Mini 2018 - American Presidents Mafia (Game Over)

[Irrelephant11]

There may be a reason why he voted Irrelephant11 and Gustavo.............

???

[BlackVoid]

Town N_M is trolly but he won't vote conf-town. @Irrelephant and Gustavo.

i literally just saw him do this as town

your responses are actually pinging me a lot

was that just hammer?

Okay, that's interesting. I've always assumed as that as town, there's some gamesolving going on behind the scenes which he just doesn't show us. At least that's what it looked like in the game I played scum against him.

I still get the feeling that he has given up and wants the game to end. I don't know who else it would be if it isn't N_M. I can look back at Gustavo again but I really don't think as scum, he's going to get so frustrated that people ignored his Shoshin push that he almost just checks out of the game.

[skitter30]

VOTE: the worst

Fuggo tomorrow

in the aforementioned jungle republic game, *after* tw claimed seer and nobody cc'd him (this was *not* a cc)

and nm was town

[skitter30]

bv i'm really just getting the vibe that you want to push this lynch through?

[Not_Mafia]

VT

Now lynch scum

VOTE: EP

[skitter30]

but then this makes me feel like you legit have no idea what's going and that you're just throwing out random names

[BlackVoid]

bv i'm really just getting the vibe that you want to push this lynch through?

Yeah, I want to push N_M through. Maybe I'm not playing completely optimally by not going through an extensive analysis of clearing Gustavo before I do it. I think it's ridiculous people are actually voting me over him and I'd hate to give this scumteam a free mislynch on me even if they wind up losing.

I haven't read the game closely enough to see what the context is. But N_M's posts here just gave me the impression that he knows he's caught and the game is done so might as well get lynched and move onto the next one.

Is there anyone I should be seriously considering outside of N_M?

[Gustavo]

VOTE: nm

[Irrelephant11]

skitter it might be BV but his wanting to push NM through here is towny - scumplay is to prepare another lynch for when this flips green.

[Irrelephant11]

though BV if you wouldn't mind responding to Nauci's case

[Keyser Söze]

Not_Mafia’s votes are beyond a joke now.

HOWEVER I say we put him to the side for now.
- BV needs to defend himself to Nauci (Nauci would be incensed if this doesn’t happen today, her investigations on me and Irrelephant has maybe won us the game so we owe her that)

Then we vote and end D4.
Everyone’s happy.

[skitter30]

bv i'm really just getting the vibe that you want to push this lynch through?

Yeah, I want to push N_M through. Maybe I'm not playing completely optimally by not going through an extensive analysis of clearing Gustavo before I do it. I think it's ridiculous people are actually voting me over him and I'd hate to give this scumteam a free mislynch on me even if they wind up losing.

I haven't read the game closely enough to see what the context is. But N_M's posts here just gave me the impression that he knows he's caught and the game is done so might as well get lynched and move onto the next one.

Is there anyone I should be seriously considering outside of N_M?

ok so here's where i'm at:

a) you feel like you're trying to push through a lynch, which feels very wrong from you; like i'm surprised that you aren't re-reading gustavo here or looking at ep. like i understand that from your pov nm is most likely but i feel like you aren't going through the other options as thoroughly as i'd expect from you, which is surprising me. and you not really responding to nauci is just kinda uncharacteristic i think

b) nm is literally throwing out random names, which looks kinda survivalistic to me, to see if anything sticks. my problem is that he isn't that clueless i think? like if he actually cares he has a very good sense as to what's going on. i don't know if he's more likely to care as scum or town but i feel like he usually at least attempts to play to his wincon and here he's just like doing whatever. it looks kinda like a last-ditch attempt to get the heat off of him. but like i don't think this plays to a scum wincon and i don't think tw entrusts the game to someone so clearly out of it; i don't think he gambles that hard on nm who just isn't here

c) i am beginning to get paranoid that i got pocketed by you - i'm having a lot of trouble putting together tw + bv in a way that makes sense to me knowing what i know about your playstyle but i'm having an equally hard time being comfortable just calling you town no matter how much i want to

[skitter30]

skitter it might be BV but his wanting to push NM through here is towny - scumplay is to prepare another lynch for when this flips green.

i know that's part of what's causing doubts

but rushing the day just feels wrong from him either way? idk

[BlackVoid]

@skitter, you have the impression of me never being impatient because a scenario like that never happened in the games we played together. In some scenarios, I do get impatient. Example: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... 0#p9486237 (read my posts about Mulch). You have a good idea of how I play but you haven't seen my full townrange.

I was going to respond to Nauci but then I actually caught up and got distracted with more recent posts.

