Micro 843 - Pop Goes the Nightkill (Game Over!)

[CheekyTeeky]

Yesterday I had PoE'd down to Maestro/Majiffy/Ari/Reck. I was flip flopping on your slot but felt PP/CoA/TTTT as related and more town. Ali had repped in for Maestro and was trying to catch up EoD so felt it was better to vote Ari out of the possible wagons.

Reck/me getting pushed on today makes me feel better about about Reck and I like manjiffy as scum for pushing from the other direction on CoA.

[the worst]

Alright I'll go do my read-up and think oj all this a little more criticalfully

I kinda don't love any of the wagons yday at face value so I kinda feel like I'm gonna end up empathising w you more after I've caught up

[Aristophanes]

Lemme know when you do catch up and your thoughts on things because if you really are town this game just got a whole lot easier! I had ypur slot as my top scumspect, where ypu remain unless I see otherwise

[the worst]

i'm really sorry for the epic wall of catchup logic but i soulread at least one other player in this list is gonna read every single word of this and correctly read me
literal tinfoil but worth a shot and i'm like, having the thoughts anyway so

Spoiler:

alright coming out of rvs
i think i'm either confbiased or just... gonna be sounding like what's in someone else's mind...

i townread my own slot and that's a relief
cheeky is kinda towny
pp is faintly town scented
ari is like uh puppy town which i don't heavily townread but for ari i get the feeling tiny townie tingles go a long way
jiffy is fine
reck is wolfy

I'm interested in his motivations for asking a question to which I have the options of:

- Answering that I'm green town, which shows nothing
- Answering that I'm red town, which is obviously not possible, and shows nothing

I'm not letting jokey ha ha im so casual now lemme lurk away Ari get away with anything here

o k

I'm strangely intimidated and intrigued by T..

Reck is less scummy than Majiffy town reading his post imo.

Why? I think Majiffy would town read me based off that post

I have entered games saying I'm town as either alignment. Unless it's a trust tell then I don't see how that's possible. Why do you think he would see you saying "I'm town" as towny rather than scummy from you?

Because it's the kind of attitude Majiffy would expect me to have as town
I think it's tonal

is an absolutely completely 100% accurate reaction to this post
it makes literally no sense and i can't understand the mindset of it at all

i get the feeling he just Took A Stance and realised after the fact he kinda didn't stick to it
"i would expect him to townread him"
"he'd expect me to have this attitude"
"i guess it's tonal"
doesn't even give me the feeling reck has convinced himself on this jiffy read

it's not game advancing in a particularly solvey way it's just a really uncomfortable stance which i really very seriously don't believe he believes

I'm interested in his motivations for asking a question to which I have the options of:

- Answering that I'm green town, which shows nothing
- Answering that I'm red town, which is obviously not possible, and shows nothing

I'm not letting jokey ha ha im so casual now lemme lurk away Ari get away with anything here

Is... is this a joke? I honestly can't tell. I mean, I'm one to not pick up on jokes, and even I can only imagine that "Red town or green town"

has

to be a joke, so a response of "why do you ask" really doesn't make sense to me.

Anyways, townleaning Cheeky and Aristo apart from that.

CoA hiveminded again
are you my long lost sister?

maestro/tttt stuff pg2 is pretty notable but i have tmi on that being a t/t

i am deeply neutral on the reck/majiffy convo wrt the townread around 51. i feel like it's one of those things i should get a ping from along the lines of "wow this is w/w look how awkward it is" or "man this is too awkward to come from scumbuddies" but it's just kinda sitting there like..chilling....

losing my rvs loltownread on penguin a tiiiny bit for the coasting
i feel like this pg1-3 is kinda. too dense to be comfortable ignoring and i keep kinda waiting for the insightful penguin i know and it's not there yet... does anyone wanna meta check penguin for coasting while the game's breaking out of rvs? not sure how i feel about pp meta check on reck if this is actually red

How much have you played with Ari?

Not much why?

Not a good reason to townread him alone.

