Merchant's Daughter [Endgame]

[Pink Ball]

Guys I have a solid plan, hear me out.

We should all say who do you want to be the two remaining pairs for endgame, and when we reach a majority, the remaining three pairs leave the dance. That way we avoid WIFOM, we don't give scum the chance to derail conversation or distance between themselves thinking for endgame. We can see true intentions knowing which pair they want for endgame 'cause I think there's some concensus going on about some pairs. This is basically putting scum between a rock and a hard place, 'cause they have to be consistent with what they have stated during the game. Also we give more time to the remaining pairs to solve the game if by any chance the game isn't over after six flips.

I'll start, and we're going to do it popcorn way.

I want Krazy/Taly and Dann/Nancy at the endgame

Krazy/Taly should state their pairings now (I'm suggesting those activity wise; if we wait for Moment to do this we'll never get results)

[Pink Ball]

So the only flaw you can see here is that, if both scum reach the endgame, town loses, but they have to place themselves in the endgame pair to do that. The only way this could happen if both scum members are deepwolves. If that's the case, I think the game's over either way, but I'm convinced that there will be at least one red flip in PB/Worm/Gamma/TheBrie/Moment, if not two

[Taly]

DT

was scum I'm feeling

PB

as a lynch now but I want to look back at some posts later today so I can voice more of my thoughts there.

(Especially 5050 - as it gives me pause on the read their for a moment)

I do want to look at

Dr.W/TheBrie/Gamma's

vote - since they all occurred relatively quickly after mine... I don't trust this entire group is town just yet.

Nancy/Dann/Krazy

all come out as my top townreads - the collective push on

DT

was unnecessary for any of them to do as scum who could've swindled an easier lynch onto

Moment+TheBrie

- despite

Moment+TheBrie's

alignment.

I don't think I have been fencesitting in this game much at all. I've reevaluated my reads - but I've taken people's input in the game and applied pressure when I felt it was necessary. My head is not 100% in the game right now because I'm focusing a lot on studying, though I do understand the suspicion on me since not many people have voiced a scumread here... which I'd appreciate much more, as I would no longer feel like I've been buddied like with 90% of the game and probably the remaining scum too.

I think anyone pursuing a scumread on

Krazy

needs to state it NOW - otherwise, I'm inclined to think they're pushing a narrative of me trying to suicide out of WIFOM.

PB

, I thought you had a deepwolf theory on

Krazy

? Why do you want our pair to endgame now?

[Taly]

So the only flaw you can see here is that, if both scum reach the endgame, town loses, but they have to place themselves in the endgame pair to do that. The only way this could happen if both scum members are deepwolves. If that's the case, I think the game's over either way, but I'm convinced that there will be at least one red flip in PB/Worm/Gamma/TheBrie/Moment, if not two

Why put yourself in the category of possibly being scum? Do you think

Dr. W

is scum now?

[Taly]

fuck i missed 5043-5045 - this is why i dont do larges often

ehhhh.... ill think about strongest scumreads more today

[Pink Ball]

Those are the 5 people that will be flip, I wasn't stating my lynchpool lol I wouldn't put myself in my lynchpool. I think it's Moment/Gamma right now, Taly but that's the point, it doesn't matter, we are all flipping if we all agree in the endgame pairs.

I'll take your strongest townreads as your endgame pairings' choice, right?

[Taly]

Sure, but if we're going down an agreed lynchpool we need to 100% stop at any point an unexpected or town/town flip happens

and I don't think quicklynches are a good idea. We have a bit under 5 days and 5 pairs alive, so we have time for discussion.

What is your lynchpool

PB

? You're not defending yourself here or discussing your read on

Dr. W

.

[Pink Ball]

? I think I just said that I think it's Moment and Gamma, did I forget to submit that?

[Pink Ball]

And no, the whole point is letting the last pairing go to endgame with enough time to make the right decision and not making the three pairings leave in a particular order. If we decide that you, Krazy, Nancy and Dann go to endgame, thebrie and moment leave and both flip town and we stop, it was a waste of time talking about endgame pairings. As I said, I think it's imposible that there's both scum in the endgame pairs I proposed, and if they are, then we will eventually lose either way 'cause the other three pairs (that includes mine) has much more scum equity. What we are doing here is accelerating things a little so if by any chance the game doesn't end at the named pairs leave.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Gamma, interesting. What connection do you see between Moment and I and DT then?

