Gunner Mafia [Endgame]

[Gorkington]

im sorry we're not seeing eye to eye on panoptic spiff :/
i do think most of the rest of our reads are really really close though

[Brian Skies]

I kinda hope Pan flips town so I can laugh at you guys for letting Grey slip by. I guess if Pan flips scum then you guys get to do the opposite.

it's funny cause both are town


probably more likely Pan scum then Grey, i'd say

???

I'm not understanding why you felt the need to say the bottom line here if you think they're both town.

[GreyICE]

if the people pushing for a srceen lynch could make a case with points as to why hes scum other than "lol he is" then that would probably help too.
if someone's done that already then apologies (but im pretty sure nobody has)

p-edit: i think side-by-siding a greyTowngame vs a greyScumgame with here would make the tone argument irrelevant.

Well that would mirror the amount of effort and thought Screenplay has put into the game. He just drifts through the game asking questions. I'm not really impressed by the followup on any of them. Now maybe he's just ages behind this game like he claims, it's been a shitfest of spam and stupidity, but I'm fine with the people voting it, and fine with the general wagon.

I'd rather lynch either Hopkirk or Nero Cain, but I can't get people to cooperate with me for an easy scum lynch, so w/e.

[Brian Skies]

Who vig Maria?

Why did you ask this?

[Hopkirk]

Yes. The bit you crossed out is why I liked it. I'm not sure you can objectively like tone.
Specifically: Thor's attacking felt kind of nitpicky, already covered MariaR, and sticking to his Quick read seems more town than scum.

Why do you feel that Thor's nitpickiness is more likely to come from scum, but not Srceen's?

Also, I'm starting to get the feeling that your stance on Srceen has to do more with Thor than actually you having an objective read on Srceen (Thor did push both of you).

I also don't think Srceen's tone/attitude was warranted in relation to Thor. Why do you?

A couple of things I didn't like from Thor actually I've realized came from Screen due to how 1304 was formatted. Specifically where Screen says about Thor calling his playstyle anti-town/he can townlead. Thought Thor was trying to use rep there to attacking a null looking player. Turns out that didn't actually happen. I agree the tone from Screen there is bad.

Main reason from Thor (after removing the above) is that Screen isn't really different to multiple other slots that Thor isn't touching, but Screen has at least some good tone. Main difference seems that Screen was an easier push there.

[Nero Cain]

seriously a

"wow town is so dumb for not following grey is so scum lemme laugh at you guys"

is an awful wagon

holy misrep batman

[Hopkirk]

Also @Brian: Screen isn’t a hard townread- as shown by him being in the light town section on my readlists. I don’t get why you’re asking so many questions/pushing me to defend him.

@Pan: Most of my reasoning for you isn’t laid out. 1783 is where I started actively disliking you (in-game, not personally). It snowballed from there and I couldn’t be bothered making dozens of posts about what I disliked. Although I thought I did say more than I did. I haven’t really seen any attempt from you to engage with me either, so please don’t try and criticise me for that. 2893 was a rhetorical question yeah since it’s blatant misrepresentation- which I guess you agree with since you quoted a dozen posts contradicting it.

So your two issues with me are that
a.) I tunneled people who question me.
and
b.) I townread people who scumread me (Brian and Nero) after launching interactions with them.

That's inconsistent reasoning from here.

I'll agree that's inconsistant...if I'd said both of those things.
Can you quote where I expressed b) at any time? Because I'm pretty sure you're making that up because you're being daft and tunneled.

Not quoting that because whether Screen answered your question as you'd like isn't relevant to my read on him.

It's relevant to your tunneling making you a hypocrit.
WOuldn't you like to shove in my face that I'm wrong?
I'm literally setting up for you to either prove I'm wrong or to at least ask yourself why you're reading two things very differently (even though now you're having to change tune a bit since I gave you one example - another tunnel proof. Stop being narf.).

'You look like an opportunistic reactive to me.'
Is not a fully explained case.

So now it's not that I didn't describe the case, it's that I didn't provide examples (the only thing that case is missing) and it's a total drop of your claim that somehow by you responding last I didn't do something.
Do you see the issue here?
Sheep me on Srceen.

Must have been some other people who said B actually. Given you only just said A and B didn't happen, that still leaves the issue of your case being a single unexplained sentance.
You didn't descibe it or explain examples though?

You're right on Screen/you interactions which I misread. Screen's down to neutral to me right now.

[Chickadee]

The last few pages don't look good for GreyICE. I also went and read a bit of his early game, and I hate all of it. It reads really fake.

VOTE: GreyICE

[GreyICE]

Eh, if Hopkirk is saying that, then screen isn't a buddy.

Vote: Hopkirk

[Gorkington]

grey can you talk about what happened with your progression with maria/why you were initially so against the wagon and then considering voting for it?

[Hopkirk]

Eat shit, then.

It's clear from Hopkirk's interactions (or lack thereof with us) that his read on us is conjured from fucking thin air and randomly picked from a PoE pool because we're the lowest hanging lynch of the day.

-obserVed

I guess I'm better than I thought at identifying low hanging fruit since nobody else was pushing you when I started.

