Mini Normal 2041 [Game Over]

[skitter30]

VOTE COUNT 2.8

Mewtaph (3)

- Almost50, Kokichi Oma, PenguinPower

OkaPoka (2)

- DrDolittle, Sephiroth

PenguinPower (2)

- OkaPoka, Gamma Emerald

DVa (1)

- Nako

DrDolittle (1)

- DVa

Not Voting (1)

- Joey_, Mewtaph

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch

Deadline:

(expired on 2018-11-24 22:00:00)

Mod Notes:

- nako is v/la until saturday
-drdolittle is v/la until saturday

[Sephiroth]

Also don't try to act like you aren't equally guilty of not committing. You claim to have a tr on me but when questioned about the strength by oka earlier in the day decided that out of a pool the scum was probably me and voted there. If you have a townread as you're claiming, or even if you're claiming that now you're switching off of that tr, that flip onto me when questioned by Oka makes no sense. You need to get your story straight, or stop fencesitting then turning around and calling me scum for the same.

[Mewtaph]

Like if you are scum then there's no way I get your attention by going gentle here. How else do you want me to go about it, "I'm concerned that Seph could be reiterating their dislike/paranoia/etc. of my slot". That's what I'm saying, I need a bit more than a fence sit to decide.

[Sephiroth]

Maybe you could just acknowledge that this is currently a confusing game state and its perfectly reasonable for me to have scum reads but also feel wary about your slot given how you're sheeping and seeming to buddy me.

[Mewtaph]

Also don't try to act like you aren't equally guilty of not committing. You claim to have a tr on me but when questioned about the strength by oka earlier in the day decided that out of a pool the scum was probably me and voted there. If you have a townread as you're claiming, or even if you're claiming that now you're switching off of that tr, that flip onto me when questioned by Oka makes no sense. You need to get your story straight, or stop fencesitting then turning around and calling me scum for the same.

Yes, I am sorry and can see how that can be alarming from your point of view.

P-edit - Sorry. I am aware of this but am just trying to make sure I don't get back-ended here if I do end up eating the lynch.

[Kokichi Oma]

Joey has been busy and so have I. Sorry

[DVa]

PenguinPower -- I've liked his reactions in real time but I also don't really agree with his reads so I don't really know. I think I need to exert some brainpower to make sense of Oka's wagon analysis case here but so far I honestly haven't

Mewtaph -- Mew actually responded to some of my points better than I thought, namely that I did in fact say that Nako should say whether she targeted him first before claiming ascetic. So Seph is right that at this point my argument against Mew is that I think he has a shitty reads list. That being said, having a shitty reads list is still a decent reason to vote someone. but idk, I can't think of the last time I argued with scum and I actually felt like I understood their perspective more than I did before I began arguing with them, so feeling nervous here rn.

Sephiroth -- There's a weird dynamic between Seph and Mew that makes me think there's one scum between the two but I don't know which, but right now, I would probably gamble Seph over Mew.

DrDolittle -- This is what I wanted at the start of today and this is what I want now even though I feel like my argument here is basically "just look at it". I probably need to actually case this if I want it to happen but this dayphase has frankly exhausted me.

I don't know if DrD's flip really helps Oka's Wagon analysis and Dr.D's flip doesn't really resolve most of the other issues with night actions but I also just feel like DrD isn't playing like he's town right now. This might not be the mechanically superior wagon but I think it might have the highest equity independently for me at this point

[Joey_]

Hi Dva

[Joey_]

Plot twist

I recently got a short-term contract at my new job which explains why I have been less active and much busier. That being said, I don't feel like my slot is pursuing its wincon like it could and should, therefore, I will be replacing out

That being said, I am sorry koki and I would have loved to have more time and feel confident in my reads on you but it's just not the case in this game, I am not invested enough to feel competent

>I fakeclaimed mason with koki for numerous reasons, i made a little notes for you guys in the even that i had to explain myself :

Spoiler:

Hi, so i made that note @ 2:30 am just after unvoting the fish so the game hopefully slow down a bit, people will unvote koki and fishy wont get hammered before i get to control the future days a bit.

So, since i decided that i hardclaimed mason with an heavily fosed slot, i feel like i have to justify myself and prepare something that is thoughtful and exhaustive enough so i don’t get insulted for playing against my wincon (if i get killed n1 i will post this in GY) or ridiculed for my poor choice if koki turns up to be a dirty mefia.

