Open 721: Pick Your Poison (Game Over)

[ruru]

I think you may have the wrong duckling

[Scioness Sajj]

welp

I don't see a difference between those avatars. was gonna offer ofrhz my own but forgot lol

[Mathdino]

scioness is town btw

there's scum in the 3 ducks guaranteed

i kinda wanna leave my vote here to act as a passive cattle prod but

VOTE: ofrhz

[ruru]

Hmm

If SS is scum then ofrhz/TW are less likely to be scum, I think

[Mathdino]

good ruru saw the same thing i did

ruru is locktown for eternity guys, treat her like you should've treated oxy last game

let's wagon some fuckin ducks

[pinturicchio]

Ok, the tinfoil hat theory is still on, but I'll leave it for another day. I got real reasons to believe that Drainth and Uglyduck are both scum, and if we want to lynch the ducks, then I'll focus in the ugly one

VOTE: Uglyduck

[ruru]

This is a clear departure from your original stance on ducks, pin

[ofrhz]

Draynth

- Not a lot to go off of, but reads seem OK. I mean I disagree with his top two pushes, but I think for anyone to be pushing Math/TW right now I would of been granting some TP to because there has to be like a 0% chance they get lynched today.

Er... your two scumreads are in his townreads. And also while you have some overlapping reads with Draynth, your reasons for those reads are different (e.g. Draynth's read on skitter was null bc he literally just skipped skitter's posts, whereas you have a nullread on skitter for a very different reason). What there anything else about his reads that pinged you as town?

Pin

- So I am 4 games on this forum and this is the third with Pin. I have thought he was skum in every game I have played with him, and so far have yet to be correct. I am

putting him under Null because I am getting skummy vibes, but obv that has not worked out for me in the past

. The thing is that

I am getting skummy vibes because he is playing differently

than he has in the other games I have played with him. Normally way more involved, and pushing the game along. That could be because Math/TW are kind of driving the bus here, or not, so yeah.. for now Null.

Lots of hedging

Ruru

- Perfect amount of content for skum combined with the the content of that content. A little bit of the Game Set Up talk, a little bit of the rando joke around side content, some vote throws, and (what stood out to me) is just like lots of random questions. Not random I suppose, but questions that have been answered based on context of game or like ambiguous questions about general game play. They said this is their second game ever, so there could be that - but just a note from my POV, bc this site has so many ALTs, I disregard every player's "amount of games played posts".

Nah I believe she's telling the truth when she says this is her second game.

ofrhz

- So this is kind of my main spot at this point. Starting with the Vig shot concept from a while back "why wouldn't Vig shoot N1". Regardless of the correct play, I feel like looking like it from that perspective is

worried skum mindset

where as Town Mindset would be "Oh god what if I guessed wrong".


So yeah.

I don't see myself getting a Ruru train going rn based on everyone's posted standing

, so... VOTE: ofrhz

I'm not really seeing this? Someone brought up that vig is anti-town because a vig could just mis-fire on town, so I was trying to get at an optimal vig play here.

I kinda feel like you're going after me for being an easier mislynch than ruru.
VOTE: UglyDuck call it omgus, idgaf

not reading pedits lmao

[Mathdino]

good vote

for anyone who's wondering, pintu is locktown because scum-him notices that i hardpush VIs who tunnel me to oblivion based on Open 714

he doesn't make the same mistake as Drixx, TheGoldenParadox, pintu-back-then, etc

skitter on the other hand is far less likely to be intimidated which is why i'm very ???? about her

in fact i think it's more likely scum-skitter is forced to discredit/reduce the control i have over gamestates because gamesolving etc etc

the rest of the newbies from 1859 would probably stay out of my way as scum (also partially why oxy is likely town. scum-him should be buddying me about now since i'm hard townreading him)

[brassherald]

And

[brassherald]

Vote Count 1.7

ofrhz (3)

Sunshine13, UglyDuck, Mathdino

Draynth (2)

the worst, ruru

UglyDuck(2)

pinturicchio, orfhz

AP (1)

skitter30

Mohab500 (1)

oxy

oxy (1)

Scioness Sajj

skitter30 (1)

AP

the worst (1)

Draynth

Not Voting:

Mohab500

With 13 alive, it takes 7 votes to lynch.
Deadline: (expired on 2018-04-30 16:45:00)

Sunshine13 is V/LA until Tuesday April 24, 2018

[ofrhz]

I think you may have the wrong duckling

Hey Scioness, you were probably confusing me with TW (he posted 480). Have I (upside duck) dodged any of your questions?