Though I do currently have one on him.

i train of conscious'd too hard
this is towny

I'm scumreading Reck for getting all serious in the first place contrary to Penguin thinking he's town for being the fun police. I agree that Ari is likely town for the same reason. Also his moonlogic for townreading Reck seems towny.

cheeky scumreads reck for dumb reasons

in other news, water is wet

ftsfdtagslfhsdvlkbwhfioqwehufhweuifgh
blase blowoff of cheeky very legitimately stating that his earlier angle wasn't necessary along the lines of "i'm serious" isn't sitting well at all
anyway i'm getting a little tunnelly so might focus on weighting townreads a little more

about here at this point removing dead town

{tttt/tw}
{cheeky}
{CoA, Ari}
{PP}
{Majiffy}
{reck}

i'm not sure to what level bias is impacting on my ability to like objectively catchup but this feels pretty reasonably similar to how i felt analysing EOD yday + brief conversation with cheeky where she kinda sassed me for asking annoying questions

kinda not sure if ari belongs in the cheeky tier and pp/coa can share a tier
i like coa's singular post and its timing a fair bit but.. yeah

nvm CoA's re-entrance in 77 etc. is either extremely smooth pocketing or Just Good Ol Town and i'm gonna trust myself to sort that l8r

i don't recall what alignment cheeky was in any previous game

i just recall frustrating moments where cheeky has read me wrong. consistently. it's not about meta, it's about my read on her ability as a player to read me.

Ok you can be town for now Reck.

VOTE: Majiffy

cheeky do you remember what townpinged you about Reck here because this feels like...a continuation of his discrediting campaign from earlier
it definitely makes more sense but like unless reck is secretly super bad at scum he's not gonna start a discrediting campaign against someone unless he thinks he can .. actually discredit them .. i'm not sure this was a towny way to bat you away and doing it through CoA rather than just broaching it straight-forwardly isn't something that feels natural to me. :/

plus i take massive exception to the fact he's discrediting your ability to read him yet doesn't... remember your alignment .... at the time.......? going back for another bad lynch on him could be a haphazard scum move from you and it weirds me out this isn't something he's checked if he's town.

he's also engaging with you here as though he thinks you're genuinely misreading him apparently and yet has you as a nullread because he can't find any reason to actually read you?

my alarm bells aren't just going off they're literally exploding

that's quite a flip

.....still no read........

i don't recall what alignment cheeky was in any previous game

i just recall frustrating moments where cheeky has read me wrong. consistently. it's not about meta, it's about my read on her ability as a player to read me.

Actually, how can you doubt my ability to read you if you don't recall my alignment? If I was scum I'd know what alignment you were.

DING DING

i don't recall what alignment cheeky was in any previous game

i just recall frustrating moments where cheeky has read me wrong. consistently. it's not about meta, it's about my read on her ability as a player to read me.

Scum don't make real reads. Do you think cheeky is actually reading you here? You haven't indicated that you think her reasoning is being made up, despite indicating that you think it's very poor.

EXTREME DING

Also Reck I have never mislynched you so I don’t know what you're crying about.

i can't wait to see how this survives d1

i don't recall what alignment cheeky was in any previous game

i just recall frustrating moments where cheeky has read me wrong. consistently. it's not about meta, it's about my read on her ability as a player to read me.

Actually, how can you doubt my ability to read you if you don't recall my alignment? If I was scum I'd know what alignment you were.

because after im dead i rarely go back and read games.
i only recall the moment.

i don't recall what alignment cheeky was in any previous game

i just recall frustrating moments where cheeky has read me wrong. consistently. it's not about meta, it's about my read on her ability as a player to read me.

Scum don't make real reads. Do you think cheeky is actually reading you here? You haven't indicated that you think her reasoning is being made up, despite indicating that you think it's very poor.

I don't know. does it matter? I'm not cocky enough to think i can read someone's motivations on page 3

this is the kind of post that screams "nullread me" and i'm still having a really hard time seeing it come from town.

Also Reck I have never mislynched you so I don’t know what you're crying about.

cool goalposts u got there

this ongoing discred is literally bordering on openwolfing
like there's exactly 0 town motivation in positioning you as incompetent not working with you and refusing to have a read on you when you've done something that fhpov should surely be expressly AI
is this someone solving the game? i may have to like go back and check whether he sounds this demotivated but the only other time i've seen reck was as the MMSGA hydra in xyzzy and my marathon weekend game (sry4 talkin abt that) where he powertowned to a billion extents of what we're seeing here in like. 24 hours? and ate the n1 kill for being Extremely Obvtown even tho his stated reads were upside down. tbf i think he tinfoil secretly scumread the deepwolf but it wasn't like, stated itt so my memory here is a little wonkier

in other news, water is wet

It's a shame "water is wet" was real news this year

Expand on your CT read tia

..............

wtf townreading yourself

I mean...I am, yes.