Lets talk about mechanics. I hardtownread Gamma and oka, i dont think theres a world where those 2 ever flip mefia. That being said, Oka is an annoying chicken and hes very loud, hes pushing on Koki, a slot i can read, and distract everyone else from actual scummy people that can be an issue; namely anyone who are great at lylo like a50, seph and the likes.

Uno, I, personally, think that using the whole day to remove a readable slot that can help a lot as town, is bad for town.

Secondo, if i can clear, even temporarily koki, from everyone’s mind they might make more relevant content and find the mefia instead of focusing on him.

Thirdo, i think our D1 is naturally laid out in a way where its very believable we are indeed mason, making the claim even more tempting and relevant.

Quatro, the claim itself is a non issue. Like DVA said, i expect koki from baiting to be killed so hes either VT or a pr who gains from getting targeted. Either way, i am playing for my wincon by letting koki be a target (since hes fosed) and potentially playing into koki’s plan to bait a kill.

Cinquo, its D1 and its the beginning of the game, we have like 2 Mls so its a great situation to fakeclaim trying to get some edge over the mefia. Also, if any of us dies it confirms that the claim is false, so i couldnt clear koki’s w/o having the power to retract my claim, even in death.

Sexto, i hope you guys stll love me and think i made a good decision (hopefully hes town like i said).

That being said, i expected one of us to die anyway but the longer i kept the claim, the longer the wagon analysis and other pr claim credibility will be affected. Like an investigative role with masons is much rarer, hence the 3 claims ish makes more sens from my pov of fake masons.

Dont be mad at me please and do not just turn on koki for no reason just because he isnt clear anymore, that would be just stupid. I also claimed obviously because I wont let my replacement go back on my claim and try to justify my reasoning

@Mod : Replace me please

[skitter30]

@Mod : Replace me please

got it!

[Sephiroth]

Dva can you answer my questions while I try to wrap my head around Joeys last post?

[DVa]

On the one hand, ow

On the other hand, my setup spec is easier to process now

I think this means A50 is probably locked. We do have the problem where he probably gets blocked while scum hunt for the doctor

@Seph, I'll see if I can find them

[DVa]

@Seph, as I said in my read list, I kinda prefer DrD. A big part of my push on Mew was related to how he reacted to the discussion of being a possible ascetic. I'm not sure having the shitty reads list in and of itself is enough for me to lynch him right now, although I didn't really like his predecessor either.

What I would say though is that right now I don't feel like either of you had organic responses to A50's 1v1 with me today. Like, it was such a wild case, made for such spiteful reasons, and it felt like neither of you really wanted to process it at a deeper level. So something seems off with both of you frankly.

In regard to Oka, I'll reread the scumgame again soon, but I guess I just have a hard time seeing how you start off naturally scumreading him.

But your questions are also "reevaluate highly active, proactive players." Like, I don't know how you look at this game and choose three of the most proactive and active players and call all three of them scum. Like, something seems really fucking off with your reads. It's not just calling me scum, Oka scum, and A50 scum individually. It's that your reads list is everyone who has been chatty and pushy this game. Like your theory is that the entire scum team is competing to be the top powerscum railroader. It just seems really fucking weird that you would both look at this game and come up with a list like that because it seems hard to imagine multiple towns imagining their entire scum block as being the people saying shit.

So yeah, frankly I think having a lynchpool of {Top Poster, Second Top Poster, Fourth Top Poster} strikes me as not very likely to come from a town POV. It feels like you want to case people who have said and done lots of things so you have more to work with and so you don't get accused of trying to push lurkers or so that you aren't coming off as opportunistic, which is to say that the readslist looks political and meant more to make you look like town than to find scum.

[DVa]

Koki, I guess maybe you could expand on why you accepted the mason fakeclaim?

[PenguinPower]

Kokichi fake claimed?



I feel my point brought up on D1 may be relevant after all.

[Sephiroth]

@Seph, as I said in my read list, I kinda prefer DrD. A big part of my push on Mew was related to how he reacted to the discussion of being a possible ascetic. I'm not sure having the shitty reads list in and of itself is enough for me to lynch him right now, although I didn't really like his predecessor either.