I'm going to change my avatar. Was fun being upside down while it lasted

[ruru]

This is a clear departure from your original stance on ducks, pin

Also I kind of want to hear actual reads/analysis because a lot of your posts haven't been too game-related

the rest of the newbies from 1859 would probably stay out of my way as scum (also partially why oxy is likely town. scum-him should be buddying me about now since i'm hard townreading him)

?????

Mathdino is obv!town

truuuuuuue

lolol

very nice, dino!

@mathdino
You can conduct.

You just can't be in the orchestra, yet.

I like your style =)

I would love to hear your plan, Dino =)

[Mathdino]

Lists in no particular order
Town reads: {The Worst, Sunshine13, Pinturicchio, Ruru}
Lynch pool: {Draynth, UglyDuck, Skitter30, Scioness Sajj}

I need a little bit more from Ofrhz to confirm my town lean.

@mathdino
You can conduct.

You just can't be in the orchestra, yet.

p.edit It's poe. It is (player list) - (town reads) - (people I don't want to lynch D1 for reasons)

Pin is doing a couple of things that would add up to a huge wifom play when considered in the context of the game a bunch of us just finished.

That's possible, but I don't think it's probable.

scum-oxy townreads me here. he knows he can't mislynch me.

he only later on started hard townreading me and that was for reasons unrelated to the early game

early game is a gold mine for reads uninfluenced by the observer effect imo

[Oxy]

TBH,

Mathdino is obv!town

And it's because he's holding back.

Strongest town read outside of Ruru

Hm?

---

The theory is this:
On a personality level:
Mathdino plays to win.
Mathdino is cognizant of, and confident in, his own abilities to a great extent.
Mathdino is invested in growing both the player base, and the level of play on this site.

On a meta level: People expect Mathdino to charge into a game as town and aggressively attempt to solve it. This could be by mechanical means, scum hunting and poe, or a mixture of both.

Thus: As scum, Mathdino puts on the show people expect from him, especially in an environment like this where a) he rightly assumes others will overestimate his skills, and b) faking reads would be easy for him considering his understanding of newb!town tells and the composition of this game.

As town, Mathdino assumes that his reads and actions have

at least

as much impact as they actually have. In his eyes, a lot of reads in the game are affected by what says, which in turn makes the slots those reads come from more difficult to read.

As town, Mathdino feels he is more able to both achieve his win con and foster growth at the same time. This means that, as town, he would be less likely to disregard the fun of a player when determining his next course of action. It means sitting back to the extent that he is capable of and letting other people give reads and make pushes.

Basically, it's saying things like "I don't want to just come into your game and say lynch the IC on D1" and "I didn't push Sajj in part because I felt bad" rather than keeping his foot on the gas.

[Mathdino]

meh yeah you could be right i guess looking over his ISO

my townreads probably go something like

ruru --> Sunshine --> pintu --> Oxy --> Scioness

Edit: oh wow i love it when people talk about me

[the worst]

@Oxy.

VOTE: UglyDuck

ƃuᴉlʞɔnp feels like its trying
Draynth tbc

[Mathdino]

does anyone wanna help me figure out if uglyduck is getting bussed or if he's the designated mislynch

[the worst]

Sure

[the worst]

Who's voting him atm?

[Oxy]

Okay, now that I've caught up to where I was when I posted my Dino read last night, going to start working through the stuff up until now.

Doing a deeper dive than in previous games, so this will be a slow process, but no sleep til it's done.

[skitter30]

4 pages. I'm only going to spend ~15 min on this now though; I'm mostly here cuz I need a break from my hw before I go crazy.

- what have i handwaved away other than your scumread on me

You told me that you agree with my suspicions wrt the mohab wagon and than preceeded to ask me why I'm questioning it. It's disingenuous. Either I have a point and I should be pursuing it, or I don't have a point and I shouldn't be questioning it and you don't have to bother responding to me.

