Mini 2059: Secrets of the Anuket Topaz [Over]

[Chara]

(I'm also going to point out that i'm like ... the only person here who has played this setup as scum before so its pretty easy to check how i would play this as scum - and i'm so ridiculously out of my scumrange for this kind of game)

this is why skitter is town now, for the record.

Nim: this reveal changes everything, that's why my reads changed. this isn't a normal game. skitter's consistent pushing against Flubber means a

lot

more in this context, and there are certain things she simply has a hard time with as scum that she's done here. if she's scum here she's in the same position she was the last time she played this setup as scum, and it would show.
this is to Ank, too.

and i didn't 180 on anyone. i'm pretty surprised by how

you

180ed on your reads here because i asked Creature to come back to the thread. did you not read the part from my list where i said i was townreading him? i can't locktown him, though i wish i could, because there's always the possibility he's gotten better. but no, i'm not lynching him. i think he's town and if he is he should come in here and show the rest of the list he's town, too. and it would help my small lingering paranoia.

finally, the read on you: like i said, the actual setup shook things up quite a bit. you're in leftovers because i'm putting less stock in my townread on you now, given Ank's comments about your abilities as scum and what you would do as scum. i'm not sheeping Ank's read on you, but i can't put you as a townread or use you for PoE when i'm not sure, i have to think of worlds where you might be scum.


now, saying that, i'm not particularly interested in lynching Nim. here's the reason:
assume Nim is scum. if Reck is town, Nim would want to encourage me lynching him and get me back on her side.
if Reck is scum, Nim is trying to save her buddy.

so there's no reason for me to want to lynch Nim here. if he's town, i believe Nim is too. if he's scum, same thing.

however, i'm currently pretty convinced on Reck scum given my other reads. i do need to lock down other ones, however.

Elbirn is admittedly one of my less-strong townreads, but i still don't think scum him makes himself a target (seeing as scum loses if he gets lynched now) like he has. Reck also opposed the Flubber wagon, but he did so in a far less controversial way.
Elbirn also feels pretty independently town to me.

[Chara]

Ok lets now talk about why you wanted xtoxm over flubber yesterday, vefore the ic claim

i really hated Xtoxm's play. i laid out why i thought he was scum yesterday, as well.
i thought Flubber was scummy too but at the point i voted Xtoxm while talking to Flubber my thought was that scum would be less likely to interact with me this way, so Xtoxm was the better choice.

[Creature]

Damn I'm feeling so sick today.

[Nimueh]

Flubber was on the tris wagon

It's not impossible that scum dog piled on tris (1 more scum on that wagon) since that would make Brigitte look a lot worse upon a tris flip

Also just noting here that skitter was the only slot that didn't vote for either lynch wagon

Just noting (:

Yes and she also had the weird votepark on Flubber, which she got called out on.

Flubber/Chara/Skitter as the scumteam would not be a complete shock to me at this point. I just don’t believe Chara’s reads progression post-Flubber flip is sincere.

Tris was his #1 push, pre-flip and post-flip she’s practically townlock. Tris could still be town, I’m just not buying Chara’s sudden readchange on her. It’s almost like we are seeing two different Chara’s pre and post-Flubber flip.

Yep, i agree, when i lose by lynching my buddy i try to get him lynched about four times over the course of the dayphase, great plan

(I'm also going to point out that i'm like ... the only person here who has played this setup as scum before so its pretty easy to check how i would play this as scum - and i'm so ridiculously out of my scumrange for this kind of game)

I’m now thinking Flubber/ with one or both of Chara/Tris or maybe I should sheep Ank and you on Reck. The problem is, I no longer trust Chara. She’s the only one whose reads did a complete 180 as a result of that flip. And Chara just happened to be online soon after and unlike Ank, didn’t really seem terribly shocked by it, so even if Reck is scum, she could still be bussing.

As you pointed out, Chara was not on the right side of Flubbergate, so when I compare Ank’s and your reactions with Chara’s, she looks even worse.

[Chara]

in my post above, there's also the possibility of scum Reck and town Nim who reacted very strongly to me putting her in my leftovers pile. i actually find that very likely, too.
but i'm most concerned with lynching scum today. if we fail then another scum will escape and

then

finding the last one will be more fruitful.