I don't think this gels with your town game, it feels like you're settling because you don't like his reads list. Having a poor reads list in no way makes you scum because how you read people is subjective 9 times out of 10. Also what you're saying here is completely inconsistent with what you said about his slot in 1700 where you say he flips scum every time.

What I would say though is that right now I don't feel like either of you had organic responses to A50's 1v1 with me today. Like, it was such a wild case, made for such spiteful reasons, and it felt like neither of you really wanted to process it at a deeper level. So something seems off with both of you frankly.

I didn't really read it carefully...1v1s happen frequently and its not my style to try too hard to analyze them until one of the slots flips. It was honestly a stupid thing to argue about. What's more interesting is that you characterize me as having no *organic* response to that 1v1 but thats because I had NO response to your 1v1. I literally didn't acknowledge it. Thats completely normal for me so I'm pretty curious why you think that matters. You can certainly say I didn't respond at all but lumping me in with Mew's response is lazy and incorrect.

In regard to Oka, I'll reread the scumgame again soon, but I guess I just have a hard time seeing how you start off naturally scumreading him. But your questions are also "reevaluate highly active, proactive players."

Thats not my question. My question is how the hell do you read him as active and engaged (seemingly) just for his post count, and not at all care about the timing and context of when he decided to completely drop out. I'm not sure if you're purposefully missing my point here. Its not reevaluate active and engaged players, its reevaluate active and engaged players that you tr

when they conspicuously disappear during crucial moments in the game

.

Like, I don't know how you look at this game and choose three of the most proactive and active players and call all three of them scum. Like, something seems really fucking off with your reads. It's not just calling me scum, Oka scum, and A50 scum individually. It's that your reads list is everyone who has been chatty and pushy this game.

Or, its like I don't look at vote counts to decide who I should scum read? I had no fucking clue how many posts each of them had until you posted it below. If you had read my ISO and looked at my reads previously you would see that its pretty damn clear I didn't just choose the highest posters because I've had them in my scum or bottom of my null pool over most of the game. If you took the time to actually try to sort me and why my reads are what they are, you wouldn't come to this stupid top poster conclusion. I really don't think that you made an effort whereas town!Dva 100% would dig deeper to figure out whether my reads have evolved naturally or not.

Like your theory is that the entire scum team is competing to be the top powerscum railroader. It just seems really fucking weird that you would both look at this game and come up with a list like that because it seems hard to imagine multiple towns imagining their entire scum block as being the people saying shit.

Again, having a high post count in no way makes you powerscum, and lots and lots of players post a lot as scum to hide their general lack of actual content. Your entire premise here is based on a false premise that post count = how town you look. I'm also well aware that we could have lurker scum, I've mentioned it many times. Again, a closer examination of my posts would show you that I'm not locking my scumpool as the only possible scum, but the ones I currently suspect the most. Saying my reads are bad because they all can't be scum together in your opinion is pretty strawman-y. I think you and I both know that when people post scum pools theyre not saying THESE THREE ARE SCUM AND THEY ARE THE ONLY POSSIBLE SCUM. I don't think I ever implied that was the exact scum team or that I was locked into that read.

So yeah, frankly I think having a lynchpool of {Top Poster, Second Top Poster, Fourth Top Poster} strikes me as not very likely to come from a town POV. It feels like you want to case people who have said and done lots of things so you have more to work with and so you don't get accused of trying to push lurkers or so that you aren't coming off as opportunistic, which is to say that the readslist looks political and meant more to make you look like town than to find scum.

I think this is absurd. What strikes me as not coming from a town POV is looking at activity overview and going 'oh all the people in my scumpool post a lot, better remove one'. Like seriously what the fuck, would it be more townie of me to change who I read as scum because OMG ALL THREE OF THEM POST A LOT OH NO. This is potentially one of the most WIFOM-y points you could possibly make. To make a WIFOM-y counterpoint, I know how to fucking fake scum reads. I'm not just gonna pick the three most active posters, I'll pick people that I have legitimate reasons to scum read. You can read my scum games to back this up. I don't just choose three names on a non-tell related basis, thats piss-poor scum play and I think you know that and that there's no reason any scum worth his salt would be that lazy when deciding who they're gonna scum read.

I don't think you see my point which is that I don't think Oka was at all active or engaged when it came time to actually settle down and lynch someone.

