Mini 2018 - American Presidents Mafia (Game Over)

[Nauci]

And most others obviously seem to disagree with your premises

I don’t care if poeple agree with them. I can’t control what I find scummy. That’s why I abandoned my sho push. I really regret doing it but that’s the thing people hate about my play so I adapted to please people. It sucks for me but that’s how I get better supposedly. It’s not working

Well you should care, because theoretically your premises are facts and people are saying they are incorrect.

Whether or not Shoshin explained all of her reads or just some of them in the game you mentioned seems to be a fact, not an opinion, and multiple people have pointed out that it was the latter and therefore not inconsistent with this game.

[skitter30]

VOTE: Gustavo

i'm *pretty* sure he's town

i'm also just not reading his posts tbh right now; it's making my life easier

i'll re-evaluate later if necessary but since i don't have like any townreads i'm fine doing this for today

and yeah i have nothing to say really about the 1.5 page argument between gus, irrelephant, and nauci. i think gus is getting scumread for playstyle reasons but i'm pretty sure he isn't being duplicitous or fake; he actually believes msot of what he's saying imo even though i think it's wrong.

like it's too aggressively stubborn to come from scum imo

i don't think arguing with him is going to actually like accomplish anything or make him change his mind and/or playstyle

--

I think gamma played awful here ad made it very hard to read him and I even can usually reliably sort him (though towards the end, it was partially a matter that he was claimed VT and I was slightly worried of an certain outside risk of deadline flash wagon momrangal VLA even if I scumread her more).

i still think your progression from acknowledging the many warning signs about the wagon and stating that you don't think anything he was doing had scum motivation to hammering him was atrocious

--

I was probably the n2 NK target

i mean, timetraveling seems to be a pretty neat ability for a mafia game, so do tell

i really kinda doubt you were the nk target last night tbh

--

"Skittz and NSG should know why I don't like Gem"
Citing Skittz and NSG to back up his (meta?) suspicion of Gamma.

gem is gemini (duckling), not gamma; he was talking about newbie 1872 which i played with gemini and math and nsg was apparently following; i know nothing about gamma and don't think i've ever played with im before

--

Well I feel like I was obviously talking to the people who did town read him so lol I don't think that was necessary

I was kinda vote parking while I figured out which stone I wanted to check under

Here seems decent while I still don't have time to catch up

VOTE: the worst

ok we can do this too

VOTE: the worst

--

okay, so basically all of my reasons for not liking you or Mom were detailed in my ISO and I know you asked me about what I meant about dancing around your scumreads but I really dont want to go back and figure out what i was talking about. It was def an error on my part for not being more specific but, uh, let's just say we're cool in that department and call it even. yeah. shrug

i mean, ok?

--

@scum please for the love of god push a better wagon
I have a bit of a theory forming but I'm sad ;(

you've done literally nothing townie since replacing in

[the worst]

yikes there's prolly 2 scum on my wagon

pushing a cw this hard makes me think Mom is probably the third

[Keyser Söze]

As i get ready for bed and to wake up in like 5 hrs..

Doing full catch up monday, no nk is something worth looking ar

I thought about this, but decided against it as it could expose a bulletproof townie, roleblocker, doctor, jailkeeper, hider or commuter too early. It wouldn’t even guarantee that the supposed target was town so not worth looking at D2 IMO.

[Gustavo]

Pretty certain I know who Gustavo is

You’re wrong

[Gustavo]

antagonistic way

Say what?

[Gustavo]

Well you should care, because theoretically your premises are facts and people are saying they are incorrect.

No people are just saying they don’t agree with me, my premises are in fact correct

[Gustavo]

Whether or not Shoshin explained all of her reads or just some of them in the game you mentioned seems to be a fact, not an opinion, and multiple people have pointed out that it was the latter and therefore not inconsistent with this game.

Shoshin’s entire reaction to my posts and then shading me because “I should know this is how she plays” or whatever the exact phrase was when this game is drastically different then that game is a huge problem for me. Even if she is town here, I don’t see why she would say that to me when her play was drastically different. She refused to work with me and refused to explain why she voted. She wasn’t being transparent with me nor was she showing a willingness to work together. So everyone else can defend her all they want, but to me that interaction should never come from town. Her posts were scummy as f to me and I just can’t ignore it no matter how many people disagree with it.

Nobody can tell me how that attitude and blatant misrep (since nobody wants to call it a lie) is town mentality and because of that, I can’t listen to anyone’s opinion anymore.