Ew.

....huh?
why wasn't there more inquisition here?
i thought it would've been infinitely more interesting to get her thoughts on a slot that was more contentious. why ask about CT over Reck?

pp with good townreads in 104 but these are really safe takes

and reading my townread on my own slot a little bit come on tttt

Majiffy, Cheeky, and Reck can all be town in my book.

Expand on why you townread Majiffy and Reck? I've already gone into why I disagree on Reck, and Majiffy I think is just outright scummy.

It was here that I was about to move my vote to Majiffy for the sake of having wagons, and then I remembered that votes don't actually matter right now. Anyways, this is about where I'm at right now:

{CoA}
{Cheeky, PP}
{Ari}
{Chick, Maestro, Tx4} - Null
{Reck, Majiffy}

these reads are Intensely Good and i like the shuffledown of ari who's started to hardlurk

i'm gonna submit at this point bc like i can see CoA/tttt/ari talking a lot and i'll probably mostly focus on ari

[the worst]

Lemme know when you do catch up and your thoughts on things because if you really are town this game just got a whole lot easier!

I had ypur slot as my top scumspect

, where ypu remain unless I see otherwise

why so?

[the worst]

I didn't see where you were TRing them both until after CoA's readslist. Reading back on you saying how you liked I read the game kinda makes sense with that statement though.

But, yeah. Ok.

{Majiffy, Chickadee, Maestro} with an outside chance of {Reck} and a spacelaunched chance of {Ari, TTTT}.

i feel quite good about the fact we have two nullish/POE flips from this stage of the game lmao
unfortunately i want flips in my actual scumreads because it's too soon to work out if i can smell a deepwolf

[the worst]

Spoiler:

Town reading Majiffy and Reck based on interactions with each other mostly.

i feel like this is the kind of thing i'd townread chickadee from because in mafia we are very different people (*hides vig shot*) and this is the exact upside-down of how i see the gamestate
it's also completely reckless but like, just another reminder that their conversation was the most "mmmm ok" thing i've seen in a while

ok i can kinda see why maestro got lynched lmao but that was probably a lurker compromise hit tbqh

Maestro talk to me about Chickadee plz

That's an oddly specific callout. Did you have something specific in mind?

Yah, why me? Because I called you an edgelord?

tbh I forgot this wasn't a geriatric game - I thought I had to conserve posts - I'll put a bit more into this tonight

You've made 4 posts...
In total XD

Even in a geriatric you should post more than that hahaha

ari is getting too charismatic and my townread is slipping
ari say something amazing and/or insightful pls

{CoA}
{Cheeky, PP}
{Ari}
{Chick, Maestro, Tx4} - Null
{Reck, Majiffy}

these aren't bad at all
Move Chick down to that bottom group
and I'm with you

Ya both bad at this game

i'm kinda starting to realise half the game is with me and half the game is against me and starting to think reck/majiffy as a solve is like pretty on the nose
this is coinciding with me getting a little paranoid about ari and the fact my townread keeps slipping off pp (penguins are slippery)
one of them is surely scum though please mafia gods

Bad because their top tier scumreads are myself and most of my TRs

So when you say "most of my TRs", you really just mean Reck, right? Because everyone else at the "bottom" of that list is null. Who are your townreads, if it's more than Reck?

Also, here's a little update:

{CoA}
{Cheeky, PP}
{TTTT}
{Ari, Chick} - Null
{Maestro}
{Reck, Majiffy}

...CoA can you be my new spirit animal please
let's talk PP when i'm totally caught up (I feel like we maybe have kinda differently paced approaches to the game so hmu when you're around and i'll pray it's before eod)

I'm including TTTT's inclusion of Chickadee

Literally the only TR we share is Ari and he's obvtown

this....feels slimey...
majiffy just slipped down my reads, might be like

{many ts, one w}
{CoA, CT}
{PP}
{Ari}
{Reck}
{Majiffy}

Nah I guess I'll just have to remain blissfully uninformed

this is a really cute way to avoid doing anything

175 convo onwards is town indicative for pp and i feel like unless i'm epic messing something up here this is pushing on PoEable

184 townread on my slot is back
let's lynch majiffy today :>

i keep floating back to the way reck swung in and casually agreed with pp's PoE (excluding himself) which included Majiffy without actually committing to a read on it and allowing for the fact i hold outside paranoia of Ari rn i think it's actually s/sish

I won't dispute that my scumreads could be wrong. I think I'm probably near-100% if not 100% on my townreads.

