Boundaries of Reality - [Game Over]

[Nancy Drew 39]

dunn aside, i think scum here is more likely to see that dunn claim and immediately assume it's legit. while right now i'm looking around at the mess not sure where to start.

VOTE: dunnstral
THIS TIME HE'S SCUM I PROMISE

I lied.

Him being a Miller claim is NAI

.

And this post is why Kokichi is currently my top town. Viewing Dunn miller claim as NAI, seems to be the most logical response to said claim.

Either pushing or opposing Dunn wagon too strongly is pinging because without anything more to base either stance on, there is no good reason presently, to view Dunn claim as AI.

[Nancy Drew 39]

like why are people who flash-wagoned Dunn still on the Dunn wagon post-claim?

lol. VOTE: varsoon
don't tell me you're saying that's a legit reason to unvote

What I find suspicious is his vote is on me and not on that wagon. Something about that isn’t adding up.

[Nancy Drew 39]

like why are people who flash-wagoned Dunn still on the Dunn wagon post-claim?

lol. VOTE: varsoon
don't tell me you're saying that's a legit reason to unvote

What I find suspicious is his vote is on me and not on that wagon. Something about that isn’t adding up.

P.edit. No one on that wagon. How can he be that opposed to Dunn wagon and have his vote on someone who was never even on it. Something isn’t right about that.

[Nancy Drew 39]

I highly doubt 2 scum would be claiming Miller whether real or fake, and both are sketchy, but at least one of them is town maybe, this hurts my brain.

This is precisely why I asked my alignment cop question, because that is usually the motivation for most miller claims in non-FG games. I randed miller recently in an MU game and was given grief post-game for never claiming it. My rationale was I wouldn’t need to if I never got cop-checked and I wasn’t and decided if I ever was, I’d just urge town to lynch me, rather than remain a question mark in that game.

[DVa]

But would scum likely fakeclaim miller on D1?

This is the part I didn't like -- I mean, isn't the answer yes? They looked at the sample role PM, people started claiming miller. Why does scum not claim miller here? You think all of them are real?

I mostly dislike that you were commenting a lot on setup but not evaluating the claims themselves, instead categorically accepting them as a clump at the time. I also dislike the meta defense of you, your own self-meta, and your criticism of Varsoon.

But I do like your attitude, you seem like a cool cat. Did you roll scum Nancy?

[Nancy Drew 39]

Honestly I wouldn't be surprised if there's 5+ desperadoes and this is some wacky desperado-miller only setup FG pulled from somewhere in his vortex of insanity. Given the sample role PM and already two Miller claims off the bat.

I think 5 would be excessive, even for FG.

I was thinking they were the "repeated" role that got discussed, but it could also be Miller.

Miller fakeclaim is obvious for mafia tho.

But would scum likely fakeclaim miller on D1?

We don’t even know if there’s an alignment cop in this setup.

Ofc, if they didn't do it d1 then they lose their shot. Alignment cop is irrelevant so I don't know where you got that.

106 was bad and the first thing to immediately strike me as scummy
VOTE: lady angel

Well if only one role is repeated multiple times, it would appear to be miller over desperado.

In this game, probably you’re right - in most non-FG games, rarely.

[Nancy Drew 39]

When I played with Nancy Drew, I believe it was a lot closer to their join date so they were still new to the site/mafia, but eeeeeh very vague recollection of what game we were even in or if it was just something I spectated or what
The name is familiar though
I don't believe in things being NAI for a player
that's how you get trust tells
and homie
I know
trust
tells

Rocky Horror clusterfuck - the only game we’ve ever played togethet. I don’t count Labrynth because Taly eventually replaced back from Vartsun hydra to his own nic and I’m assuming you’re not referring to my favourite game on here - Undertale.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Scum desperado? Shoots anyone any the die? Or do you mean like a scum vig? Seems like giving extra kills to scum which is generally a design faux-pas.

P-EDIT: If scum had high confidence there's a lot of millers in the setup, it makes sense they'd fake as one.

Desperadoes are essentially dayvigs (of either alignment) except they replace the lynch and do it publically.

[Nancy Drew 39]

also shooting millers is safe in both cases while with everyone else they risk dying

But a town desperado would care more about shooting scum than being safe.

A scum desperado would only target a miller and not care about sorting them.

[Nancy Drew 39]

But would scum likely fakeclaim miller on D1?

This is the part I didn't like -- I mean, isn't the answer yes? They looked at the sample role PM, people started claiming miller. Why does scum not claim miller here? You think all of them are real?

I mostly dislike that you were commenting a lot on setup but not evaluating the claims themselves, instead categorically accepting them as a clump at the time. I also dislike the meta defense of you, your own self-meta, and your criticism of Varsoon.