It's bizarre to tell me that you agree with my point (ie that scum could well have been pushing the mohab thing and that you're scummy for doing so), but also think that it's not something I should be pursuing (and that me specifically questioning *you* about it is weird).

i was scum in that game for my tone, not for my content. that's why i'm telling you that read on you wasn't some kind of smoking gun in itself. again, it was a correct read, i was legitimately scumhunting, but the way i presented everything made me awkward scum.

I don't know how to articulate tonereads beyond 'feels wrong'.

This is basically also at least partially a toneread. You feel wrong here in basically the *exact* same way you felt wrong in those posts I quoted. Like I look at your posts here and think, they feel wrong, where I have seen this before, and is it relevant that these posts remind me of some other game (ie does that situation reasonably apply here)? Oh this reminds me of the posts Math wrote in MKUltra that also felt wrong, which he wrote in a similar situation (ie me scumreading you), which I correctly scumread him for.

You just felt *right* in the Newbie, and like you were scumhunting there. You feel really, really, really wrong here, especially with your last few posts. I don't know how to articulate 'wrong' better though. If I try to put it in words it's something like bravado/defensive/over-confidant/disingenuous/playing-down-the-validity-of-what-I'm-saying.

[pinturicchio]

Who's voting him atm?

You, ofrhz and me, and I think Dino's question could mean "is ofrhz Uglyduck's partner bussing or is Uglyduck a mislynch that ofrhz is trying to get?". Basically saying in both ways that ofrhz is scum

[skitter30]

specifically sheeping maths' mohab vote and the random oxy vote cuz oxy left him out of his readslist

OMG! You're a

tripod

tryhard.

So you didn't like me sticking my vote unto a wagon I liked to see how it felt, and you also don't like me swinging it around. Tell me baby, what is your thing?

VOTE: skitter

Now you can add OMGUS to your list. Let's call it.. reason #3

I don't like your votes cuz they're bad.

[UglyDuck]

Draynth

- Not a lot to go off of, but reads seem OK. I mean I disagree with his top two pushes, but I think for anyone to be pushing Math/TW right now I would of been granting some TP to because there has to be like a 0% chance they get lynched today.

Er... your two scumreads are in his townreads. And also while you have some overlapping reads with Draynth, your reasons for those reads are different (e.g. Draynth's read on skitter was null bc he literally just skipped skitter's posts, whereas you have a nullread on skitter for a very different reason). What there anything else about his reads that pinged you as town?

Pin

- So I am 4 games on this forum and this is the third with Pin. I have thought he was skum in every game I have played with him, and so far have yet to be correct. I am

putting him under Null because I am getting skummy vibes, but obv that has not worked out for me in the past

. The thing is that

I am getting skummy vibes because he is playing differently

than he has in the other games I have played with him. Normally way more involved, and pushing the game along. That could be because Math/TW are kind of driving the bus here, or not, so yeah.. for now Null.

Lots of hedging

Ruru

- Perfect amount of content for skum combined with the the content of that content. A little bit of the Game Set Up talk, a little bit of the rando joke around side content, some vote throws, and (what stood out to me) is just like lots of random questions. Not random I suppose, but questions that have been answered based on context of game or like ambiguous questions about general game play. They said this is their second game ever, so there could be that - but just a note from my POV, bc this site has so many ALTs, I disregard every player's "amount of games played posts".

Nah I believe she's telling the truth when she says this is her second game.

ofrhz

- So this is kind of my main spot at this point. Starting with the Vig shot concept from a while back "why wouldn't Vig shoot N1". Regardless of the correct play, I feel like looking like it from that perspective is

worried skum mindset

where as Town Mindset would be "Oh god what if I guessed wrong".


So yeah.

I don't see myself getting a Ruru train going rn based on everyone's posted standing

, so... VOTE: ofrhz

I'm not really seeing this? Someone brought up that vig is anti-town because a vig could just mis-fire on town, so I was trying to get at an optimal vig play here.

I kinda feel like you're going after me for being an easier mislynch than ruru.
VOTE: UglyDuck call it omgus, idgaf

not reading pedits lmao

Ok, the tinfoil hat theory is still on, but I'll leave it for another day. I got real reasons to believe that Drainth and Uglyduck are both scum, and if we want to lynch the ducks, then I'll focus in the ugly one

VOTE: Uglyduck

Normally i would say this is a set up post, but as you are voting for me doesn’t really make sense. Bur also your read is irrelevant bc i have only posted one thing lol. Misguided town or skum - idk. But overconfident this one is.