........
spirit animal

VOTE: M
VOTE: A
VOTE: E
VOTE: S
VOTE: T
VOTE: R
VOTE: O

iso so ugly

WEIRD BABY FAM
YOU WERE SO CLOSE
WHY

I doubt voting him will have any effect...
Like that works on newer players but experienced players are far less likely to be pulled back into the thread due to a wagon on them.

Cheeky, you haven't stated many reads. Care to give us any?

Well Im feeling apathetic here. We could always brute force a win by lynching everyone that isnt TTTT, Penguin, COA.

wicked.

TTTT is probably where my vote is going. Where does the townread come from?

yeah my read on ari isn't rising
tttt scumread is kinda lukewarm and i kinda get not outright townreading him at this point but having him as a strongest scumread is uuuhhhhnnn

221 down to ~226 is towny again for penguin and i'm not sure why ari changed the subject because it felt productive
if this is the scum!penguin i've been waiting to experience i will be mildly awestruck because the real-times are nice.

@Jiffy, what makes you wary of this suggestion?

Because I think it's pretty obvious scum is manipulating the two town blocks against each other and until we parse at least one of them the idea of lynching everyone outside of one town block is a very, very bad idea.

his vote ended up on penguinpower who i flatly refuse to scumread at this point. unless something pretty dramatic changes i'm gonna be in shock.
this is not a solving gamestate read, this is fearmongering

Yeah so much manipulation in this lurky game how are there even two town blocks? There's the people giving a shit vs the people not.

Uh, sure

I guess we know which group you fall into

hhhhhhhhhhhhh

Majiffy what do you think the two townblocs are?
like who is in each from how you are reading the game?

TTTT/Penguin/COA/Cheeky
Reck/Chickadee/Ari/Myself

there's a kinda complete gaping massive lack of any tangible analysis here
who's the one who's pulling the strings?
i guess maybe this is where he sells me on pp before eod i'll chill

I think Chick is town.

I'd say scum is in {Maj, Reck, Ari, Maestro}

if CT/CoA aren't town i'm probably scum irl because the mindmelding is getting scary

Reck/Chickadee/Ari/Myself

I didn't know this was town block...Ari being included is weird.

Chick and Reck will come around on Ari

...maybe this is too on the nose to be s/s?
it'd be a weird pockety move to pull this then nk chickadee who's within the same townblock
but that's also the correct fearmongering move + it was an offwagon kill

idk i'm overanalysing this pre-emptively i'll need to catch up first

i'm gonna skim after this and just comment if anything aggressively changes my mind because i feel good and i'm becomming even more tunnelled

[the worst]

{tw}
{CoA, CT}
{PP}
{}
{}
{Ari, Reck}
{Majiffy}

bottom tier is losing weighting
if i'm being finessed i'm being finessed by mr. penguin
i don't think i'm being finessed

[the worst]

I think I'd vote CheekyTeeky probs, eventually

but Ari dies first imo

actually agree
this is either town or a good nose for a mislynch

Ari is a dumb lynch

decidedly not towny

i have always been an advocate for lynching people that lurk and do nothing

But you don't want to lynch Maestro...

maestro has not proven to me he is capable of bamboozling a town after lurking out all game

ari has

<3

This is actually really nice!
I thought I was simply the worst as scum but I guess I'm making progress!

you called?
also lol
you're doing the nancy drew 39 scumtell halp

I think everyone should use the same snapchat filter that Reck and I have used.

i will consider it to avenge you

ridiculous

@Ari

yo level with me on this one?
what makes you think TTTT rolls wolf and...decides to approach the game this way?
it feels more like a list of grievances than a scumcase

I don't jnow how to use filters on Snapchat tbh. Sorry!

yeah i just tried to do the filter and couldn't work it out someone pls be my snapchat piloting coach

Maestro probs scum for reasons. Just saying.

like this

Actively prodges until 13 hours left in discussion...

Can die imo.

more than this

Actively prodges until 13 hours left in discussion...

