Newbie 1881 - Game Over

[nancy]

Iceman, your vote doesn't need to be on someone for you to be pushing them.

[Quick]

Trinity is creeping up on me as being Scummy now. It seems whenever Trinity is asked something, they completely disappear. Very suspect.

@nancy, what do you mean when you say I am not doing anything? I feel like I have been pushing my SRs just fine, offering my reasoning on why I TR the people I do. What do you want from me?

[Quick]

VOTE: iceman

ill leave it here because i have no idea what you would want to policy lynch an IC and simultaneously compliment them

I don't like this vote from you Oka. Iceman is a newbie and he is going to have some newbie ideas. I remember the days of my first few games and I thought that I was going to change the world. I was going to make people play the game the way I thought it should be best played. I was going to lynch people to make them active and to make them change their evil ways by leading lynches on them no matter what. The idea that an IC shouldnt last very long in the game isn't without merit. Think about it. If IC is town they are the best player for town because of experience, scum will want to kill them to try and deny town their best player. If IC is scum they are never going to be killed if everyone just town reads the IC because they are teaching the game.

Most of the time getting to lynch an IC before endgame doesn't happen because scum kills them early, but when you think about it an IC playing late into the game is something to be suspect about. I don't think that there are many scum teams out there playing the long con with the IC and getting away with it, ya know?

Ugh. I hate this post. The idea put forth in this post is so very very bad. You don't lynch people because of their title, you lynch them because they are Scum, period.

[Micc]

Votecount 1.19

OkaPoka (3) -

IcemanCh, WhyMafia, Formerfish

Formerfish (1) -

Quick

TrinityNZ (1) -

OkaPoka

WhyMafia (1) -

Flicker

Not Voting (3) -

Eragon, TrinityNZ, nancy

With 9 players alive it takes 5 votes to lynch.

The deadline for Day 1 is in (expired on 2018-07-23 11:49:57).

Prodding Eragon.

[Quick]

it's not the pagecount and number of posts that makes it slow its the lack of scumhunting and wagon forming which im at fault for but nonetheless its giving a slow impression

Lack of scum hunting? Its day 1 and we are on page, what, 8? We are still very much in the feeling each other out stage for anyone to have really strong feelings about wanting to hang anyone. Shit we can have hunches and we can have inklings, but if you are looking for a full blown case this early then you are scum and need to die.

Also, at you talking about the lack of wagons forming when you commented on not wanting to join the one on flicker and would rather do your own thing over there.

So many things wrong with this post...

You should be Scum hunting regardless of what Day it is, for one.

Wanting wagons to form and not wanting to be on ANY wagon isn't a contradiction, seriously.

[TrinityNZ]

Trinity is creeping up on me as being Scummy now. It seems whenever Trinity is asked something, they completely disappear. Very suspect.

@nancy, what do you mean when you say I am not doing anything? I feel like I have been pushing my SRs just fine, offering my reasoning on why I TR the people I do. What do you want from me?

Hey Quick, I mentioned before you arrived that I’m in a different time zone, so usually do disappear when most other people are on. I usually get around to answering questions the next time I’m on.

[TrinityNZ]

Trinity, please answer my questions for you?

Sorry Nancy, I’m just not having much time on here at the moment due to family reasons, but I promise I’ll do it tonight (my time), so in a few hours.

[TrinityNZ]

@Trinity, when you have the chance, please talk about why you posted 1008, please, in as much detail as possible, talk about your FF read and your Oka read and how both of those reads have evolved for you over the course of the day so far, and please talk about who think is mafia right now and why.

Ok, so I think that post was a mistake as I didn’t put a comment or reply on it. I use an iPad or phone so unfortunately do make a lot of mistakes.

In relation to FF, I started off thinking he wasn’t being the same FF I knew from my previous game, where I’d thought he was more aggressive. When I did an iso, I saw that he had been more aggressive than I’d given him credit for, so withdrew my SR.

In relation to Oka, first of all I thought - he must be scum trying to get a mislynch because I know I am town and so how could he possibly be trying to make a case against me? And he kept at it. So I thought he must be Mafia. The I had a kind of a light bulb moment where I thought, if I am lynched, everyone will see straight away that I’m town. And then, you will be looking back through the day 1 posts, and you would see tha Oka was on my case relentlessly for some time. This wouldn’t look good for Oka, as he would be seen as scum immediately. So, I thought, nobody is that stupid, so therefore, Oka is town. So that’s where I currently am.