The point about the scum game being similar to this game is really a corollary. I'm trying to ascertain why the fuck you don't care that the player you're reading as town based off activity and engagement completely disappeared with no explanation and no discernible attempt to sort options as D1 came to a close. This is what the question was and what I want you to answer.

You're being either purposefully daft or just evasive for some reason I can't understand. Just tell me how you can still townread him because he was engaged and active when he lurked through the entirety of us settling down on a lynch yesterday. Well, disappeared other then telling the town to just choose between two slots that flipped town, with 5 days left.

[Sephiroth]

Also want to know why Kokichi accepted the claim, that would be good.

[PenguinPower]

Joey accepted. Kokichi made the claim as he was getting run up.

[Sephiroth]

Oh.

[Gamma Emerald]

Plot twist

I recently got a short-term contract at my new job which explains why I have been less active and much busier. That being said, I don't feel like my slot is pursuing its wincon like it could and should, therefore, I will be replacing out

That being said, I am sorry koki and I would have loved to have more time and feel confident in my reads on you but it's just not the case in this game, I am not invested enough to feel competent

>I fakeclaimed mason with koki for numerous reasons, i made a little notes for you guys in the even that i had to explain myself :

Spoiler:

Hi, so i made that note @ 2:30 am just after unvoting the fish so the game hopefully slow down a bit, people will unvote koki and fishy wont get hammered before i get to control the future days a bit.

So, since i decided that i hardclaimed mason with an heavily fosed slot, i feel like i have to justify myself and prepare something that is thoughtful and exhaustive enough so i don’t get insulted for playing against my wincon (if i get killed n1 i will post this in GY) or ridiculed for my poor choice if koki turns up to be a dirty mefia.

Lets talk about mechanics. I hardtownread Gamma and oka, i dont think theres a world where those 2 ever flip mefia. That being said, Oka is an annoying chicken and hes very loud, hes pushing on Koki, a slot i can read, and distract everyone else from actual scummy people that can be an issue; namely anyone who are great at lylo like a50, seph and the likes.

Uno, I, personally, think that using the whole day to remove a readable slot that can help a lot as town, is bad for town.

Secondo, if i can clear, even temporarily koki, from everyone’s mind they might make more relevant content and find the mefia instead of focusing on him.

Thirdo, i think our D1 is naturally laid out in a way where its very believable we are indeed mason, making the claim even more tempting and relevant.

Quatro, the claim itself is a non issue. Like DVA said, i expect koki from baiting to be killed so hes either VT or a pr who gains from getting targeted. Either way, i am playing for my wincon by letting koki be a target (since hes fosed) and potentially playing into koki’s plan to bait a kill.

Cinquo, its D1 and its the beginning of the game, we have like 2 Mls so its a great situation to fakeclaim trying to get some edge over the mefia. Also, if any of us dies it confirms that the claim is false, so i couldnt clear koki’s w/o having the power to retract my claim, even in death.

Sexto, i hope you guys stll love me and think i made a good decision (hopefully hes town like i said).

That being said, i expected one of us to die anyway but the longer i kept the claim, the longer the wagon analysis and other pr claim credibility will be affected. Like an investigative role with masons is much rarer, hence the 3 claims ish makes more sens from my pov of fake masons.

Dont be mad at me please and do not just turn on koki for no reason just because he isnt clear anymore, that would be just stupid. I also claimed obviously because I wont let my replacement go back on my claim and try to justify my reasoning

@Mod : Replace me please

Thanks for being upfront at least.
Now I’d like to warn everyone that whether or not the claim was gone along with by the claimants is NOT grounds for a lock read.

[Gamma Emerald]

Kokichi fake claimed?



I feel my point brought up on D1 may be relevant after all.

FTFY

[PenguinPower]

Butchered it, more like.

not even a gif

[PenguinPower]

Now I’d like to warn everyone that whether or not the claim was gone along with by the claimants is NOT grounds for a lock read.

I'm having a hard time parsing your meaning here. Explain more clearly pls.

[Sephiroth]

I dunno, I kinda want to lynch Kokichi since they haven't really done jack shit since their lie helped them escape lynching on D1.

[Gamma Emerald]

Now I’d like to warn everyone that whether or not the claim was gone along with by the claimants is NOT grounds for a lock read.

I'm having a hard time parsing your meaning here. Explain more clearly pls.

In a couple past games scum was badly locktowned by a town player for how they handled Town fakeclaiming mason with them. I don’t want that happening again.