But I do like your attitude, you seem like a cool cat. Did you roll scum Nancy?

No of course not but what boggles my mind about yours and Varsoon’s vote on me the most, is completely ignoring the extremely likely chance of at least 2 desperadoes (1 town/1 scum) in this game. Why are neither of you realizing the implications of that?

This is what neither of you are taking into account and that’s why scumreading me for speculating about the existence of an alignment cop is so silly - yes SILLY because it absolutely is.

What meta defence? I never even said jack about my meta and actually dislike it when players do that in a game. What I did say - with regards to my meta is that it really makes a lot of sense to listen to people who have played multiple games with me because they would logically have likely more accurate reads on me. Do you disagree with this?

I adore Varsoon but his and your reasons for scumreading me here make absolutely no sense - based on any knowledgeable understanding of FG setups.

Thanks and no I did not. I’m sure I will become obvtown, sooner rather than later in this game.

[Wisdom]

Desperadoes are essentially dayvigs (of either alignment) except they replace the lynch and do it publically.

Desperados die if they shoot town

[Wisdom]

Nancy wanna vote lady angel with the cool kids?

[Varsoon]

Backin' up my girl on this
Calling out alignment cop like that really feels like scum casting a net

VOTE: Nancy Drew 39

No it really doesn’t. In most games - non FG games anyway, a miller/godfather role almost always cooncides with an alignment cop.

So both of you are voting me for silly reasons IMO.

Yeah--and who benefits most from outting an alignment cop (even confirmation one might exist) on D1?

I'm familiar with FG setups, but not Alice setups, for which this seems to be the norm.

I'm interested in SORTING YOU based on YOUR PLAY in THIS GAME, not on self-meta that I take at face-value from someone else. I'm not going to all of a sudden stop being critical because lolmeta.

I have my vote on YOU because I was waiting for YOU to respond to MY PRESSURE. I can't vote the whole fucking wagon (but I can voice my dissatisfaction with it, which I did), and I'd gladly go back to my Marquis vote if you responded in kind, but you've blown up over this with almost a whole page straight of venting over my vote on you and scrambling to justify your position. Is making 10+ posts where you try to justify yourself also NAI?

I'm ignoring 'the chance of X in this setup' because it's fucking D1 in a setup I don't have meta knowledge of--I'm trying to suss out people's alignments and not solve some fucking setup puzzle.

Why are you trying to solve this setup when you know making meta-based assumptions on FG setups has caused you to lose as town in the past?
Why are you leaning so heavily on setup-spec rather than trying to figure out what the various claims and reactions around them mean for player's alignments?
Why are you so turbo-defensive against what is literally just two people voting you?
Why were you so quick to call out me being outspoken against the Dunnstral wagon but not voting there?
^Can you address this while keeping in mind that I do not have multiple votes to spread around at once and that I was voting you--so your criticism of me not having my vote elsewhere looks like you trying to logicbully me off of voting you when I specifically am voting you to back up the voting power of one of my most trusted townreads?

[Varsoon]

Desperadoes are essentially dayvigs (of either alignment) except they replace the lynch and do it publically.

Desperados die if they shoot town

I'd also like for Nancy to explain how she thinks a scum desperado would work and why FG would give day-ending vig power to scum.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Desperadoes are essentially dayvigs (of either alignment) except they replace the lynch and do it publically.

Desperados die if they shoot town

True but a town desperado who shoots scum, will almost certainly be NKed anyway. No way does scum-shooting town desperado live to the next day phase, unless they are doced.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Desperadoes are essentially dayvigs (of either alignment) except they replace the lynch and do it publically.

Desperados die if they shoot town

I'd also like for Nancy to explain how she thinks a scum desperado would work and why FG would give day-ending vig power to scum.

In Forgotten Hourglass, there was both a town and a scum poisoner. Does that answer your question?

[Wisdom]

Is making 10+ posts where you try to justify yourself also NAI?

yes

[Wisdom]

and nancy is right, scum desperado is very likely

[Wisdom]

Like, i was scum gunsmith in forgotten hourglass which was useless for scum utility
All it helped me do is pass as town
Same will happen here

[Nancy Drew 39]

Backin' up my girl on this
Calling out alignment cop like that really feels like scum casting a net

VOTE: Nancy Drew 39

No it really doesn’t. In most games - non FG games anyway, a miller/godfather role almost always cooncides with an alignment cop.

So both of you are voting me for silly reasons IMO.

Yeah--and who benefits most from outting an alignment cop (even confirmation one might exist) on D1?

I'm familiar with FG setups, but not Alice setups, for which this seems to be the norm.

