Mini 2018 - American Presidents Mafia (Game Over)

[brassherald]

"In the Affairs of this World Men are saved, not by Faith, but by the Lack of it."

Votecount 1.17

Gamma Emerald(5)

~ Mathdino, Shoshin, Not_Mafia, Gustavo, the worst

Momrangal(3)

~ skitter30, Bernie Sanders, Nauci

Bernie Sanders(2)

~ Keyser Söze, Momrangal

Not_Mafia(1)

~ Gamma Emerald


Not Voting (2): Errantparabola, Irrelephant11,

With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch.

Day 1 deadline is in (expired on 2018-07-04 17:10:00)

[Gustavo]

Nauci, earlier you were concerned at a lack of counter. There seems to have been an attempt for a Bernie one and now a momgral one.

So how do you feel now that there have been attempts made? I do have to read how you did a 180 on mom because I’m pretty sure you had him as town earlier.

[Gustavo]

i don't understand why it's super hard to make a mom wagon a thing t

Cause there is a perfectly viable scum wagon on gamma. People trying to push a counter are suspicious

[Gustavo]

ok, let's try it this way. given that you scumread them both independantly what do you think of the fact that shoshin is pushing a gamma lynch right now?

I’m ok with it. I’m the only one scum reading him apparently so I could be wrong. He also could just be bussing for town cred.

[Gustavo]

um, no, the the entire point of the game is to figure out which of the two it is; atm i think it's the latter from the complacent gamestate

There is no way to know for sure. I think he’s scum so I’ve “figured it out”

[Nauci]

WRT momrangal, I've done more like a 45° and back. I went from having a bad gut feel from a few posts that pinged me (see my ISO) to voting to try and figure it out to rereading her ISO because several people were defending her as town and seeing town!mom as plausible so unvoting before I went to bed last night. But town!mom being plausible isn't nearly good enough and I'd like to see more here.

WRT counter wagons, I feel like the momrangal wagon is composed of town and people are either fully inactive or not jumping on the chance to get pressure off of gamma, but that I haven't waited for enough people to get the opportunity to read which of those two it is. Mom is voting Bernie but most town seem to town read him plus inactivity so I see why a wagon isn't building there (yet?).

The whole point is that if Gamma is scum, people would have been suspiciously trying to push counter wagons instead of sitting around contentedly waiting for the "inevitable" lynch to happen (while on or off the wagon itself). Half the people who cased Gamma aren't voting there but the quiet people we've been FOSing for inactivity are, so it's a weird spot where there's a good case against Gamma but also a ton of potential for opportunistic scum votes. The mom wagon is a result of these worries driving us to do more due diligence. Of course, scum could be inactive or giving up on Gamma or even bussing but it's my first game in a long time w/o competing wagons by end of day 1, and usually unchallenged ones were mislynches (a hard lesson after I drove a couple of those wagons).

We're back to Keyser's question from early in the day: does Scum!shosh hard bus? Because this is a pretty active and loud push from her and she's plenty active enough to take advantage of a counter wagon on Bernie or Mom or even starting one on me from the ill-timed optics of the quasi-Gamma-defense. I am very paranoid about Shoshin so I sit and question potential motives for her actions constantly but unless she's playing 12d chess I dont' see why she would do half of the things she has done, even when I disagree with them a lot.

The lie you say you caught her in didn't hold water because she said she frequently blank votes (not always) and she did that in her game. You can't say she lied because she sometimes explained unless she said she *always* blank votes or she explained almost every vote.

[Gustavo]

IMO "wait why would you town read me here" posts are towny; not accepting someone's town read of you and making them cough up a reason is scum hunting just as if it is with any other town read on any other player. That might be, to me, his most town post on a very short list of them.

I’ve done this very thing as scum. It’s literally the easiest thing to fake.

[Nauci]

Okay taking a 2 hr nap before boot camp but first week will be super intense 11 hr days so

officially LA through Friday the 6th

[brassherald]

Okay taking a 2 hr nap before boot camp but first week will be super intense 11 hr days so

officially LA through Friday the 6th

Noted.

