Open 753: Nomination Mafia [Game Over!]

[Vedith]

Is a no lynch an option?

[scum reading]

Didn’t mean to quote lol

I just took it as I scared you into voting there.
Why Volxen?

1511 1537

[scum reading]

And 1510

[Fuscosco]

volx is the weakest player in that pool.

Its a shit strat to gladiate yourself against a better performance, regardless of alignment.

[Fuscosco]

we aren't rioing volx, thats lazy and he and rcslot are my townbloc

[Fuscosco]

irre we can wait for you! GL brother

[Vedith]

volx is the weakest player in that pool.

Its a shit strat to gladiate yourself against a better performance, regardless of alignment.

Why can't there be 2 Scum in the list?

[Fuscosco]

i guess. but it's absolutely suboptimal imo. and wifomy as hell.

[Vedith]

It's a good play.
Actually, putting all 3 in would be the best option.
Sacrifice the weaker looking Scum for the game.

But you're probably right. Volxen not Scum. Probably coward Scum putting all town.

[scum reading]

we aren't rioing volx, thats lazy and he and rcslot are my townbloc

So you'd rather go for other 2 townies that provide info as well? I see, weird judgement, I'd rather have game solving than silence.

[volxen]

So, I (a player that took a fair amount of heat on day one) am nomimated alongside two heavily townread players (Shoshin and Irrelephant). It's obvious to me what's going on here: scum wants me out of the game this day phase. That's why I am being forced to "compete" against two heavily townread players, to force me specifically out of the game.

These even-numbered day phases are alternatives to night phases in a standard game. Just like scum doesn't want a red flip during night phases, they don't want a red flip during even-numbered day phases, because this is there opportunity to force a green flip. If they are going to bus they are going to do it during an odd-numbered day when anyone can be lynched, they aren't going to waste an even-numbered day to bus when that should be used to guarantee a green flip. If someone votes for me because they think all three of {Shoshin, Irrelephant, Volxen} are town that’s one thing, but the notion of town-Shoshin, town-Irrelpehant, and scum-Volxen is illogical because its bad scum play to bus on an even-numbered day. It's even worse than giving up a nightkill in a standard game. It only makes sense for scum to nominate one of their own if said scum is already heavily townread and unlikely to be lynched among the three nominees in the first place. I was not heavily townread on day one, so it wouldn't make sense for scum!me to be nominated alongside two of the most heavily townread players, if Shoshin and Irrelephant are both in fact town.

Normally, there are three major reasons for nightkilling someone: 1) because they are suspected of being a town power role, and/or 2) because they are obvtown, and/or 3) because they have accurate reads. There are no town power roles in this game, I clearly did not establish myself as obvtown on day one, and I didn't have any scumreads that I confidently pushed on day one (I got scum vibes from Scumreading but I wasn't extremely confident of him being scum). So why was I nominated alongside two heavily townread players, as opposed to having three heavily townread players being the nominees?

Because someone very familiar with me and my meta is on the scumteam

. If the nominees were chosen based on their day one play alone, it makes zero sense for me to be chosen, because a more optimal use of today would be to force one of the heavily townread players (Shoshin, Irrelephant, Auro, or Alonzo/RadiantCowbells) out of the game. If all three members of the scumteam were unfamiliar with me and my meta, then I think that they would have chosen three out of those four listed players to guarantee that one of the strongest townread players is taken out of the game today.

But it does make sense for me to be nominated if someone who knows me and my meta very well is on the scumteam. There are only two players in this game who are very familiar with me and my meta, and they are

Auro and Irrelephant

. They are both familiar with my playstyle (especially my

town playstyle

), and the fact that I am not always consistent with my posting habits as town, and that when I am town, it often takes me a while to get to the point of being strongly townread or locktown. So if one or both of them is scum, it makes sense that they would nominate me alongside two heavily townread players and try to force me out of the game early on before I have been able to establish myself as locktown or at least strong town. And that is exactly what this nomination list is about, forcing me out of the game before I become unlynchable. And if one or both of them are scum, they both are also aware that the longer that I stay in the game, the more likely that I am to catch onto them.

