NY214: Project Pinecone (Game over! Town wins!)

[Gamma Emerald]

not yet

[Taly]

There's a better associative to

Profii-A50

than

Xyzzy-A50

imo

at least, it's very unlikely for

Profii-Xyzzy

team.

I don't see

Xyzzy-Sky

either.

xyzzy

feels least likely scum when evaluating the big picture of my reads.

Why are people calling A50 scum rn?

I had a case on

Elbirn

1725 to 1727, that led to my original vote on the slot.

But reasons I'm not feeling good on

A50

right now:

1)

Claimed VT when it wasn't necessary.

2)

Is openly saying that he wants to eat an NK but there's little reason to think he would.

3)

He's not explaining his stances, and he hasn't read up either.

People have their own reasons for pushing

Elbirn/A50

, but these are mine... and I've been the main person to voice their reasons there.

And I'm weary of being confbiased, but nobody's actually telling me why my townreads or scumreads and assessments aren't helpful or effective here.

[Taly]

Scum
Sky
xyzzy
profii
HWS
A50

Your bottom 2 SRs are horrible. Just saying.

Can you not say the same thing several players have said about my scumreads since D1?

[Almost50]

Scum
Sky
xyzzy
profii
HWS
A50

Your bottom 2 SRs are horrible. Just saying.

Can you not say the same thing several players have said about my scumreads since D1?

OH, OK! I didn't know they already told you they were horrible.
So, your bottom 2 SRs are hideous/gruesome/horrendous/disgusting/flawed/beyond reason
Pick one that hasn't been used before.

[Taly]

I see a lot of

"this is town" and "this is scum"

statements that haven't changed much at all throughout the progression of this dayphase.

And while I don't necessarily question all of that

If some reads and narratives are so clear to multiple people in this game, and my reads/thoughts don't align with theirs, then why aren't more people explaining their POV to me and how I'm wrong?

I feel like I've been thinking out loud for a good portion this dayphase, and I'm not getting clarity or a desirable result.

And it's frustrating.

[Taly]

OH, OK! I didn't know they already told you they were horrible.
So, your bottom 2 SRs are hideous/gruesome/horrendous/disgusting/flawed/beyond reason
Pick one that hasn't been used before.

I'm meaning reasons, not adjectives.

[profii]

....Please do not ask to be lynched to prove you're town....

Here's a concise version of my scumread over you Profii that I elaborated on in some of my falls

1)

You kept your vote on

Flub

up a lot in D1, and kept saying you'd vote and lynch

Dram

specifically, but you didn't throw a vote that way and your vote on

xyzzy

was opportunistic because a portion of the vote there was because of it being a wagon with momentum. Why didn't you deeply evaluate

Dram

when he was worthy of a read to you?

2)

There is several issues I take with your stance on

A50

and my specific vote on his wagon.

-

You had issue with me wanting to see more conversation happening prior to a lynch given the wagon progression and gamestate, but you voted

Elbirn

to L-1 here.

-

A lot of your reasons for your stance on my thoughts over the wagon, ones I responded in my earlier walls, are ones that can easily be alleviated if you actually asked questions and tried to figure my stance out in depth. A lot of your assessments about me are untrue, in terms of my vote, thought process, and your incomplete perception of how I work as town or scum.

-

There's plenty of other people on the wagon that you didn't read into, I gave a FULL case to push progression on that wagon and outlined my ideas, but your assertion on my alignment based off my specific stance to

Elbirn

doesn't sit right with me when you haven't looked at the full picture.

-

I'm seriously confused with your

Elbirn/Me/Sky

reads. You L-1'd

Elbirn

, and started townreading him (?), and then you started making realities of me being town OR scum, and that

Sky

would be scum WITH me.

3)

You not being responsive hasn't helped this. I can understand if it's for life reasons, but it's not helping me change the direction of my read if I'm so obviously wrong.

Qs

What is your read/thoughts

A50

upon his entrance?
Reads on

xyzzy, Sky, HWS

?

Busy week.

Don’t tell me how to play - I can ask to be lynched if I want. Pro-town reasons:

-if you remove {Profii - a50} from the game you get the flips and you force the entire player list to focus on new issues as 95%+ of this game day has focussed on {p/a50} - if anyone is hiding in the wagon, they can’t just go back to it tomorrow.

- by removing us 2, the plethora of PRs don’t have to be stupid and _prove_ one of us is scum/town - it can be applied to someone like xyzzy who is almost totally null

- also, if TW helps us out by following this plan, it goes some way to showing he can be leashed which is great

So, if I see a plan that will help, I’ll put it forward, just because it involves me dying, doesn’t make it bad. You’ll catch people out because they have to make new reads as opposed to “oh man, we didn’t get profii, let’s get profii” (etc)


Flub/dram stuff - I am pretty confident there is still scum in the mini Rask wagon so really wanted to stick there. I just finished a game where I caught scum in exact the same way so i wanted to stick with something that works. Was kinda town reading TW who was playing his ‘normal’ game as far as I can tell, but to be fair I’d happily lynch any of the remaining players {TW, Sky, xyzzy} for different reasons


Elbirn wagon stuff - I guess I got the wagon-mechanics wrong here. Something is wrong here I think but also, you are putting L-1 on a pedestal, I’m not given the player list so I don’t see that as a big deal, it’s more of a reaction test than putting town at lol-hammer risk

3) yep v busy this week


The reads you want

Xyzzy - I am a bit behind but there is almost no content here, whilst I like the idea of removing the inactives to make lylo etc easier I don’t really wanna PL like that past day 1. However was involved in the Rask wagon so I’d vote here

Sky - I’ll go find quotes and stuff later coz I’m phone posting but I reckon if TW isn’t a SK then Sky is probably scum - I say this because the Rask wagon pings me, it could be the SK mentality of “lynch anyone” from TW or Sky is a bit scummy

HWS - I’m probably behind because nothing as far as I’m up to has stood out as unusual to me so I’m null/towning here. Am I supposed to have a strong read here? (Ie, have I missed something)

[brassherald]

Wait, who did Gamma replace?