Interaction is a two way street. You were voting me first backed by saying two other people scumread me. When I voted you, despite your vote being unexplained, you immediately asked for reasons (the way you hadn't provided it). I said how I disliked your votecount and a specific post around when I voted you. You didn't try to interact with me on the scumread at any point. You've only become concerned with interacting with me now that my vote's been joined by others.

[Brian Skies]

Also @Brian: Screen isn’t a hard townread- as shown by him being in the light town section on my readlists. I don’t get why you’re asking so many questions/pushing me to defend him.

I'm trying to either get you to vote him or convince me that I'm wrong.

[GreyICE]

grey can you talk about what happened with your progression with maria/why you were initially so against the wagon and then considering voting for it?

I thought I was pretty clear. MariaR was scummy, but I'm not going to vote for a wagon when Elli shows up and goes "I have some stupid ass meta tell that I won't be explaining." That's not a way to play mafia, it's just fuckwittery.

[Nero Cain]

The last few pages don't look good for GreyICE. I also went and read a bit of his early game, and I hate all of it. It reads really fake.

VOTE: GreyICE

^

[Brian Skies]

Eh, if Hopkirk is saying that, then screen isn't a buddy.

Vote: Hopkirk

?

[Gorkington]

grey can you talk about what happened with your progression with maria/why you were initially so against the wagon and then considering voting for it?

I thought I was pretty clear. MariaR was scummy, but I'm not going to vote for a wagon when Elli shows up and goes "I have some stupid ass meta tell that I won't be explaining." That's not a way to play mafia, it's just fuckwittery.

so, you trust elli to read people correctly, but you didnt want to follow him out of principle of him not going into detail on it?
if you thought maria was scummy on top of what he was saying, isnt that kind of petty/anti wincon? especially to say that you were actively against voting the wagon initially?

[Hopkirk]

I kinda hope Pan flips town so I can laugh at you guys for letting Grey slip by. I guess if Pan flips scum then you guys get to do the opposite.

Any reason's for them being unlikely partners?

Pan's acting angry doesn't help town.

[GreyICE]

Hopkirk is downshifting for a vote switch to Screenplay. He's pretty flexible, and he knows there's only so many stupid townies in the game (even this one).

[Chickadee]

The last few pages don't look good for GreyICE. I also went and read a bit of his early game, and I hate all of it. It reads really fake.

VOTE: GreyICE

^

Is this you trying to point out how scummy I am, or asking for more GreyICE votes? I cant tell.

[GreyICE]

grey can you talk about what happened with your progression with maria/why you were initially so against the wagon and then considering voting for it?

I thought I was pretty clear. MariaR was scummy, but I'm not going to vote for a wagon when Elli shows up and goes "I have some stupid ass meta tell that I won't be explaining." That's not a way to play mafia, it's just fuckwittery.

so, you trust elli to read people correctly, but you didnt want to follow him out of principle of him not going into detail on it?
if you thought maria was scummy on top of what he was saying, isnt that kind of petty/anti wincon? especially to say that you were actively against voting the wagon initially?

I will never in a thousand years vote for a wagon where the leader of the wagon says it's because of some sekret tell and actively refuses to ever explain.

This isn't petty, it's common fucking sense. Otherwise this game degrades into a circle jerk of stupidity as no one ever explains anything and we all sit around and look like Epic Mafia. You don't need to be fucking Quick, but literally saying "here's nothing, do what I say" is never gonna happen.

[Nero Cain]

town getting mad is a thing, like I'm not saying that we should all townread Pan b/c of angry b/c that's easily faked amd scum could still legit be angry. It's null. It is, maybe a good reason that MS should consider handing out pacifiers.

[Hopkirk]

I played resistance last night.
Didn't really want to play.
but
I said I'm not looking at my card. Everyone blew me off except one person. He made a big deal about it. I called him out as scum. He was scum.

There's a pretty central mechanic that impossible if you mean what you sound like you mean. Please explain in your next post how you could play resistance without looking at your card.

[Nero Cain]

The last few pages don't look good for GreyICE. I also went and read a bit of his early game, and I hate all of it. It reads really fake.

VOTE: GreyICE

^

Is this you trying to point out how scummy I am, or asking for more GreyICE votes? I cant tell.

I'm saying that I agree with your reason to vote Grey.

[Hopkirk]

I played resistance last night.
Didn't really want to play.
but
I said I'm not looking at my card. Everyone blew me off except one person. He made a big deal about it. I called him out as scum. He was scum.

There's a pretty central mechanic that impossible if you mean what you sound like you mean. Please explain in your next post how you could play resistance without looking at your card.

If anyone else tries to answer this then they're lockscum to me.
If it's not answered in Screen's next post I'm switching to a wagon that half of my scumreads support.

[Nero Cain]

I will never in a thousand years vote for a wagon where the leader of the wagon says it's because of some sekret tell and actively refuses to ever explain.

This isn't petty, it's common fucking sense. Otherwise this game degrades into a circle jerk of stupidity as no one ever explains anything and we all sit around and look like Epic Mafia. You don't need to be fucking Quick, but literally saying "here's nothing, do what I say" is never gonna happen.

I'm town and Tchill is prob town too so at the very least your reads are just really bad but if Maria was "scummy" and that wagon was gaining steam and momentum over me/tchill it just feels very hedgy is all. I guess there'd no point in really talking with scum so eh...