[Chara]

And Chara just happened to be online soon after and unlike Ank, didn’t really seem terribly shocked by it, so even if Reck is scum, she could still be bussing.

scum me is never bussing here, one scum lynch and scum loses. scum can only pretend to bus at this point.

[Nimueh]

then again everyone fell for the stupid IC claim so i wonder if where the wagons went even mattered.

Well, i didnt

yes, you did. you unvoted him and the wagons went back to Xtoxm. disbelieving it didn't matter when his goal was only to survive and he was given that.

And I, someone who has never before played that game, didn’t? @Chara?

[Chara]

i wasn't shocked because i just read the game skitter was referencing where she was scum, and have

been

referencing it for myself when reading her.
Ank's right about the IC claim being clumsy, but it still worked. even those who didn't believe it still unvoted him and let him escape.

i was on the wrong side of Flubber, sure. that's on me.
but your reads

should

be shaken up by that flip. it changes the game dramatically. in a normal game, bussing is seen very often and is less useful for reading scum. in this game, scum couldn't risk it. towncred from bussing is simply not worth having to confirm 5 townies. and now, scum can't go all the way on a bus at all.

[skitter30]

Ok lets now talk about why you wanted xtoxm over flubber yesterday, vefore the ic claim

i really hated Xtoxm's play. i laid out why i thought he was scum yesterday, as well.
i thought Flubber was scummy too but at the point i voted Xtoxm while talking to Flubber my thought was that scum would be less likely to interact with me this way, so Xtoxm was the better choice.

So at some point yesterday i noted that there just werent 7 people willing to lynch flubber, and i noted that the resistance to it was sketchy af since although he had a couple of townreads nobody could articulate a good reason to townread him (reck's 'his votes feel town!' Is ... not good in light of the flip)

So i'm pretty sure scum are in that group of around 6 people or so who couldnt/wouldnt lynch him. I'll go back to the relevant vc later (ie after work prob) to see who exactly is in that group and i'd bet thats at least one scum is in there, if not both

And yeah you're in that group for me rn. I know Elbirn's in that group too but i'm fairly confident he's town anyways (he wanted *neither* of the two wagons, and wasnt just opposed to flubber)

[Chara]

And I, someone who has never before played that game, didn’t? @Chara?

what does this matter? i don't believe any town saw this coming. i didn't, skitter didn't. unsure on tris but if town she also didn't. having experience with the setup didn't end up mattering (though it should have, and that's why i consider myself missing it to be bad.)

[skitter30]

I’m now thinking Flubber/ with one or both of Chara/Tris or maybe I should sheep Ank and you on Reck. The problem is, I no longer trust Chara. She’s the only one whose reads did a complete 180 as a result of that flip. And Chara just happened to be online soon after and unlike Ank, didn’t really seem terribly shocked by it, so even if Reck is scum, she could still be bussing.

I have a really hard time believing your reads when they seem to be predicated on how people are reading you

[Nimueh]

in my post above, there's also the possibility of scum Reck and town Nim who reacted very strongly to me putting her in my leftovers pile. i actually find that very likely, too.
but i'm most concerned with lynching scum today. if we fail then another scum will escape and

then

finding the last one will be more fruitful.

How do I know you’re not just pocketing me here? And it wasn’t just your 180 on me. I reacted “very strongly to”, it was also your comment about Creature needing to “obvtown” it more. If you know who I am, there isn’t any reason for you to doubt my obvtown Creature read here, especially when he was early on Flubber wagon. I don’t see how Flubber flip should have any impact on your Creature read, whatsoever.

[Chara]

And yeah you're in that group for me rn. I know Elbirn's in that group too but i'm fairly confident he's town anyways (he wanted *neither* of the two wagons, and wasnt just opposed to flubber)

i wanted Xtoxm over Flubber. i would also have voted Flubber if Xtoxm didn't get votes. i said as much.

i'd like your opinion on my Reck case.

it sucks and it's tiring but i'm fully prepared to go all in on showing you just how town i am. grill me, wagon me, accuse me, i'm here for it. i can't get lynched today because then the most easily-lynched scum will get away.

[Chara]

If you know who I am, there isn’t any reason for you to doubt my obvtown Creature read here, especially when he was early on Flubber wagon. I don’t see how Flubber flip should have any impact on your Creature read, whatsoever.

i don't know who you are. i only know you as Nim.

and i hadn't realized Creature was an early presence on the Flubber wagon. that does change things. i'd have appreciated being told that before all of the other things.
still not interested in lynching him today, just as i was before.