I'm interested in SORTING YOU based on YOUR PLAY in THIS GAME, not on self-meta that I take at face-value from someone else. I'm not going to all of a sudden stop being critical because lolmeta.

I have my vote on YOU because I was waiting for YOU to respond to MY PRESSURE. I can't vote the whole fucking wagon (but I can voice my dissatisfaction with it, which I did), and I'd gladly go back to my Marquis vote if you responded in kind, but you've blown up over this with almost a whole page straight of venting over my vote on you and scrambling to justify your position. Is making 10+ posts where you try to justify yourself also NAI?

I'm ignoring 'the chance of X in this setup' because it's fucking D1 in a setup I don't have meta knowledge of--I'm trying to suss out people's alignments and not solve some fucking setup puzzle.

Why are you trying to solve this setup when you know making meta-based assumptions on FG setups has caused you to lose as town in the past?
Why are you leaning so heavily on setup-spec rather than trying to figure out what the various claims and reactions around them mean for player's alignments?
Why are you so turbo-defensive against what is literally just two people voting you?
Why were you so quick to call out me being outspoken against the Dunnstral wagon but not voting there?
^Can you address this while keeping in mind that I do not have multiple votes to spread around at once and that I was voting you--so your criticism of me not having my vote elsewhere looks like you trying to logicbully me off of voting you when I specifically am voting you to back up the voting power of one of my most trusted townreads?

A). Outing or eliminating any speculation of there being an alignment cop in the setup. I am trying to ascertain what possible scum motivation there would be to fakeclaim miller if there’s no ac in the setup. You don’t think that might be useful?

B). You really need to familiarize yourself with FG Alice/Deemo setups, to make proper sense of my posts in this game so far.

C) I’m not saying ignore my play but it’s foolish to sr me for things that others can vouch is totally NAI for me. Why? They can provide you links to other games, where I played similarly and you can ascertain that for yourself.

D) Why is Marquis your #1 scumread and no, I’m not opposed to that wagon.

E). You never answered my question about why vote me since

I was never on Dunnstral wagon

?

F) Yes, not only is it NAI but Townie of me to “blow up” (which I don’t even think I’m doing btw) over votes on me, as anyone who will tell you. And knowing I’m receiving those votes, not only despite being town but for actually trying to fgure out the game, is really frustrating. I don’t care, if you agree with this or not.

E) When did I do that? All I recall saying was that Kokichi was my top townread for his NAI post. I’m not even voting you. I’m trying to honestly decide if it’s suspicious of you to vote me, over someone on the Dunn wagon or not.

G). If you’re really suspicious of that wagon, then it makes no sense for you to squander your vote on me.

H). Wtf does making a bad vote have jack to do with who you townread?

I) Why is she your strongest townread anyway? While I’m not currently sr her, she is certainly not amongst my top townreads, since she like you is ignoring good advice from players who have familiarity with my play. At the very best, she is not good town for doing that and once again. I don’t really care if either you or her agree with this or not.

I) I’m sorry you don’t appreciate my attitude but since I know I’m right here, I’m not changing it.

J). I am a very unorthodox player. There are very obvious town-based motivations for what I’m trying to do here. If you both familiarize yourself with FG Alice/Deemo games and try to not be closed minded about me, it will become blatantly obvious to you real fast.

[Nancy Drew 39]

and nancy is right, scum desperado is very likely

Like, i was scum gunsmith in forgotten hourglass which was useless for scum utility
All it helped me do is pass as town
Same will happen here

Scum desperado will almost certainly shoot town miller. Town desperado shoots their strongest scumread, since they expect scum to NK them anyway.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Is making 10+ posts where you try to justify yourself also NAI?

yes

Varsoon has no familiarity with any game of mine, where I’ve been scumread. I was never sr in Undertale, Rocky Horror or Labrynth. The player he’s sheeping on me has 0 familiarity with me, period.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Desperadoes are essentially dayvigs (of either alignment) except they replace the lynch and do it publically.

Desperados die if they shoot town

I'd also like for Nancy to explain how she thinks a scum desperado would work and why FG would give day-ending vig power to scum.

In Forgotten Hourglass they’re was a scum poisoneer who could poison people during the day. Have you never been in a game before with this type of mechanic?

[Nancy Drew 39]

btw sakura if you're town you're going to have to prove it

like yeah i misread you before when you actually were town but i still feel burned. like. just talk to me

proving im town is easy, and you dont even need to talk with me!

...what?

VOTE: Gamma Emerald
That miller claim is super shaky and more looks like you jumped on it for town points than an actual miller claim.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Nancy wanna vote lady angel with the cool kids?

I am not opposed to this vote either.