[Skygazer]

hitalt

[HeWhoSwims]

He's saying it so he doesn't get shot fam

On contrary. I've been luring the NK. Admittedly I don't want it to come at the hands of the Town Vig, but it's still better than the lynch for my "prestige". I get shot much much more often than I get lynched.

Why'd you lure the kill as a pretty significant PR?

hm from just the posts I'm seeing here A50 feels kinda towny

Have you read his predecessor Elbirn?

I did! And I townread him sorta

[Raskolnikov]

Can I get a sanity check on this
Is a50 justifying claiming VT on the basis that it'll attract a scum NK?

[Almost50]

Why'd you lure the kill as a pretty significant PR?

Well, I'm not exactly new to MS, am I? I do have a meta. My meta is

I gambit and lie more often as Town

. This simply means my claim as a VT means absolutely nothing. It's still a 50-50 chance that I'm a VT luring the NK, or that I'm a PR trying to look like a VT who is baiting the kill.

Very few

players would be able to actually tell from what I've said and how I acted since I replaced in, while the rest will have to merely guess blindly.

Now if Scum have a Role Cop (say) or a Tracker/Follower they'd probably commit to me tonight. Else, they may want to shoot me just to be sure. yet again, that might be exactly what I want them to do so maybe they will not. See what I mean?

[Almost50]

Can I get a sanity check on this
Is a50 justifying claiming VT on the basis that it'll attract a scum NK?

remind me to claim VT in every game we play together. It looks like it would become very handy whenever you roll scum and I roll a TPR!

[Skygazer]

That gambit doesn't really work that well when there are like 20 claimed power roles and you're scumread by a decent chunk of the game

It reads like you're just going for towncred by pointing out how you're trying to draw the night kill

[Almost50]

Actually, here's a list of the currently alive players (hypothetically assuming each slot is town separately for the purpose of my analysis):

2. MagnaofIllusion: He can't tell if I'm a PR or not from my play, and won't trust anything I say. He may even still harbour some doubts about my alignment.

3. Ausuka*: Won't trust a word I say. More prone to suspect my alignment than not, and assuming I'm confirmed a townie to her she still will have no idea about my role either.

4. brassherald: Has a higher probability of figuring what I'm doing and hence is also much more likely to TR me (correctly)

5. the worst: Even more likely than brass to both TR me and figure out my role, but he will always have a "side note" that reads: Do not 100% trust A50 until he does flip.

7. Gamma Emerald: Upon replacement will tend to TR my play, but the longer I live the more suspicious he will grow. Will have mixed feelings about my role.

8. Skygazer: I am not quite sure I can predict her views and feelings about me at this stage. Not enough mutual background for me to do so.

9. Inferno390: Not sure if he has seen me town-gambitting before, so I'll just group him with Sky for now.

10. Chickadee*: Will SR me regardless. I also tend to SR her often because of her tendency to tunnel me.

11. xyzzy: I "think" he may have an idea here based on having recently modded a game where I was scum, and the contras in play style should be clear (a word of advise: you still need to learn more about me, so sheep tw here)

12. HeWhoSwims*: I'd be surprised if he SRs my play here. Period. He sure won't know what my role is though.

14. Raskolnikov: Know absolutely nothing about my play so all his reactions seem normal to me.

15. Taly: Another one of those who are naturally cautious of me. You do need to look closer, ISO me in a couple of our recent games and -maybe- then you'll figure out my alignment 9but not my role)

16. Andrius*: No idea how he would perceive me. We don't play "subsequent" games that often, so he always gets to see a different me everytime we meet.

17. Profii: Probably should join Sky and Inferno (i.e. unlikely to be able to tell anything about me yet)

[Almost50]

That gambit doesn't really work that well when there are like 20 claimed power roles and you're scumread by a decent chunk of the game

It reads like you're just going for towncred by pointing out how you're trying to draw the night kill

If you say so.

[the worst]

If I had to score A50's analysis of how I read A50 I'd give it a score of almost 50 out of 50

also don't forget Ausuka was a head of the Auscher slot in APOCALYPSE and is therefore probably proceeding with caution on you

[Almost50]

also don't forget Ausuka was a head of the Auscher slot in APOCALYPSE and is therefore probably proceeding with caution on you

Yeah, but then that was CHARA obv!towning as usual, and not me.

[Taly]

OK, I'm not going to pry into reasons, or discuss the VT claim beyond this point

But my meta experiences points me to say this is town-

Almost

... at the moment. It's not a strong meta read. He's also someone I volatile read in several of my previous games with him.

We've blinded each other before. Like me and

TW

I'll get to

profii

soon, but I will say - I don't think town being content with their lynch is protown at all, despite gamestate.

But that's my philosophy, though.

~

Can the people who townread

HWS

tell me why they do?

[MagnaofIllusion]

This is what you kids call a prod-dodge.

Life is kicking me in the balls right now with no end in sight. I'll try to get caught up on reading (I assume Gamma replaced HitAlt but can't say I've even been able to phone read to see that) and refocus by tomorrow night.

[Pine]

xyzzy has been prodded especially hard.

[xyzzy]

hey, I just saw my prod a bit ago and haven't had an opportunity to post since then and I'm about to go to sleep BUT I will focus on this game first thing tomorrow morning. sorry I've been slacking off on this one, y'all.

[brassherald]

Gamma, have you read any of the game yet?

[Chickadee]

I'm ready for a flip

[Ausuka]

VOTE: xyzzy