Here is what I am confident of. There is no way that I would have been nominated alongside Shoshin and Irrelephant if the scumteam was entirely comprised of people unfamiliar with me and my meta.

I am convinced that at least one of {Auro, Irrelephant} is scum based on me being one of the nominees

. Both are very familiar with me and my meta, but out of the two of them Auro has much more firsthand experience with me due to us hydraing together.

VOTE: Irrelephant11

[Vedith]

That was a good post.
I actually don't want to lynch Volxen.

Spoiler:

I didn't read it because it had more than 10 words.

[Shoshin]

I read the big bold parts. I'm gonna borrow that tactic, good way to make sure the important bits get read.

[ejjinami]

Vote Count 2.2

Shoshin:

(1) Alonzo

Volxen:

(1) scum reading

Irrelephant11:

(1) volxen

Not Voting:

Clemency, DoubtingThomas, Irrelephant11, Vedith, Auro, Fuscosco, Shoshin

With 10 players alive, it takes 6 votes to lynch.

Day 2 deadline is in (expired on 2019-03-19 05:19:27)

[ejjinami]

Is a no lynch an option?

• No-Lynches will not be allowed.

[Vedith]

I read the big bold parts. I'm gonna borrow that tactic, good way to make sure the important bits get read.

Did you agree with the bold parts?

[volxen]

VOTE: Irrelephant11

[volxen]

@mod I had already voted for Irrelephant11, but it looks like that was missed in the vote count so I voted again.

~thanks, fixed
ejj~

[volxen]

I read the big bold parts. I'm gonna borrow that tactic, good way to make sure the important bits get read.

I was hoping everyone would read all of it...

[Vedith]

Volxen just hard claimed double voter.
There is no role and this is an open setup. Scum claim?

[Shoshin]

Let's talk a bit about scum Irrelephant, Auro.

1. He's more tryhard as scum than town. It might not seem that way in the thread but he's extremely active in scum PMs. He constantly talks with partners about how & what town tells to drop in the thread. He talks about how to emulate his town game. He talks about who to manipulate, who to pocket, who to mislynch, who to bring with them to LYLO. He's not the sort of player who just wings it.

2. As scum, he actively pockets players he thinks he can pocket. He also tends to townread townies more than scumread them, especially earlier in the game. I'm not sure if he's aware of these tendencies, though my guess is that he's doing it because it's similar to his town game. The fact that he townread you isn't towny for him because he'd do it as scum too. The fact that he wanted others to townread you also isn't towny for him because he'd do it as scum. The reality is, you weren't ever getting lynched yesterday so there wasn't any harm for scum Irrelephant to strongly push you as town.

3. Scum Irrelephant nominates himself maybe 75% of the time because he knows getting nominated puts him closer to locktown. Yes, it's WIFOM. It's also how Irrelephant thinks. It's similar to how RC thinks in some respects. That said, Irrel wouldn't nominate himself with two obvious townies (e.g. Auro/RC/Irrelephant leads to Irrelephant's death). He nominates with threats who look scummier than him. Volx is a strong choice because he's been so absent from the game that he's easily mislynchable, plus there's always a risk of Volx becoming a threat later in the game. I'm a strong choice because I'm unfairly tunneled by a few players, RC randomly imploded by calling me scum, so if there's ever a chance to get me mislynched, this is it. I'm also by far Irrelephant's strongest threat so scum Irrelephant definitely knows I need to be mislynched if he's going to win this game.

That said, there's a strong likelihood that scum didn't nominate any scum. I'm trying to find scum among townies so obviously the "case" on either Irrel/Volx will look weaker than normal. You need to be thinking about who the scum would be among this group if there's scum. I know it's not me. I know that Irrel's reads feel fake (especially that read on Fusco). I know that scum Irrelephant wants to keep people who will defend him alive (i.e .you), so that would explain why you weren't nominated. These things point to scum Irrel relative to Volx. I also think scum Volx nominates you because he knows you're a threat to him, in the same way that I'm a threat to Irrel.

[Vedith]

The thing is, you could have copy and pasted Voxlen's post and I'd have no idea.

[Shoshin]

I did, don't worry.