[Irrelephant11]

Also as another town point for Nauci (re: anyone who thinks she's a potential lynch) - she knew Keyser and I were not just town, but specifically VT. In a game that was missing a town PR claim, that's a dangerous guess. Unless she's scum roleblocker-and-rolecop

[skitter30]

she's very very probably town but honestly she's not getting lynched today ever and if we don't solve the game today she's almost for sure getting nk'd before lylo so i'm just sticking her in my townpile without thinking about it too much tbh

like if we're both alive in lylo i'll worry about it then but i honestly can't imagine that lylo will be me/nauci/???? so i don't really care enough to worry about this line of thinking

[Keyser Söze]

...and me and you are not two slots you t/clear... we were in some players PoE.
Clearing us as two VT’s is a masterstroke that helps us narrow down the lynch pool for the win.
Yes, was thinking rolecop earlier... but we’re hunting roleblocker.

[Errantparabola]

UNVOTE:

almost impossible that Nauci is not legit, any town result that scumNauci fakes is in essence a town clear, so functionally scumNauci is mechanical suicide assuming that we force her to verify all the VT claims

have this horrible nagging feeling that if gustavo is scum we've already lost this game.

Him simultaneously saying "it's one of BV and NM" while consistently applying pressure on me honestly makes me think that both of them are town and gustavo is prepping for LYLO with me and him but it just feels soooooooooooo far off from stungun and gustavo consistently being towny this game that I really dont know if gustavo scum makes sense ever

I have no major issues of concern with those 8 posts either.

Yeah it's townposting

Town

Odd Night Doctor
Tracker
Neopolitan
Neighborizer
1 shot BP

Scum

Encryptor
Goon
Ninja or Blocker?

Who thinks this looks balanced?

with a blocker this doesn't look too far off of balance? 10/3 is CRAZY skewed towards scum

the one thing that's holding me back here is that nm is super disengaged from the game and idk if tw banks the game on nm given how out of it he is

Okay, yeah that's another thing
Why does TW suicide to push NM forward? This D2 fake guilty strategy makes me think that they've got someone who they feel like can go long (or at least, longer than worst which was admittedly not a super high bar this game) which sort of exists directly in conflict with the people i'm townreading

nm is literally throwing out random names, which looks kinda survivalistic to me, to see if anything sticks

Wouldn't interpret this as survivalistic personally. I feel like I can't read any of NM's posting anymore because it makes equally as much sense for him as town to give up as for him as scum to give up

[Gustavo]

with a blocker this doesn't look too far off of balance? 10/3 is CRAZY skewed towards scum

10:3 is like 95% of the games here though so not really.

I don’t really see the point of a bp here but whatever

[skitter30]

Okay, yeah that's another thing
Why does TW suicide to push NM forward? This D2 fake guilty strategy makes me think that they've got someone who they feel like can go long (or at least, longer than worst which was admittedly not a super high bar this game) which sort of exists directly in conflict with the people i'm townreading

In post 3186, skitter30 wrote:
nm is literally throwing out random names, which looks kinda survivalistic to me, to see if anything sticks

Wouldn't interpret this as survivalistic personally. I feel like I can't read any of NM's posting anymore because it makes equally as much sense for him as town to give up as for him as scum to give up

yeah from tw i just don't see him banking the game on nm in this context? like that seems like a bizarre strategy to me given that tw was going to get lynched yesterday or today if he survived yesterday

and wrt survivalistic, like i don't know if it's AI - that's kinda what i was getting at; like i can see him doing this as either alignment tbh, which is why i'm having trouble interpreting it

[Gustavo]

Okay, yeah that's another thing
Why does TW suicide to push NM forward? This D2 fake guilty strategy makes me think that they've got someone who they feel like can go long (or at least, longer than worst which was admittedly not a super high bar this game) which sort of exists directly in conflict with the people i'm townreading

If this was the strategy, this would not point to NM but supposedly tw has done this before so idk if that was the strategy

[skitter30]

actually that's a legit point; i think nauci linked a previous game of tw's where he did this after one partner was dead and another partner was super scumread

[skitter30]

@skittles

Do you think scum-TW has given up today? (he’s decided for D3 to be about him, with the potential of it being 9 town vs 1 Mafia going into N3) Is he

that

confident that his scum partner is that well town read / hidden?

Is there ANYTHING from his D1/D2 play that backs up this trying-to-look-scummy-but-really-a-town-pr narrative?

In our stack the deck game, I Vigged scum N1. TW basically outed himself D2 while their 3rd was one of the more scumread slots in the game.

So I'm not sure if it means he feels confident about their 3rd?

this one

[Errantparabola]

VOTE: NotMafia

[Irrelephant11]

Anddd that's hammer

Gg NM?