Merchant's Daughter [Game Restart!]

[Nancy Drew 39]

Nancy I think I’d like to dance with you if you’d be up for it when things move more.

I appreciate that, especially after MBoS. Pencil me in as a tentative yes.

Nice! It’ll be a good chance to get to know someone whose playstyle is different than mine but also pretty sure you’re town here.

Sorry, skipped over this. Yeah, Krazy will just have to make a list.

[Nancy Drew 39]

you've only seen me as scum once and it was as a replacement into a dying slot

So, what you’re saying I’m wrong here? So “dying” is what made you seem so sketchy in that game? Really?

[Nancy Drew 39]

Hey slaxx, how r u?

On lunch at work, so temporarily better.

How r u?

Pretty decent going to work out soonish. I need some soda right now though.

Thoughts on PB and Clemency?

PB scumlean, Clem null but I would assume town if PB is scum.

I love Clemency, I do, but his partner doesn’t hitch a wagon to him if they’re both scum.

Yeah, I’ve only played this game twice but I don’t think that’s ever happened before.

[Nancy Drew 39]

{the worst, Slaxx}
{Dunnstral, Ankamius, Celica}
{PvtUrist, Nancy Drew, Alisae}
{Adelbert Steiner, Pink Ball, Clemency}
{Firebringer, Krazy}

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... &start=200

This is an ISO of scum!Fire in Halloween Dance. I think he’s different here.

[Slaxx]

(Nancy Drew, The Worst)
(Ank, Clem)
(Allo, Celica, Alisae, FB, Jib, McQ)
(Dunn, PB, PVT)
(Krazy, Adel)

I think is where I’m at. Middle it’s rough, top two and bottom two I’m relatively confident in.

[Firebringer]

{the worst, Slaxx}
{Dunnstral, Ankamius, Celica}
{PvtUrist, Nancy Drew, Alisae}
{Adelbert Steiner, Pink Ball, Clemency}
{Firebringer, Krazy}

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... &start=200

This is an ISO of scum!Fire in Halloween Dance. I think he’s different here.

Naah its a carbon copy.

[Nancy Drew 39]

you've only seen me as scum once and it was as a replacement into a dying slot

So, what you’re saying I’m wrong here? So “dying” is what made you seem so sketchy in that game? Really?

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... B%5D=28679

I’m assuming you mean this game.

[Krazy]

Yeah, Krazy will just have to make a list.

You seem really weirdly hung up on one post tbh

[Krazy]

bottom two I’m relatively confident in.

Why are you "relatively confident" in your read of me?

[Nancy Drew 39]

I support a Pink Ball/Clem Lynch. They are both useless at best and scum at worst. There's not bad option here.

Pink has been really on point as town in the games I’ve played with him.

And I always scumread him early and wind up changing.

But I don’t think I will this game. A little peeved about the casualness of the pairing.

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... B%5D=32223

Town!PB, where he was flaming obvtown

[Nancy Drew 39]

Yeah, Krazy will just have to make a list.

You seem really weirdly hung up on one post tbh

Well, you made that list before everyone had even posted. Why wouldn’t I be “hung up” on that?

RC was confirmed IC when he made his list and iirc, I think everyone had already posted. I replaced in late, so I don’t remember but you’re not IC here, so why should we trust your list?

[Nancy Drew 39]

(Nancy Drew, The Worst)
(Ank, Clem)
(Allo, Celica, Alisae, FB, Jib, McQ)
(Dunn, PB, PVT)
(Krazy, Adel)

I think is where I’m at. Middle it’s rough, top two and bottom two I’m relatively confident in.

We’re mindmelding on a lot of reads but I’d make a few changes:

I’d have Ank second and PVT and FB higher but otherwise similar.

[Krazy]

Why wouldn’t I be “hung up” on that?

Because, as you just explained, it quite clearly can't be the final list. You're acting like I'm decreeing what the pairs will be. I was making an educated guess based on how easily sortable people are, personality, and burden of proficiency.

You also haven't really critiqued almost anything in the structure of the list. It seems like the town is more or less falling into the approximate tiers I suggested. You want to be in a top tier. Clemency seems fine taking a scummy pairing at the bottom. My guesses have been more or less accurate even if the exact pairings haven't matched up.

But you seem to want to scumread me for making an educated guess on how the game will play out, when that guess is more based on: who will be likely to even be in the final six? Because ultimately the game will be won or lost on those players, so starting a conversation on the players who will be both easily townread and reliable enough to execute a plan seems productive to me.