[scum reading]

So, I (a player that took a fair amount of heat on day one) am nomimated alongside two heavily townread players (Shoshin and Irrelephant). It's obvious to me what's going on here: scum wants me out of the game this day phase. That's why I am being forced to "compete" against two heavily townread players, to force me specifically out of the game.

These even-numbered day phases are alternatives to night phases in a standard game. Just like scum doesn't want a red flip during night phases, they don't want a red flip during even-numbered day phases, because this is there opportunity to force a green flip. If they are going to bus they are going to do it during an odd-numbered day when anyone can be lynched, they aren't going to waste an even-numbered day to bus when that should be used to guarantee a green flip. If someone votes for me because they think all three of {Shoshin, Irrelephant, Volxen} are town that’s one thing, but the notion of town-Shoshin, town-Irrelpehant, and scum-Volxen is illogical because its bad scum play to bus on an even-numbered day. It's even worse than giving up a nightkill in a standard game. It only makes sense for scum to nominate one of their own if said scum is already heavily townread and unlikely to be lynched among the three nominees in the first place. I was not heavily townread on day one, so it wouldn't make sense for scum!me to be nominated alongside two of the most heavily townread players, if Shoshin and Irrelephant are both in fact town.

Normally, there are three major reasons for nightkilling someone: 1) because they are suspected of being a town power role, and/or 2) because they are obvtown, and/or 3) because they have accurate reads. There are no town power roles in this game, I clearly did not establish myself as obvtown on day one, and I didn't have any scumreads that I confidently pushed on day one (I got scum vibes from Scumreading but I wasn't extremely confident of him being scum). So why was I nominated alongside two heavily townread players, as opposed to having three heavily townread players being the nominees?

Because someone very familiar with me and my meta is on the scumteam

. If the nominees were chosen based on their day one play alone, it makes zero sense for me to be chosen, because a more optimal use of today would be to force one of the heavily townread players (Shoshin, Irrelephant, Auro, or Alonzo/RadiantCowbells) out of the game. If all three members of the scumteam were unfamiliar with me and my meta, then I think that they would have chosen three out of those four listed players to guarantee that one of the strongest townread players is taken out of the game today.

But it does make sense for me to be nominated if someone who knows me and my meta very well is on the scumteam. There are only two players in this game who are very familiar with me and my meta, and they are

Auro and Irrelephant

. They are both familiar with my playstyle (especially my

town playstyle

), and the fact that I am not always consistent with my posting habits as town, and that when I am town, it often takes me a while to get to the point of being strongly townread or locktown. So if one or both of them is scum, it makes sense that they would nominate me alongside two heavily townread players and try to force me out of the game early on before I have been able to establish myself as locktown or at least strong town. And that is exactly what this nomination list is about, forcing me out of the game before I become unlynchable. And if one or both of them are scum, they both are also aware that the longer that I stay in the game, the more likely that I am to catch onto them.

Here is what I am confident of. There is no way that I would have been nominated alongside Shoshin and Irrelephant if the scumteam was entirely comprised of people unfamiliar with me and my meta.

I am convinced that at least one of {Auro, Irrelephant} is scum based on me being one of the nominees

. Both are very familiar with me and my meta, but out of the two of them Auro has much more firsthand experience with me due to us hydraing together.

VOTE: Irrelephant11

This defence is solid, I'll reconsider my vote.

UNVOTE:

[volxen]

That was a good post.
I actually don't want to lynch Volxen.

Spoiler:

I didn't read it because it had more than 10 words.

I think it's entirely possible that all three of Shoshin, Irrelephant11, and I are town and that a green flip today is unavoidable. But I could see scum!Irrelephant pulling a gambit like this by including himself among the nominees if he feels confident that he can push my lynch based on my day one play, and then after I flip green he tries to argue that all of the nominees (including him) are town to get himself falsely locked in as town.

But like I said, I am convinced that one of {Auro, Irrelephant} is scum. So I want to lynch Irrelephant today, because either he flips red, or if he flips green then I know that Auro is scum and I can push him on day 3 (they could be scum together, but Auro becomes confscum to me if Irrelephant flips green). Additionally, I seriously don't think scum would be bold enough to nominate

TWO

of their own, so if we lynch Irrelephant today and he flips red, I will have Shoshin as near locktown based on that alone.