Also it's time to get this moving along.
VOTE: Doubting Thomas

L-1

DT was consistently pushing both me and TB but voted me for most of that period and was up my ass. That tells me the TB push was likely distancing.
Also VOTE: TheBrie again

I’m just really glad he’s out of the game. He was being toxic and him throwing that game in my face like that, was really mean.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Spoiler:

My argument was that you should have had reads three days ago and that town is on the clock. I think I made exactly one post about it. Stop acting like I was talking up a storm about your post activity, that was simply me refuting the notion that there wasn't enough to work with irt your slot to get a read.

i town read SS and not scum read SS. that is not hard to understand. I think there are definite scum in Gamma or Brie. Maybe in PB, Nancy, etc if I look more into it.

As far as I know this is your reads right now. We have 5 days to solve the game. Who gets lynched today DT? Why are you continuing to bitch about me not spoonfeeding you interactions when you are presenting 0 indications of a solving mindset? Do you want Brie lynched today? Do you want Gamma to go first? Why in that order?

I have read your games and you are not this directionless as town. I feel like you just want to throw dirt at whoever is online and posting rather than working toward a gamesolve.

I thought I made my reads on other players to a certain degree so I am confused as to why you are trying to shade me this hard.

I think Gamma is obv scum but didn't realize she is partners with IC. Thinking maybe we can let them live technically just because we know for sure her partner is town and you made a fair point about gamma 'spewing'

I think Worm/PB are pretty null.

I think Brie's "reads" have been very subpar. I explained this before but you haven't read my posts properly so I will say it again

These are all of her "reads" that she made today:

Leaning towards scum on Moment, but he's not giving me anything to read. Conflicted on Pink Ball.

I went and did meta on Gamma. Her game is quite similar as town and scum, as town she's got more questions that force others to get involved and are really challenging, as a little less "Explain this" and sort of mechanical stuff, or comments on how people are playing. But it's close, and I can't tell which side this falls on. Maybe a tiny bit towards the scum side, but not enough to say anything solid. It's not outside her town range.

There's a few things that give me a scummy feel, but overall... I've not gotten her sorted out. i just know I'm not putting her solidly in as town.

In summary, she basically just says, "I lean scum. but he doesn't have any content to base my read on him. Idk Pink ball. I did meta on Gamma. I can't tell if she's town or scum. maybe a little scum. Don't have anything solid.

This is definition of hedging and she is refusing to take a stance. I think that is an overtly scum trait.

I also don't buy her explanation of insta accepting moment's invitation, as S_S pointed out

Mostly because I was afraid life would hardly let me on before the deadline. i had a couple days of full on work (waking up at three am), and I didn't know then how tired I would be the rest of the time. Bad reason.
Also, I wasn't really townreading SS then, and didn't really want her with Moment.

i don't really see scum!Moment asking scum!SS when he had a reasonable chance of town!me accepting. So currently townreading SS. Not townreading Moment, but I want to see him post again before making a final judgement.

I think this is >rand scum thing to do.

I also think Nancy constantly talking about my lover PT is >rand scum. I cannot understand why she thinks that would be NAI and scum read me for it. sounds scummy.

I think Worm's tone is townie, but I am confused as to why he completely ignored you and my interaction to talk about me at all in the last 10 pages that I read

I think Gamma has done very little solving and noone really town reads her. I think the way she got mad and attacked me out of nowehre is extremely scummy because she was blatantly lying about my progression on her. I think she can go, but I can accept why people wouldn't want to lynch her because she is lovers with an IC.

In that sense, I think Brie also has very high scum equity especially with her performance today. I haven't read Moment at all. hopefully he comes back soon. maybe ill iso him eventually.