Can die imo.

huh allow me to introduce you to ari's iso

he has spent the entirety of the day making jokes, talking about off-topic shit, or just randomly questioning people while providing no reads of his own.

the only post that could qualify as content is 300 and even then he slips right back into contentless dreck

uh oh i'm starting to like reck my bad
flashing back to my earlier comment about wondering how this slot survived d1
i feel it

...........alisae flipped green after this
whoo
maybe ISOs look exceptionally bad? i'm not really that kinda player and reading back thru ISOs now will just firm up my confbias
the issues e takes with CoA are basically the reasons i think she is the Hero We Need

Actively prodges until 13 hours left in discussion...

Can die imo.

huh allow me to introduce you to ari's iso

he has spent the entirety of the day making jokes, talking about off-topic shit, or just randomly questioning people while providing no reads of his own.

the only post that could qualify as content is 300 and even then he slips right back into contentless dreck

Isn't that the town ari that always gets mislynched?
dunno, haven't played in awhile.

player with awful lurker meta gets pass on awful lurker meta despite winning games on terrible awful lurker meta as mafia
more at 11

> hates meta
> this

ok : ]


up to the voting phase i'm gonna try and tryhard this aggressively

[the worst]

VOTE: Alisae

Next: Alisae

firstly chickadee/tttt/pp had the right idea forcing your scumreads to vote asap i just kinda wish i actually shared these scumreads because like
i'm super curious to see what would have happened if majiffy/ari were earlier in the order

ok i can't follow chickadee's vote on tttt all that well but given i'm fairly sure she was townreading scum and she's not here to ask i can't really dwell on that

tttt alisae vote is fine.

VOTE: PenguinPower

Next: PenguinPower

i'm not really sure there was an effort made to sort pp but uh
that's policy at this point so whatever

this is just something i want out there

VOTE: Alisae

Next: Majiffy

definition of an ok vote

VOTE: PenguinPower

Next: Aristophanes

edited for format

this is more or less fine
obviously not s/s with other person on the wagon given they've flipped..

VOTE: TTTT

Next: xRECKONERx

edited for format

still strongly dislike scumcase on tttt but my pred didn't really do anything to dispel it so i'm pretty neutral towards this vote

VOTE: Aristophanes

Next: CheekyTeeky

VOTE: Aristophanes

Next: Cult of Athena

my anticipated empathy was right and i hate this a lot less than i originally thought i would
CT hard town, and actually leaning a tiny bit more towards town on reck for the desperate attempt at a last minute wagon when there were consensus options

VOTE: Alisae

this is fine
realtime interactions were pretty town indicative for CoA and pretty ??indicative for Ali
I don't think e was invested enough in the game to twist our reads on em around in a hurry
it's still poe
i can definitely sleep easy with the hammer

[the worst]

Ugh.

Also, I hate 72 hour nights.

You're ok was hoping you'd choose Ari since noone voted manjiffy.

How does the Ali flip change your reads CoA?

How does the Ali flip change your reads CoA?

Not entirely sure yet. The default response is to say "I'll have to re-evaluate", but I'm fairly confident in my most confident townreads, so it may be a simple matter of moving down the list on my scumreads.

i like this kinda recalibration moment for t/t but just a ping / supporting bias

3 - Alisae (TTTT, PenguinPower, CultofAthena)

This entire wagon is lynchable rn tbh

The Maestro wagon was always sketch and then the Alisae wagon before she could even catch up was doubleplusbad

There's scum here for sure for sure

this i hard disagree with and it's probably because you're doing as much as possible to make sure nobody believes any of your reads
talk to me about how you think this is wolf motivated (assuming you're calling 1/maybe 2 on-wagon?)

I think PP is actually pinging my tinglies the most right now but CoA's hammer was uhhhhhh superbad

how so?

[the worst]

i think that's pretty much all i'll read tonight and i feel ~ok

final reads are roughly
{tw}
{CT}
{CoA}
{PP}
{Reck}
{Ari}
{Majiffy}



all i really want to hear back on (other than if someone wants to teach me how to snapchat filter obv) is

ridiculous

@Ari

yo level with me on this one?
what makes you think TTTT rolls wolf and...decides to approach the game this way?
it feels more like a list of grievances than a scumcase


+ how my repin made CoA feel

+ question just asked to Reck

i'll be around for realtime fun til deadline

nice to be here. this list rocks. <3

[PenguinPower]

Ok...the worst can be town and swap places with Ari in my lynch order.