Additionally, lease be aware that there will not be any further extensions to day 1. I believe even with the replace outs, 12 days should be enough time especially considering the impending changes to deadlines in the newbie queue.

[Irrelephant11]

VOTE: Gamma Emerald
My fav wagon in the running, and we need a lynch

That’s L-1

[Not_Mafia]

VOTE: Gamma Emerald

[Keyser Söze]

The easy lynch but maybe the right lynch for today (info wise).

[the worst]

more importantly it flips red

[the worst]

fake hammer tho

[Keyser Söze]

Good, let’s use the dayphase extension then.
Probably 2-3 players who owe us content.

[the worst]

valuable ~56 hours for sure.

[Gamma Emerald]

VOTE: Not_Mafia
so my second game I checked wrt NM was 3-in-1 and in the first game at the very least he was pretty present, and he was town in all 3 games of 3-in-1. So I'm thinking he's scum here. the other game I checked, the earthbound game I modded, he was very active though flavor interest may very well have been the main reason, as he was very excited about it as I remember it.

I’ve never played Earthbound

wat
you were like super into that game, how can you not have played earthbound

[the worst]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... 0#p9985240

perfect

[Gamma Emerald]

The only people who really commit to PL’s on me are the noobs and the desperate, and Gamma ain’t no noob

problem is it isn't a PL
glgl

[Gamma Emerald]

In post 1401, Gamma Emerald wrote:
So thinking about it NM inactivity might be NAI? This isn't anywhere near solid fyi


following up on this with a vote on him after nauci votes there is meh

this is taking things out of context quite a bit

[Gamma Emerald]

I can't sit on an NM vote because Gamma chased me on that one

It feels so gross from him. One of the few things that I had as a Gamma town point was the vanity the_worst vote because it seemed like conviction to go after a dead wagon versus hopping on a convenient counter wagon

Like I'm glad I made the NM vote because one of my hesitations with the gamma wagon was that I didn't see scum hopping on counter wagon opportunities, and that vote helped dispel those feels

UNVOTE:

Give me some time to figure out where I want to press at this point because it's exasperating that we're running a ~7 player game with Skitter/shosh/gamma/Irrelephant/Gus/the worst/myself close to deadline

Okay everyone saying "gamma followed nauci" can eat it. I had my own logic for my vote which I know I posted. Actually read the game tia.

[Gamma Emerald]

I forgot to address this, there's a couple things I think are important

I have lots of reasons to vote Gamma besides everyone else being more town.

For starters, he spent the majority of the day laying low and offering a couple safe reads on Key and Stun. Yes, he offered the occassional commentary (e.g. 318) but there's no in-depth analysis of alignments.

570 is a scummy I'm-not-town post; questioning Key here doesn't make much sense from a town perspective.

571 feels like a bullshit excuse for not having the excitement he would have had as town.

1109 and 1110 seem like someone who knows Gustavo is town rather than someone who's reading him genuinely. And the follow-up in 1140 feels opportunistic.

Then he starts playing the game a bit more actively since he's under pressure but keeps going after easy targets - eventually votes the worst, keeps talking about NM as null but now he's voting NM.

you're not looking very deep at what 570 means. As far as I could tell Key was scumreading me. So for him to challenge a scumread on me was kinda strange. also as I post this I realize Keyser fencesitting on my slot might actually be a scum thing.
wrt 1109/1110 and 1140, I was thinking "alright, he is being stubborn, why don't I try to reason with him". When he didn't give any indication he wanted to fix anything about his read, I gave up and wrote him of as scum.
Also that's great and all giving a case, but my question still stands about who the hell you think my partners are if everyone else looks more town.

[Gamma Emerald]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... 0#p9985240

perfect

ta-da the duck gets it
though I have to question why he called out the fake hammer

[Shoshin]

I have lots of ideas about who Gamma's partners are but it's not something I feel like talking about at this moment.

[Gamma Emerald]

I have lots of ideas about who Gamma's partners are but it's not something I feel like talking about at this moment.

Too bad. You opened the can of worms now you have to justify yourself. Also really convenient you opt to not talk about it when my lynch is only one vote away and at that point you can just flake the day out.