Hope this answers your questions and makes sense as I’ve had a few wines

[nancy]

You left out the last part: please talk about who you think is mafia right now and why.

[nancy]

Trinity is creeping up on me as being Scummy now. It seems whenever Trinity is asked something, they completely disappear. Very suspect.

@nancy, what do you mean when you say I am not doing anything? I feel like I have been pushing my SRs just fine, offering my reasoning on why I TR the people I do. What do you want from me?

Point to a question that Trinity hasn't answered and explain why activity is alignment indicative.

I don't think you have been doing those things. Your push on FF, moreover, is basically just you saying that FF is full of shit and calling him scummy.

[TrinityNZ]

You left out the last part: please talk about who you think is mafia right now and why.

That’s hard, I really don’t know right now, I’m confused.

[nancy]

You left out the last part: please talk about who you think is mafia right now and why.

That’s hard, I really don’t know right now, I’m confused.

It's okay if you're not sure. Just give it your best shot.

Here is everyone alive:
IcemanCh
Eragon
WhyMafia
Flicker
TrinityNZ
Quick
OkaPoka
Formerfish
nancy

Start with which people you think are town, then put them aside, and look at who is left.

You don't have to have a super confident scumread or anything like that. But from your perspective, if you're town, you absolutely need to lynch someone today, and you want that person to be mafia. So you have to figure this out. Who do you want to lynch?

[nancy]

I think your reads have been pretty wishy-washy. Your Eragon read is the only one that I've seen you really stick to. It's not the worst thing in the world to be wishy-washy. You replaced in not very long ago, you're still getting a feel for the game, sure, I get it. That does need to change at some point, though.

Meh. I can see how you think that. Re-reading what I said does give that impression, and my insistence on Eragon reflects my confidence in that read. The only other players who I'm think confident about are you and Ice as town. And I didn't really think I needed to elaborate on them, but will gladly do so

@WhyMafia why didn't you follow up on this?

[nancy]

Well I went over my unaligned reads for Oka and I have Trinity and Iceman as pretty strongly unaligned with him, and Trinity also clear from spew (kinda think he may have TMI'd her townflip in 1056). FF/Oka isn't the likeliest team but I don't think I would rule them out entirely. He's clearly insane enough as a player that I don't really trust myself to read him for this kind of thing as much as I might for someone else.

I don't really have any other antialignments on him that mean anything.

There are some nebulous things that whisper the name Eragon when I think about who his most likely partner is but that's also the part of me that wants to invoke rule of 3 on his Trinity/Iceman/Eragon thing so lol.

[nancy]

actually you can lynch me today

i think whymafia can stand up to yall

Also, this is certainly a post.

Lmao.

[nancy]

Trinity, you really really really really need to respond to 1136 and talk about who you want to and don't want to lynch today.

[WhyMafia]

I think your reads have been pretty wishy-washy. Your Eragon read is the only one that I've seen you really stick to. It's not the worst thing in the world to be wishy-washy. You replaced in not very long ago, you're still getting a feel for the game, sure, I get it. That does need to change at some point, though.

Meh. I can see how you think that. Re-reading what I said does give that impression, and my insistence on Eragon reflects my confidence in that read. The only other players who I'm think confident about are you and Ice as town. And I didn't really think I needed to elaborate on them, but will gladly do so

@WhyMafia why didn't you follow up on this?

I’ve been super busy the last few days, my apologies. I’ll get it out today

[Eragon]

I’ll be able to respond later tonight and have about an hour hopefully

Ask me questions/suggestions in the meantime so I can have a focus later on

[Flicker]

I speed read back through the thread from my second-to-last post (on page 35 or so? Seriously, y'all are killing me here. I may need to stick to geriatrics after this.) to catch-up, and this is all the stuff I found to respond to. Let me know if I missed anything.

Elaboration on my WhyMafia read in the next post.

First off, I don't know if this is an IC question or just an experienced MS player question, but in my first newbie game, after we ran a VT up to L-1 and they claimed, one player said/strongly implied that since there'd already been a claim, we should go ahead and lynch them rather than running up someone else and having them claim. Otherwise, if their claims were true, we'd be helping scum PR hunt. I disagreed with this logic because I think it's most important to lynch scum, and if you really think someone is town you shouldn't vote for them.