[Majiffy]

Towns losing this game if you side with the scumbos TW

Snap filter is gone I looked for it back on D1

[xRECKONERx]

talk to me about how you think this is wolf motivated (assuming you're calling 1/maybe 2 on-wagon?)

i think the whole maestro push d1 was scummy because it was viewed as an "easy" lynch
and then maestro flew in getting all defensive, which gave scum even more cover to keep pushing

meanwhile i wanted ari dead and thought the lack of consistency in people wanting maestro over ari made absolutely no sense whatsoever

i think the wagon on maestro and eventual hammer on alisae was shitty because
1) the entire d1 push on maestro was logically inconsistent and looked like low hanging fruit
2) the primary complaint had been centered around maestro not doing enough so then he gets replaced by a capable player and........we hammer it before that player can even catch up??

like i think that wagon was just an absolute slam dunk for scum. I don't think both scum would be dumb enough to jump on that wagon, but 1 on 1 off seems entirely too likely. scum had laid groundwork to cover their ass in case they were pushed for it by pointing to "oh well maestro didnt do anything d1". in fact, it's funny that instead of those three being analyzed, the game somehow turned into SPECIFICALLY yelling at me/Cheeky for our votes on Aristophanes instead

[the worst]

Towns losing this game if you side with the scumbos TW

Snap filter is gone I looked for it back on D1

If my head is totally on backwards help me see where i've fucked up?

Also aw crap

[the worst]

@Reck I get it. from a cursory glance at the vca I was like "how the hell does this ever happen" but I straight up think this is within Ari's scum meta and regret kinda making the assumption he was town because he was posting right off the bat.

Wrt maestro I definitely agree it could have been a scum motivated wagon at a higher conceptual level but I'm not actually sure I see the hand of evil in the way the mislynch went down. CoA's vote totally checks out to me after their real time interactions (I'd say it's probably tied with your vote on Ari for the vote I liked most at eod1)

PP's vote on em also presented as like. pretty ok to me but I'd consider that as scum motivated before I'd consider CoA's

I might be a hard sell on this because TTTT's vote was by far the weakest on the Aliwagon and I have TMI on my own alignment and stuff

But at the higher conceptual level were kinda talking at I see that as just as easily the kind of wagon I wouldn't touch with a ten foot pole as scum. Even when Maestro was in the slot he was indeed LHF and was going down flailing as hard as he could with his time - it wasn't really possible to guess how how pushes or vote's would land or whether he'd suddenly aggressively obvtown. idk we might scum super differently but I don't like trying to mislynch players who are completely unpredictable. Alisae is in the same boat categorically imo.

What's tipping you off that this is certainly scum motivated rather than possibly town motivated?

[Majiffy]

Towns losing this game if you side with the scumbos TW

Snap filter is gone I looked for it back on D1

If my head is totally on backwards help me see where i've fucked up?

Also aw crap

Easy. Look at where the lynch is and where the discussion is. Look at where the kill was.

Consider why any talk about COA and PP gets shut down. They've pocketed TTTT and CT and now apparently you as well.

[the worst]

I'm definitely reading them upside down then.
Any chance of pointing me in the right direction to seeing their scum motivation? (I'd ask how I can townread you but I think I ~know how you'd answer at this point)

[xRECKONERx]

What's tipping you off that this is certainly scum motivated rather than possibly town motivated?

I do not see town motivation in "oh this person just replaced in, let's kill them before they can contribute"

none. i dont see it at all. obviously they can't all be scum, but i have to believe at least one of them is. i dont think anyone anticipated i would get as livid about the maestro wagon as i did, there weren't any warning signs, so i dont see why scum wouldve avoided it.

[xRECKONERx]

I actually would like to see CoA lynched tbh at this point

I don't know. I keep slipping around. I think there are a lot of people who could be scum.

I think like Ari makes sense still but CoA>PP is probably how I'd lynch on that wagon

[CultOfAthena]

Yesterday I had PoE'd down to Maestro/Majiffy/Ari/Reck. I was flip flopping on your slot but felt PP/CoA/TTTT as related and more town. Ali had repped in for Maestro and was trying to catch up EoD so felt it was better to vote Ari out of the possible wagons.

Reck/me getting pushed on today makes me feel better about about Reck and I like manjiffy as scum for pushing from the other direction on CoA.

Who do you think is scum pushing You/Reck such that you feel better about him being town? Me?