[Nimueh]

And Chara just happened to be online soon after and unlike Ank, didn’t really seem terribly shocked by it, so even if Reck is scum, she could still be bussing.

scum me is never bussing here, one scum lynch and scum loses. scum can only pretend to bus at this point.

Alright, so Reck and you are never S/S then.

[skitter30]

If you're town here i think that's prob going to have to happen. I just got to work so i only like skimmed your reck case cuz i'm voting there anyways.

But i'd like to pick up on these threads tonight after work

[Chara]

and Nim's pattern here is near-identical to a situation i had with Nancy Drew in a previous game, in terms of our reads on each other. it rings more towny than not, and even if i'm wrong, i simply don't see a scenario where scum Nim reacts this way to me wanting to lynch town Reck.

pedit: right. i've decided to 1v1 him at this point, barring somebody else scumclaiming.
VOTE: Reckoner

as far as being online goes: i'm regularly up extremely late and tend to check mafia threads for developments. evidence is all over the site. i posted immediately after because i was refreshing when the day rolled over.

[Nimueh]

i wasn't shocked because i just read the game skitter was referencing where she was scum, and have

been

referencing it for myself when reading her.
Ank's right about the IC claim being clumsy, but it still worked. even those who didn't believe it still unvoted him and let him escape.

i was on the wrong side of Flubber, sure. that's on me.
but your reads

should

be shaken up by that flip. it changes the game dramatically. in a normal game, bussing is seen very often and is less useful for reading scum. in this game, scum couldn't risk it. towncred from bussing is simply not worth having to confirm 5 townies. and now, scum can't go all the way on a bus at all.

If I had played that Extradition game, there’s no way in hell, I would have ever believed that IC claim. That’s why I asked him, if he was a D3 IC.

[Chara]

If you're town here i think that's prob going to have to happen. I just got to work so i only like skimmed your reck case cuz i'm voting there anyways.

But i'd like to pick up on these threads tonight after work

i have the feeling it will and it sucks.
but sure, let's do this later. i'm fairly confident it will work but it isn't going to be fun!

[Nimueh]

UNVOTE:

[Chara]

If I had played that Extradition game, there’s no way in hell, I would have ever believed that IC claim. That’s why I asked him, if he was a D3 IC.

that's good on you, but it still happened this way.

it's not even just Extradition, i've played/spectated at least three games like this. granted, one was older, but i still remember it.

[Nimueh]

I’m now thinking Flubber/ with one or both of Chara/Tris or maybe I should sheep Ank and you on Reck. The problem is, I no longer trust Chara. She’s the only one whose reads did a complete 180 as a result of that flip. And Chara just happened to be online soon after and unlike Ank, didn’t really seem terribly shocked by it, so even if Reck is scum, she could still be bussing.

I have a really hard time believing your reads when they seem to be predicated on how people are reading you

How do you keep forgetting I never sr Enter?

[Chara]

What's Charas plan here exactly?

what are you thinking about me here, Ank? it's true i never fought the Flubber lynch, but i was also always going after Xtoxm.

[Nimueh]

If I had played that Extradition game, there’s no way in hell, I would have ever believed that IC claim. That’s why I asked him, if he was a D3 IC.

that's good on you, but it still happened this way.

it's not even just Extradition, i've played/spectated at least three games like this. granted, one was older, but i still remember it.

I haven’t and I would have been a lot more suspicious - particularly in this setup, if I had. I though at the worst, it was fake and we lynch him today. What actually happened never occurred to me, because I’ve never played any game like this, with a similar mechanic.

[Nimueh]

I’m now thinking Flubber/ with one or both of Chara/Tris or maybe I should sheep Ank and you on Reck. The problem is, I no longer trust Chara. She’s the only one whose reads did a complete 180 as a result of that flip. And Chara just happened to be online soon after and unlike Ank, didn’t really seem terribly shocked by it, so even if Reck is scum, she could still be bussing.

I have a really hard time believing your reads when they seem to be predicated on how people are reading you

How do you keep forgetting I never sr Enter?

ngl i kinda want to vote nimueh; she feels really flat here for her and

i'm kinda surprised that she's not scumreading enter here tbh

pedit

WHY ARE YOU ASKING MY OPINION!!!!!!