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Just to be clear, I have plan on hammering after Zyla has gotten a chance to check in.
@Not_Mafia, are you gonna claim?I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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I am not in a hurry, but I also don't really like sitting and waiting if there is not discussion happening.In post 751, Umlaut wrote:We have four whole days left, there's no hurry here.
When I declared intent to hammer, then had been 18 total posts in the prior 24 hours.
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Alstro, I am really not following that postI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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I think that my difficulty following was that there were a few things I found contradictory, and do not understand why you ended with a Zyla vote
For example:
And then ending with a Zyla voteSince Zyla and Marci were the only ones not on the miselim yesterday, it seems to me extremely likely that at least one if not both mafias were on the wagon yesterday.
And then also, you had both several reasons why scum Not_Mafia would make sense and then also reasons why he did not make sense, so I am a little unsure where you ended wrt him. So, what is your current read on Not_Mafia?I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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imo, Not_Mafia's push on me immediately after the Val flip does not make sense coming from either alignment, and that has been the main reason I did not start pushing him today.
It is very confusing tbh, because Scum!Not_Mafia would have had the entire night phase to think about who he wanted to flip at the start of the day, and would have known the Val flip was coming in advance.
On the other hand, I outlined my reasons for scum reading him Day 1, and then his positioning around the Shrek wagon was kinda meh as well.
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Meaning that scum not_Mafia would not be making a gut reaction to the val flip, he would have had time to think about the push in advanceIn post 787, Lukewarm wrote:It is very confusing tbh, because Scum!Not_Mafia would have had the entire night phase to think about who he wanted toflippushat the start of the day, and would have known the Val flip was coming in advance.I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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I was actually considering asking for this at the start of day, but cannot really explain why because of ~ongoing games~In post 815, T3 wrote:MASSCLAIM, EITHER CLAIM PR OR VT
I am a VT
If we are doing it popcorn style, I would like Alstro to go nextI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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So the point is to say VT or PR, without saying what your actual ability is if you are a pr.
can buy 2 confirmed townies if neither scum cc a pr.
If a scum does counter claim a PR, then we can find the scum in the counter claim, by trapping them via the mech possibilities.
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And by not saying which ability is where, you let any protectives we might have, know exactly who to protect, and force the scum team take a chance at shooting a protected pr if they shoot inside the prsI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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It also forced the scum team to decide right now if they are going to counter claim as a pr, and which one, which limits their choices.I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Also, if T3 had taken any slot other then exactly Zylas, I would have just voted him here, but I had zyla as a town read, so am going to have to work through his nonsenseI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Like, I know for a fact that this is not true, because I am a VT, so even something like a tracker can never give an investigative result that would look bad.In post 816, T3 wrote:I have a theoretical investigative result that may incriminate Lukewarm.
So, now I have to figure out, is t3 scum lying about it, or is t3 town lying about his result.
Any other player, I would just assume they were scum, because most players, as town, would not lie about having an incriminating result, but this is T3
In our first several games together, I very much enjoyed playing with them, but then they lost some scum games, and I guess decided that they could not fake being town as scum, so instead they just started playing bat-shit crazy as town instead, which I have no idea if it is helping their scum win rate or anything, but it more frustrating to play with themI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Actually, fuck it, lets not do the VT/PR thing.
Talked myself out of it.
VOTE: T3I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Okay, so T3 is now claiming that he fake claimed an investigative role, because he thought that NM was an investigative role.
That completely eliminates the reason I was defending the Zyla slot.I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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I thought Zyla accidentally slipped that she was an investigative pr.In post 297, Zyla wrote:
If you're as sure as you claim to be about this, then to me Val seems almost like an auto-elim tomorrow if you flip town, and you an almost auto-elim tomorrow if Val flips town.In post 234, Lukewarm wrote:If we do elim within [me, Val], and the consensus is to flip me -- then Val should always be investigated if we have any investigative abilities.And if it's anything but Cop, would it even be worth it? I doubt scum team would have someone under so much suspicion do the killWhy would I want to investigate you overnight?
From T3's play, I no longer think that the slot is actually an investigative pr.
I no longer am standing in the way of the people who were scum reading ZylaI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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This is t3 confirming that Zyla/him was never an investigative pr, or else he could never suspect that NM wasIn post 833, T3 wrote:I thought Nm was saying he had a guilty on one of lukewarm pav bc metaI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Happy birthday UmlautI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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If you think that T3 is hard to read, you can always look back on Zyla. If I remember correctly, you had her as a scum read, and only stopped voting her because I asked you to stop voting her.
Well, the only reason I asked you to stop voting her was because I thought she was our PR. T3 has confirmed that his slot is not what I thought his slot was, so I am no longer asking people to not vote for that slotI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Yes, this is E-1 for T3In post 844, marcistar wrote: VOTE: t3
ill note this for anyone, im not quite sure what this puts him at
it might be e-1??I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Not Mafia, are you town reading the t3/zyla slot?I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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In post 849, Lukewarm wrote:Not Mafia, are you town reading the t3/zyla slot?I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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I don't know that I would say always, because this is a recent change for T3In post 857, Umlaut wrote:as Luke pointed out, T3 always acts approximately this erratically and it's hard to confidently scumread it.
Just 2 months ago, it was like he had like a completely different playstyle. He was not erratic in this way, and I found his town playstyle to be townie, and when I got a town read on him, I would go out of my way to defend his slot. (See this game: Open 815)
I really liked playing with the old-playstyle-T3, and I don't know what inspired him to change his playstyle to what it is now...I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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Pretty sure that T3 is wrong that Not_Mafia was crumbing a pr.In post 861, alstroemerial wrote:If Not_Mafia was crumbing a PR
T3 appears to be think that Not_Mafia's push on me was because Not_mafia had a guilty on me, which. No, he doesn't
But that, is the only reason for him to post this I think
UNVOTE:In post 816, T3 wrote:I have a theoretical investigative result that may incriminate Lukewarm.
If t3 is fucking town this game, I am going to screamI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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I have actually talked myself out of the T3 vote. Basically in 863.
T3 saw Not_Mafia pushing me right out the gate, and his first thought appears to be that Not_Mafia had a guilty result on me. Obviously, scum would never have that thought, because they would know that he could not get a guilty on me, and this also does not seem like and angle scum would take.
So, this might just be bad town play....
VOTE: Not_MafiaI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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I hard disagree with this. I compiled this earlier, but like, look at how he pushed these people in our prior games. Both times Not_Mafia was a Vanilla Townie, so clearly making a push does not require a PR resultIn post 868, T3 wrote:The only time I've seen NM hard push another player was when he had an effective guilty.
In post 455, Lukewarm wrote:
Actually every single time Not_Mafia mentioned Bingle in Micro 1010, before Bingle was the Day 1 Elim
Spoiler:
Actually every single time Not_Mafia mentioned Drap in Open 810, before Drap was the Day 1 Elim
Spoiler:I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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And you were in Open 810...I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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In post 851, ArcAngel9 wrote:Countdown: 1 day, 14 hours, 22 minutesI have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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/Okay T3. Do you think I am scum?
If you do not think that I am town, then that would mean that Not_Mafia is not crumbing an investigative PR, right?
If you stop thinking Not_Mafia is an investigative PR, flush that idea from your head, what do you make of his iso this game?I have a GTKAS now! - Come ask me questions!
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