Also, keep in mind that I've never been pushing You/Reck as a team. What I was trying to get across in 470 was a reason that Reck could be scum, and an observation that if either of you two were scum, it is unlikely that anyone who was voted during the N1 popcorn phase was also scum, and vice versa.

---

@the worst

, interested to hear your thoughts on Ari's posting today. I think he's gotten an not-insignificant amount townier come Day 2, not sure if you've read all the way through yet. Also interested to hear what you think of Alisae's claiming an ability to read reck and eir townread there. It certainly won't stop me if it comes down to it, but it does give me pause.

(Also, yes. Your soul told you the truth.)

[CultOfAthena]

talk to me about how you think this is wolf motivated (assuming you're calling 1/maybe 2 on-wagon?)

i think the whole maestro push d1 was scummy because it was viewed as an "easy" lynch
and then maestro flew in getting all defensive, which gave scum even more cover to keep pushing

meanwhile i wanted ari dead and thought the lack of consistency in people wanting maestro over ari made absolutely no sense whatsoever

You think Maestro was an "easy" lynch and Ari wasn't? Coming from a position of already considering Ari to be scum I could see this as at least a valid argument, but I don't see a reason to take that viewpoint in the first place.

Also, I think you have some lack of consistency of your own when it comes to wanting Ari over Maestro.

Spoiler:

Also considering, like, votes don't count in this first phase.

I would be fine with a lurker lynch on Maestro though.

that's correct

i have always been an advocate for lynching people that lurk and do nothing and people always shout me down about it and then the last game we played town went full pants on head stupid and let ari cakewalk to victory because he lurked out early game and/or contributed nothing but jokes and shit

not having it happen here

i have always been an advocate for lynching people that lurk and do nothing

But you don't want to lynch Maestro...

i think the wagon on maestro and eventual hammer on alisae was shitty because
1) the entire d1 push on maestro was logically inconsistent and looked like low hanging fruit
2) the primary complaint had been centered around maestro not doing enough so then he gets replaced by a capable player and........we hammer it before that player can even catch up??

like i think that wagon was just an absolute slam dunk for scum. I don't think both scum would be dumb enough to jump on that wagon, but 1 on 1 off seems entirely too likely. scum had laid groundwork to cover their ass in case they were pushed for it by pointing to "oh well maestro didnt do anything d1". in fact, it's funny that instead of those three being analyzed, the game somehow turned into SPECIFICALLY yelling at me/Cheeky for our votes on Aristophanes instead

1. What exactly about it was logically inconsistent? How was Maestro "low hanging fruit" any more than Ari is?
2. Replacements don't change alignment. They can give opportunities for people to tell differently than you had read before, but they don't change alignment. I already scumread Maestro, Alisae did nothing to change that.

[CultOfAthena]

I do not see town motivation in "oh this person just replaced in, let's kill them before they can contribute"

Nobody gets a free pass just for replacing in. Yes, it's unfortunate for someone to die before they perhaps contribute as much as they would have liked. It isn't like Alisae didn't have time to give reads. E was around all the way until the deadline. Again—replacements don't change alignment.

---

@the worst

– I'm interested to hear more about this:

CT hard town, and actually leaning a tiny bit more towards town on reck for the desperate attempt at a last minute wagon when there were consensus options

I've talked a little bit about why I think that Ari vote there is scum-indicative, completely separated from my thoughts on Ari. If Reck were reading the thread at all, he should have known that Ari was never getting lynched there. Given that, if he was truly so averse to an Alisae lynch—as he's made clear today—I think that he would have voted elsewhere to try to avoid it. From today we can see that he clearly doesn't townread Penguin or your slot:

I plan to still vote Ari but if forced to would vote PP/COA probably?

i have no idea where tttt stands on anything

Given this, it seems logical to me to conclude that at least one of the following must be true:

1. Reck was not reading the thread or my posts at all and did not know that I was going to vote Alisae.
2. Reck did not actually care about saving Alisae.

[CultOfAthena]

Even further, it seems to me like when it comes to reads, Reck has done nothing except unilaterally declare Ari scum and then make conclusions based off of that. It doesn't seem like he has any townreads. It doesn't seem like he has any scumreads that aren't in some way related to the axiom that "Aristophanes is scum".

Which, in general, feels to me like a very fake, very easy way to play? I don't expect that kind of play to come from town. Especially the lack of townreads, this kind of play I've found to come from scum more often than not.