Open 728: Sharing is Caring (GAME OVER)

[the worst]

oh. yes. I am bored.

[the worst]

the most natural conversation stirrer itt is the mod.
fuuuu

[northsidegal]

Like we're 15 pages in and I just kinda feel like nothing happened and I'm bored

Like I need RC flaming me or something so I can get into the game more

I feel like you were experiencing this too at least a few pages ago

i mean, with the exception of the worst, everyone on the lower tier of my list in 211 is also among the lower half when it comes to postcount.

i guess i've been going more for the "sit back and wait for scum to out themselves", but i can try to switch that up if it'll be more effective. just give me a second.

[northsidegal]

First order of business:

Blackstar voters, justify yourself.

I'm feeling pretty good about blackstar being town here. He's definitely going against the seeming "consensus opinion", but i fail to see where the "scum" part of that comes in. In fact, it's the opposite to me – he really doesn't seem to be concerned all that much with his own appearance. His thoughts and votes get him scumread, but they all feel totally real to me. I think a good example of what i'm trying to say is in his entrance with the vote on zoronos. as seen from the reactions it was definitely an "against the grain" move, but again, it all felt like completely real things that he actually thought:

Spoiler:

Wow, I didn't expect the game to start today

VOTE: zoronos

why zoronos?

His posts are too long

His posts are too long

We're not in RVS anymore...

It feels like he's trying too hard even though nothing has happened

It just feels artificial to me for some reason

'kay

BlackStar - let’s chat. Is there an opinion of mine you disagree with or that is confusing which I can clarify for you?

No, you brought up some good points. You just give off a weird vibe. It's like someone thought about the ideal way for a town member to post and then designed a program that wrote posts like that for them. Just doesn't feel right

and, reading the thread myself, i can

see

where his thought is coming from.


i get a strange feeling that blackstar could be sorted pretty realiably using a spreadsheet (math probably knows what i'm talking about), but just on his play here i'm feeling pretty good about him being town.

[the worst]

pretty much read his early game as busywork and thought his vote on me was terrible

I'm kinda coming around to town!BStar tbh just not sure where to start next

[the worst]

how confident are you in scum!ofrhz? I'm starting to feel like I might be being stupid.

[northsidegal]

@Other Open 721-ers

Thoughts on ofhrz here as compared to last game? Correct me if i'm wrong, but from what i remember in both of the games i've played with him people just considered him obviously town – obviously town to the point where i don't think i've ever really expended that much effort trying to read him, i just wrote him off as town.

Is the fact that i can't really write him off as town yet meaningful?

Elli-tell still seems valid here as well. He really hasn't been much of a presence so far – i should go back and check open 721 and 1859's early game postcount there to compare. (this is something math might want to do / have done already as well)

[northsidegal]

how confident are you in scum!ofrhz? I'm starting to feel like I might be being stupid.

i'm not anywhere near confident yet, but he's definitely got my attention.

this is kind of why i was doing the "taking it slow" route, because i'm not sure how much my making all of this clear will change his behavior such that it'd be unreadable, but i think doing this is necessary for the gamestate right now at the very least.

[northsidegal]

pretty much read his early game as busywork and thought his vote on me was terrible

What about compared to hitalt's vote?

What's your read on hitalt right now?

[the worst]

HitAlt is pretty null for me. he doesn't really ~feel~ scummy but I'm also having some issues parsing the trajectory and reasoning behind his reads.

GTH ofrhz seems similar to open 721 here. in reality I should go reread some.

[ruru]

this is kind of why i was doing the "taking it slow" route, because i'm not sure how much my making all of this clear will change his behavior such that it'd be unreadable, but i think doing this is necessary for the gamestate right now at the very least.

Yeah, this is like precisely one of the reasons why the game is awful

[pinturicchio]

@Other Open 721-ers

Thoughts on ofhrz here as compared to last game? Correct me if i'm wrong, but from what i remember in both of the games i've played with him people just considered him obviously town – obviously town to the point where i don't think i've ever really expended that much effort trying to read him, i just wrote him off as town.

Is the fact that i can't really write him off as town yet meaningful?

Elli-tell still seems valid here as well. He really hasn't been much of a presence so far – i should go back and check open 721 and 1859's early game postcount there to compare. (this is something math might want to do / have done already as well)

ofrhz was mislynched on D1 in that game. I see no difference so far

[northsidegal]

this is kind of why i was doing the "taking it slow" route, because i'm not sure how much my making all of this clear will change his behavior such that it'd be unreadable, but i think doing this is necessary for the gamestate right now at the very least.

Yeah, this is like precisely one of the reasons why the game is awful

?

because people are lurking or because of my strategy?