I think nancy has good scum equity as well for oddly attacking me for not talking in lovers PT when i simply havent been on. I also think it was weird for her to give a reason for twon reading dann by using a post itt despite having lovers PT she so loves to talk about with him. i think dann is kinda townie for his posts tho and i initially town read nancy, so i personally prefer brie's lynch who i scum read harder and have no opinion on the lover for

i made all of this pretty clear in my recent posts so don't give me the "i dont see any reads from you" shit. read my shit.

i think you are just conf biasing and not reading my posts to tunnel me. i think you cussing me out is unnecessary and just provoking me really hard. believe me i can get real toxic real fast.

i don't want to go down that path so if you unnecessarily cuss me out again i will just ignore your presence and play the game around so i can at least leave a good legacy if you are just gonna deathtunnel me. i do think you are somewhat townie (despite S_S believing otherwise) and I think Taly is very townie so I don't want to get involved in a useless mess with you.

good luck with the rest of the game if you have anything intelligent to say that you want to approach me in a mature way to talk about, i'd be glad to talk. otherwise, i think you are just stuck in a tunnel and will play the game around you

So, in this post DT does say both Brie and Gamma are scum. The difference is he actually cases Brie here and I bolded a part towards the top where he says Gamma can actually be left alive. So I'd actually say he was pushing Brie more than you, Gamma.

Also good to note, right below the bolded portion, he has PB/Dr Worm as null. That, imo combined with his interactions with PB later make more sense as soft distancing.

I have experience with scum!DT and he is really clever. He fooled me in MU Suk game, so it’s extremely likey that he was deliberately trying to get himself lynched to save at least one of his buddies.

I think his shitting on me for pushing him posting in his PT, was just WIFOM to make everyone think he was afraid of it but I think it’s well within his scumrange to have fooled SS, if he had really wanted to. He was open wolfing here and he obviously knew it.

[Nancy Drew 39]

@Krazy I wouldn't hinted so hard my main if I was afraid of being scumread I was legitimately curious from your perspective in particular, that makes a lot of sense I think.

My theory of Moment/You is that you seem to have his pairing on your bottom three, but you will never push him at all. Like right now, when I haven't even explained my theory, you post a big wall where I'm bussing Moment as the first alternative. Not that those alternatives were ordered by preference, but the simple fact that you put it on first says something. What I mean is, you lynch DT/SS, they flip town, you then go for me/Worm instead of Moment/TheBrie, because from the begining of this day you started setting up that turn around on me. So is my theory wacky? No, it makes sense, based on my reads. So that's why I asked everyone if we could lynch Moment first.

But DT flipped scum? *confused*

[Nancy Drew 39]

And @Dann, do you realize that DT was taking whatever he could to protect his scummates rather than himself? Him making that posts towards me to make them feel like distancing should be favouring me instead of damning.

Would scum!DT push TheBrie like that if paired with scum!Moment? Was he trying to get a townpair mislynched before dying or trying to make them mookt good after he flipped?

But that wagon fell apart. I’ve been in a game where scum let its godfather almost get to L-1, before it fell apart. I think it’s a mistake to underestimate scum!DT. He will do anything including posting drunk, to make you townread him for that.

[Nancy Drew 39]

I think #2510 and #2947 come from scum who has realized pocketing me and riding that pair to end game isn't actually going to pan out, so they'll take a widely town read player in Dr Worm who people generally like having around instead. Then, he'll paint it as an "easy mislynch" far far in advance as a pre-emptive defense for when they fall into the PoE.

VOTE: PB

Omg I didn't read this, are you fucking blind? You're like assuming I know that you're town, when you were one of my biggest townreads and I was having fun. Letting you pair with Nancy was protown from my perspective, why the fuck would scum!me not try to insist more and put more effort in pairing with you? Scum!me pockets you 100% in that case sweetheart.

And aay what you want about Worm, I was absolutely right when I said I would become lynchbait if I paired with him. Exhibit A: you right now.

I don’t see how pairing with Worm makes you lynchbait. I think pre-dance, more people were tr him then Dann iirc.

Allo has been wrong now on 3 dead town and since I’m now hardtownreading Dann, I assuming that he was also probably also wrong on Worm. It looks like only Allo and Vedith were probably the only ones who couldn’t see through Worm’s gimmick and ignored that lack of scum motivation in his posting, so no, I have to disagree with you on that. If Worm is ever wolf here, he’s hiding it extremely well but I’m not seeing it.

[Nancy Drew 39]

P.edit. Who is currently sr Worm, @PB, because I’m not seeing it.

[Nancy Drew 39]

@Mod

I'm going V/LA about 24 hours from now for 4 days.

Should have internet access, but it's not 100% guaranteed, and i'll be busy hanging out with people. (Actually leaving morning after, but time will be filled up with packing and sleeping)

I'm not entirely happy with Moment hanging around for four days without me, but now he's back I certainly don't want to leave yet. Both in leaving the dance, and asking for a replacement. I want to keep playing. I just don't know if I really can.
I need a time machine so I can be in two places at once. (Except time travel would let me solve the game, and that would be cheating. Better duplicate myself.)