I’ll jist play my game, push my people, and compromise when I have to.

Let’s take today for example. Shoshin abandoned his vote to vote me because I just happened to vote the same person as them. Why does that even matter? Why does that make me a good vote? It doesn’t. Shos isn’t trying to find scum imo.

[Gustavo]

VOTE: Stungun

No reason for this. Stun had just voted nauci and given how hard nauci has been defending sho, I could easily see them scum together and this was a chainsaw vote. It makes sense sho didn’t want to explain it.

VOTE: Nauci

This vote is weird. No reason for it and math just voted there.

VOTE: Gustavo

Voted me because I was pressuring her. Basically omgus

VOTE: Gustavo

Unvotes me after I proved she misrepped me (blatantly lied imo)

VOTE: Gamma

No reason....

So far this game is nothing like her town game she tried to say was similar to the one we played.

VOTE: Key

No reasons...

VOTE: Gustavo

Voted me because I voted the same person as she did.

What’s the difference? I gave reasons for my vote. She didn’t.

There is zero scum hunting in her votes. There is zero transparency, there is zero signs of teamwork.

I’m done discussing it anymore. She’s fucking scum or a really really terrible town player and her play this game is drastically different than the town game I played with her.

VOTE: shos

Peace out.

[Shoshin]

Alright, fine. Gustavo is town.

VOTE: Skitter

[skitter30]

yikes there's prolly 2 scum on my wagon

pushing a cw this hard makes me think Mom is probably the third

oh ffs

who, pray tell, are the two scum on your wagon? your options are me, nauci, and errant. this also isn't exactly a hard counterwagon

also you do realize that i was scumreading her yesterday for being gamma's counterwagon, and when i pointed that out repeatedly, you persisted in townreading her, so using this exact same reasoning to scumread her today when you happen to be the counterwagon is sketchy as fuck

--

Alright, fine. Gustavo is town.

VOTE: Skitter

because ... ?

[skitter30]

also i just wish to say i got post 1776 in american presidents mafia

[Irrelephant11]

Yeah shoshin I’d like to know the reasoning for that vote too, I’m not seeing Skitter scum rn

[Errantparabola]

yikes there's prolly 2 scum on my wagon

pushing a cw this hard makes me think Mom is probably the third

Vote was mostly frivolous before this but now it is mostly real

antagonistic way

Say what?

Maybe that wasnt the right word, its like.... eh never mind i can just grab some posts when i’m off my phone

[Shoshin]

Why is Skitter definitely town, Irrelephant?

[Errantparabola]

Shoshin what are your thoughts on the worst and the ppl voting him

[brassherald]

I've been sleeping most of the day, I'll be doing a Votecount tonight. Sorry for that.

[Shoshin]

Shoshin what are your thoughts on the worst and the ppl voting him

Skitter's vote was pretty bad.

[Irrelephant11]

Why is Skitter definitely town, Irrelephant?

She’s not? Just more likely town than scum imo

Didn’t vote Gamma, has believable thought processes

Oh yeah and she shaded me when I joined her on Mom for reasons that I don’t think scum would think of. On mobile rn but that was less than five pages back iirc. She thought my move was scummy but didn’t try to turn momentum against me, just showed wariness like concerned town trying to discern the quality of their own vote would.

[Nauci]

Still skimming really hard but still feeling Gus is town

I moved Shoshin to null at beginning of day because I realized I was giving her tons of credit for the replies she has provoked from others and maybe the thought processes I attributed to her needed revaluation if I'm disagreeing with so many fundamental aspects of the game.

I voted tw for now because "move off math" is yet another look-busy

[Nauci]

Oops accidentally hit submit while trying to edit

It was another "look busy" post without contributing much post

There have been more since but I don't have time to read d2 yet T_T

[brassherald]

BlackVoid replaces Mathdino.

[Errantparabola]

But you called her “defo town” in an earlier post. I only remember this cause you also called me defo town and that made me feel good about myself

[Errantparabola]

Whats next man? Are you gonna take back your town read on me too?!?! Next thing you know shoshins asking you “why is errant defo town” and youll be all like “haha what I never said that”
I cant play these games with you any more!!!

[BlackVoid]

Hi guys! I was spectating the game but was skimming pretty hard. So, I'll give it a thorough read-through. I'm going to do something different here and actually post walls of quotes responding to everything I find notable and then post a list of my reads in the end. I think it'll help me process the game faster. Also, I have to leave for work in around 3.5 hours but I have the day off tomorrow so that's when I'll do the bulk of it.