@Everyone, but especially experienced MS players

What do you think about the above? Both in general, and in relation to Oka in this game?

@nancy

I geniunely don't know what you want from me at this point, but in the interest of not spending a lot of time on anything, I won't go over the rest of your big, spoilered post point by point.

Also, since both you and Iceman mentioned it: I wasn't intending for my post to be an AtE, in fact I was trying to avoid that, but if that's how it came off, I get your reaction to that. But don't worry, by the time I posted I'd cooled down, I was just trying to be transparent. (I guess maybe I'm trying to be too transparent, or being transparent about the wrong things? I'll work on that.)

@Eragon

, sorry, I don't think I'm gonna be able to give you the more detailed post after all. Like you, I'm also struggling to keep up, and also my reads have changed since then, so it would be a lot of work for not a lot of reward. I'll just give an updated reads list, and if you (or anyone else) want me to elaborate on it, let me know.

Town: Nancy (Not that Oka's seeds of doubt haven't affected me, but I don't have anything strong to reevaluate this read with, and probably won't until D2.)
Town-lean: Formerfish (same reasons as before), IcemanCh (same reasons as before), Oka (I don't necessarily like who Oka's pushing, but I like the pushes themselves, if that makes sense?)
Town/null: Eragon, TrinityNZ (basically the same reasons as before for both)
Null: N/A
Scum/null: WhyMafia (see next post), Quick (agree with FF's observations/pushes)
Scum-lean: N/A
Scum: N/A

P-edit:

@Eragon

Gun to your head, who would you vote for now?

[Flicker]

UNVOTE: WhyMafia

I had a sort of half-baked theory about scum partners, so I partly voted to test out the reactions to that, but I didn't get the reactions I was expecting, and WhyMafia did a couple things that close to 100% disprove my theory (I won't say what it was now, maybe on another game day or in the post-game), so there's that. In terms of independently scum reading WM, it's a weak read based partly on stan1ey's case against me - which felt like a reach he was trying too hard to pad out into something more - and partly based on the way WM came in and reversed course on the read of me/my post without mentioning the way other people reacted to it.

If we're not agreed that Oka should be the lynch for anti-PR-hunting purposes, I think I'd rather go for Quick today. But, at this point I'd compromise lynch on anyone but nancy and Formerfish. So, in the interests of consolidation, of the current wagons, I think I feel the least bad joining up with Oka on Trinity.

VOTE: TrinityNZ

(Oh, how the turn tables indeed.)

[Flicker]

@Flicker,

If you had to give the difference(s) between your Town game and Scum game, what would they be?

I've only rolled scum once (in Micro 805.1), but I wouldn't say I really got the opportunity to

play

as scum, so I don't know [what the difference is].

Why do you ask?

@Quick

I still want an answer to this.

[OkaPoka]

actually you can lynch me today

i think whymafia can stand up to yall

Also, this is certainly a post.

Lmao.

Meh, fuck the no lynch pool today in general.

These newbies are all pretty decent and bold enough to the point where I have faith in them if they are town.

[Flicker]

@Eragon

, sorry, I don't think I'm gonna be able to give you the more detailed post after all. Like you, I'm also struggling to keep up,

and also my reads have changed since then

, so it would be a lot of work for not a lot of reward. I'll just give an updated reads list, and if you (or anyone else) want me to elaborate on it, let me know.

EBWOP

Just went back and realized, other than Oka, my reads didn't really change at all.

[OkaPoka]

@flicker in response to your thing, please don't go ahead and lynch me. we still have time to scumhunt.

still waiting for trinity responses

[OkaPoka]

Well I went over my unaligned reads for Oka and I have Trinity and Iceman as pretty strongly unaligned with him, and Trinity also clear from spew (kinda think he may have TMI'd her townflip in 1056). FF/Oka isn't the likeliest team but I don't think I would rule them out entirely. He's clearly insane enough as a player that I don't really trust myself to read him for this kind of thing as much as I might for someone else.

I don't really have any other antialignments on him that mean anything.

There are some nebulous things that whisper the name Eragon when I think about who his most likely partner is but that's also the part of me that wants to invoke rule of 3 on his Trinity/Iceman/Eragon thing so lol.

What is the rule of 3?

You can read my most recent newbie scum game here: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... ct[]=23817