[ruru]

Because I think your strategy is kind of optimal

[pinturicchio]

Now about the misunderstanding: no I don't think jjh was trying to redirect heat off himself, 'cause I don't think there was heat on himself in the first place. What I find ironic is that, by saying that about NSG, NSG went full bananas on him but either way, about redirecting heat... I don't think that's a treat only scum has; town doesn't want to be the center of attention either. Town doesn't care that much maybe, but from my point of view, I try to analyze this things in a way like "is this relevant to my read on this player? If yes, why; if no, read something else". jjh's motivation is a no, first 'cause there's not enough evidence to think anything about that post, and second 'cause even if he was trying to derail attention, I wouldn't know how to read that

I personally think this was a damning thing so let's discuss. What does town jjh get from redirecting this off of himself now? I do feel he had a small bit of pressure after somewhat of a flaming start. As if he didn't want attraction to divert from him as much as from his content... Do you see what I'm saying or am I seeing this wrong? Also I'd find this more excusable if it were an actual wagon but it's RVS

HWS I think the same thing you're asking is answered in the same post you're quoting. If you react badly at pressure either as town or scum, then you don't want to be pressured 'cause either you're being mislynched or caught, that's like... The definition of NAI. But I said the same thing that you're saying: I don't think he was redirecting anything 'cause there was no "anything" in the first place

[northsidegal]

Because I think your strategy is kind of optimal

solution: lynch all lurkers

[ruru]

Worked for me last game

[northsidegal]

Because I think your strategy is kind of optimal

solution: lynch all lurkers

i'm only half-joking with this, by the way. if we want to use the "let scum incriminate themselves" strategy, then naked voting lurkers up to a decently sized wagon serves to get them to post more while also not necessarily revealing the reasons behind a scumread.

[northsidegal]

how does mhsmith put it? sort by postcount, become werewolf expert?

[pinturicchio]

I feel like I should dump my thoughts from my discussion with Pintu, but they’re still a bit jumbly. So, bear with me.

I think Pintu is seeing the evidence completely differently than I am. At first I wanted to call that scummy, but if I had one word to describe our discussion, that word would be “reasonable”. He never got incensed or frustrated, or called me scummy for leaning on him, he just calmly explained his position and why he disagreed with me.
I don’t really like his predicates, but he was very insist on their validity, and he took those predicates to a reasonable place. I can see how he got from A to B, even if I disagree with A. He didn’t bow or give an inch in his discussion, while remaining willing to engage it.

My gut says that’s towny but I struggle to clearly explain why or specifically what parts of our discussion made me feel towny on him. Maybe that he’s playing highly cooperatively?

Sorry for the mess, but that’s where I ended up. I wish I could have ended up at a ‘yeah, got the scum!, but that would be stretching for a conclusion I wanted instead of the conclusion I think the evidence points towards. I think my initial scum lean was wrong.

Zoronos I think me being cooperative with you started because I am townreading you (you remember my first towngame in this place), and even if we got different conclusions, I now got a townread on you, and that's good. What I don't get is why were you scumleaning/reading me in the first place; you started asking me questions before seeing that our conclusions were different, so what was first, the duckling or the egg?

[pinturicchio]

@NSG you're pretty talkative in this game compared to all the other games I've played with you. Wanna jam?

[northsidegal]

@NSG you're pretty talkative in this game compared to all the other games I've played with you. Wanna jam?

i'm not exactly sure what that implies, but i think i'm probably okay with it.

[pinturicchio]

I mean let's talk. You usually don't talk too much, you just give your reads, but here you're talking, and I want to talk with you 'cause you have good early reads.

[Zoronos]

Zoronos I think me being cooperative with you started because I am townreading you (you remember my first towngame in this place), and even if we got different conclusions, I now got a townread on you, and that's good. What I don't get is why were you scumleaning/reading me in the first place; you started asking me questions before seeing that our conclusions were different, so what was first, the duckling or the egg?

Did I not explain that? I thought I explained that.
You launched into PR-talk / setup discussion before giving out reads, and your volume-of-posting early was focused there initially instead of the other posters. Basically it was the first place you enthusiastically engaged the thread (short posts vs long posts). Same for MathDino. I recall the_worst and HitAlt said something like it's not out of character for you and Mathdino, so I figured I'd lean in slowly rather than going full bore.

Contrast ruru who started the setup discussion but was simultaneously giving reads.
I could have sworn I explained this. If I didn't my apologies.

[pinturicchio]

@NSG you're pretty talkative in this game compared to all the other games I've played with you. Wanna jam?

i'm not exactly sure what that implies, but i think i'm probably okay with it.

Interested in if your jjh read progressed and in a Mathdino read