I really want to to beleive Pinkball is sincere. Tone and logic both go that way. Which is leaving me with too few scum reads.

He seems genuinely angry but if both PB/You/Moment are all town, then I have too many townreads and I am convinced that DT fell on his sword for one of his buddies and it had to be at least one of the pairings of people being pushed for that lynch, right? That would leave Krazy but I don’t want to risk mislynching the partner of my #1 townread, so I’m hoping that I’m right about Krazy town and SS was just dead wrong about that.

[Pink Ball]

Dann was townread by almost everyone on pre dance, I think Urist was the only pushing him. And stating a townread on Mr. Worm on pre dance doesn't mean he's not lynchbait bdcauset of lack of presence

[Pink Ball]

And Dr Worm had DT and Moment as scumleans, TheBrie as scum and paranoid about you, Nancy. I'm pretty sure you have asked this before

[Nancy Drew 39]

Guys I have a solid plan, hear me out.

We should all say who do you want to be the two remaining pairs for endgame, and when we reach a majority, the remaining three pairs leave the dance. That way we avoid WIFOM, we don't give scum the chance to derail conversation or distance between themselves thinking for endgame. We can see true intentions knowing which pair they want for endgame 'cause I think there's some concensus going on about some pairs. This is basically putting scum between a rock and a hard place, 'cause they have to be consistent with what they have stated during the game. Also we give more time to the remaining pairs to solve the game if by any chance the game isn't over after six flips.

I'll start, and we're going to do it popcorn way.

I want Krazy/Taly and Dann/Nancy at the endgame

Krazy/Taly should state their pairings now (I'm suggesting those activity wise; if we wait for Moment to do this we'll never get results)

So the only flaw you can see here is that, if both scum reach the endgame, town loses, but they have to place themselves in the endgame pair to do that. The only way this could happen if both scum members are deepwolves. If that's the case, I think the game's over either way, but I'm convinced that there will be at least one red flip in PB/Worm/Gamma/TheBrie/Moment, if not two

Probably but why are you mentioning your name in this list and are you sr Worm now?

Also, I am convinced that at least one of DT’s buddies was in jeopardy of being lynched over him and that doesn’t include Gamma, so I think we should get the buddy DT was obviously saving before we make that decision.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Dann was townread by almost everyone on pre dance, I think Urist was the only pushing him. And stating a townread on Mr. Worm on pre dance doesn't mean he's not lynchbait bdcauset of lack of presence

Ank thought both Dann and Krazy could be scum and SS had me, Dann and Krazy in his bottom 3 pre-dance, so I don’t see how that follows?

[Nancy Drew 39]

Dann was townread by almost everyone on pre dance, I think Urist was the only pushing him. And stating a townread on Mr. Worm on pre dance doesn't mean he's not lynchbait bdcauset of lack of presence

Ank thought both Dann and Krazy could be scum and SS had me, Dann and Krazy in his bottom 3 pre-dance, so I don’t see how that follows?

Krazy is a strong scumread, Taly

I think ultimately it doesn't matter what we choose

I suspect that whoever his partners are, they're either Dannflor or not teaching endgame regardless of what happens

[Pink Ball]

Nancy, two endgame pairs. Go.

[Nancy Drew 39]

NACNY i already SAID THIS..

KRAZY ALLOWMANSTER and FREEBRANGER are TOWN-TOWN IN MY MIND AND HEART

This game needs a vig, seriously.

Just leave worm out

Ank hard defends Worm here.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Yeah you two should pair

How confident are you Thomas is town?

If I'm on a good wavelength, then Thomas is most likely town

Allo is more of a wildcard

But Ank obviously was very wrong on this.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Nancy, two endgame pairs. Go.

Why don’t you want to wait for a few more flips, to determine that?

I also can’t parse Gamma yet and Urist hasn’t commented on her posting in their PT.

But rn, I would probably go with Dann/me and Krazy/Taly, because of my being pretty much locktown on Taly but I’m a bit concerned that you are so certain that both scum has to be in in Worm (I’m assuming you wouldn’t be including yourself in that)/moment/Brie and Gamma.

I think you’re probably right but what if you’re wrong? Have you considered that?