[Ankamius]

Do your reads match the general structure of the pair lists?

[Krazy]

I actually kinda don't know what to do about the guys based on what I've seen so far

{-- Nancy Drew 39
-- Ankamius
-- Celica}

these are almost certainly the final three ladies
jibril will never post enough for a consensus read to form, Dunn has too much BoP, the worst is paired with firebringer and fire never makes final 3 here, and Clem probably isn't put in the final three for reliability reasons. Alisae is maybe the 4th final lady.

Guys are much bigger problem. McQueen hasn't shown up yet (Hi! btw), Slaxx is scumreading me (which given the usual value of his reads is a pretty big red flag for me), Pink Ball I need to think about now that he's with Clem, I still don't think Adelbert makes it into the final 3 for {reasons} although I think he's more likely final 4 pairings now, I obviously never make final three pairings, PvT kinda isn't here, and Rein literally isn't here. I might actually kinda have to flip and consider Allo in top 4.

1: mcqueen - Nancy Drew 39 -- this is obviously contingent on mcqueen ever showing up
2: Allomancer -- Ankamius -- flipping allo up here for now more due to issues with almost every other gentleman slot
3: Slaxx -- Celica -- Slaxx might just be wrong on me because I haven't started playing yet
4: Adelbert Steiner -- jibril -- this is probably fine for #4 honestly
5: Krazy -- Dunnstral -- match made in heaven
6: PvT -- Alisae -- seems fine
7:

Firebringer -- the worst

-- fine doing this early since there's no reason to push for Fire in final 4
8:

Party Boat -- Clemency

-- fine starting here although I kinda think Clem is more dragging PB around than the other way around, but it doesn't really matter which of the pair you think should go

predance -- Reinhardt

[Krazy]

Basically only the top six reads matter to me, frankly. I'm feeling fine with my top three female reads, the top three male reads are much more mutable given that mcqueen isn't here yet and Slaxx has me concerned.

Everything in the bottom rest is like whatever, I'm mostly going by who I assume will leave the dance at a random point for whatever reason or actually get voted out

[Krazy]

I could maybe put the worst on bottom pairing given I kinda don't buy that he didn't read what it meant to accept a dance before accepting Fire, but again, I literally don't care about the bottom 5 pairings outside of hoping we hit at least one scum in them

[Ankamius]

Talk to me about Slaxx? What is giving you reservations on him?

[Ankamius]

Ftr going by final 3 pairings isn't the best idea since scum can just force one of those three to leave at intermission

[Allomancer]

I would prefer Slaxx - Nancy Drew and Krazy - Alisae. Put PvT with Dunnstral then.

[Krazy]

I know some people were like "oh no we can't decide the order pre-dance, that's not gonna work!"

it's literally the only way this works.

When people are given the chance to randomly kill the person they're paired with by committing suicide, they WILL DO SO

So basically we need to take SIX people and say: "NO. PLEASE DO NOT RANDOMLY LEAVE THE DANCE. TRUST THE TOWN."

that is what the final six really means.

The actual order people die in will definitely not be what I or anyone else prescribes, it will be when Firebringer or whoever else decides "HMM MY PARTNER MIGHT BE SCUM TIME FOR ME TO LEAVE!"

or because they get angry, or because they think it will be funny, or whatever.

[Krazy]

Talk to me about Slaxx? What is giving you reservations on him?

literally my only reservation with him right now is his scumread of me since I know he's better than that

[Allomancer]

Actually no. Scum would kill Slaxx/Nancy and we'd be out two powerful players. Towning Nancy now btw.

[Slaxx]

bottom two I’m relatively confident in.

Why are you "relatively confident" in your read of me?

Up until your last post you had put more time into alt hunting than giving reads on people, were sticking to a list that had been made before players even got in the thread and using it to waive off actual scumhunting (“my list is still fine”), and downplayed putting in effort by using the average win rate of town in this setup. It all felt very half-hearted and purposefully dismissive when there were like seven different things going on in the thread you could have commented on to help us read you.

It doesn’t help you’re now pushing me because my reads are supposed to be more valuable, while you
1) Give me nothing of value to read you on besides active lurking and opaque play and
2) Provided very little of value yourself

You also have someone with basically no content at the top of your list which makes literally no sense. I don’t think you’re putting any effort into actually solving the game but plenty in to looking like you are

[Allomancer]

See here's the dilemma. We want to pack scum together so we can lynch two scum at the same time. But if we pack scum together, we also pack town together, which means scum can kill two town at the same town. Ideal system is scum/scum and town/null