Mini 2059: Secrets of the Anuket Topaz [Over]

[skitter30]

i mean if nobody in that group were scum we're basically saying that in a game where scum have to conftown 5 people if scum get lynched they were both on wagon and the lynch *still* couldn't happen

[Chara]

well, when you put it like that...
but surely 1 scum on and 1 scum off is likely? i don't think both scum off is likely either, is the problem. hunting off the Flubber wagon is the normal thing to do, and considering scum just lose outright upon any of them being lynched

now

, i really expect bussing happened. they had to have been planning ahead. you all did in that game and our team did in the laser tag game i linked.

[Chara]

Reck makes the most sense as scum here. more than NMSA. i'm trying to get past how he's approaching this day, but considering it got me to unvote him i wonder if scum Reck's approach was exactly what he meant to do.

[skitter30]

Spoiler:

I'm looking for scum between you and succinct at the moment. Has that not been clear?

no, i can see what you're saying you're doing, but how is that vote useful?
all your recent posts are just replies to me. it doesn't feel like sorting.

Xtoxm pushing tris here after Brigitte flipped town after pretty carelessly choosing to keep his vote on Brigitte even while the tris wagon built up, with absolutely no comment on any of tris's posting beforehand, is either lazy or scum.
and calling out Ank for "lining up mislynches" when he's literally done that is a major lack of gamestate awareness, same as his shading of Ank without any real evidence when she's a pretty impossible lynch at this point.
he just isn't really doing anything. if he's town he needs to get in this game. if he's scum he's coasting. i think it's the latter.
okay with lynching Flubber.

Part pressure, part not letting it go to waste, part not being impressed by succinct's current responses. Basic mafia 101 stuff. This is useless shade.

and this is different from skitter's vote on you how...?

(this post would be actual shade to you. you're welcome!)

looking town, being town. same thing really. :>
i sure am putting a lot of effort into that.

you're not out of my scumlist, but i'm more convinced i'd rather lynch Xtoxm over you. that's all. assigning all of this motivation that isn't there to my posting, the way you're doing it looks more like suspicious town. and the vote on me in reaction to my poke, too.

i'd like feedback on this, however, considering the suspicion on Flubber.

you say that like this conversation was pointless to me.
VOTE: Xtoxm

so i didn't like this convo on your end super much, because i'm not sure how you ended up on with suspicious town here or why your vote ended up on xtoxm in middle of it; i thought that this convo was quite awful on flubber's end (esp. with his subsequent vote on you) and is one of the reasons why i thought he was scum

really? it just looks like he's given up.
what i find unlikely is town Xtoxm flailing like this.

pedit: deep sigh.

or like this immediately after i get spooked off of xtoxm and go back onto flubber

Xtoxm's play is frustratimgly unhelpful if town and

i want him to be scum. the petulant part of me wants to tell town Xtoxm "i'm town too, talk to me about

something

' but he refuses to be helpful or explain himself and the takes he puts out continue to be bad,

like saying skitter's read change is scummy in spite of the very long amount of time it took for her to make that change. it's so much easier to say he's scum.
Flubber's IC claim is at least concrete, we can just wait for day 3.

i also don't think tris has been towny.
but in spite of being frustrated with Xtoxm's angle here if he is scum, and wondering if he's town for that, i also hate his angle as town. the only reason to think he's town is the AtE, and it's a bad reason and i know that.

i'll lynch tris if it comes to it but i feel Xtoxm is objectively better.

the bolded i think is townie; waiting for the ic claim is idk

@chara some comments inside the spoiler
so like on balance i think you've said some things that feel townie but like the continued insistence of xtoxm over flubber in this context is just :/ not that great given the flip and given the setup and given where i'm looking for scum rn

like while the flubber wagon was building you were repeatedly pushing xtoxm, and i did not get the vibe that you would really switch to flubber unless it was like necessary for a deadline lynch or something (hence why i didn't count you as a potential vote for flubber there) and then after the ic thing you were just 'ok he claimed ic we can figure it out tomorrow' and idk in this setup that whole trajectory kinda looks partner-y to me

how annoyed you were at xtoxm did feel genuine/kinda townie tho

[skitter30]

well, when you put it like that...
but surely 1 scum on and 1 scum off is likely? i don't think both scum off is likely either, is the problem. hunting off the Flubber wagon is the normal thing to do, and considering scum just lose outright upon any of them being lynched

now

, i really expect bussing happened. they had to have been planning ahead. you all did in that game and our team did in the laser tag game i linked.

i mean yeah
that's why there basically has to be at least one scum in that group imo, the gamestate would be so incredibly bizarre if there weren't that i honestly don't understand what scum could/would have been doing there; it just doesn't compute

idk if both off or 1off/1on but i would be the game on at least one scum being there and so i'm going to find them

the wagon itself is kinda gross too tbh; not sure how i'd rank the people on wagon as most-to-least likely to be scum

[xRECKONERx]

What a nice, effective, pro-town way of answering my question. I can't remember if I did this already, so VOTE: reck.

Do you think it's pro-town to ask questions I already answered multiple times?

[skitter30]

i'd like your opinion on my Reck case.

which bit are you referring to here?

[xRECKONERx]

Sure. As you guys can probably tell by my crappy play and join date, I'm new and bad at reading people, so I usually start off games with very few strong reads unless someone has been really scummy. I had no clue on flubber for a while because he had barely posted because he was sick. I had a positive gut reaction to Ank's post, and I was fine agreeing since I still had nothing on Flubber at that point. My flubber vote (which would have confirmed five town had he actually been lynched) came at a time when I hated the level of activity and just wanted the game to start moving or end. When you flipped your vote from flubber (who ended up flipping scum, incidentally) to xtoxm (who ended up flipping town, incidentally), I thought it looked odd enough to ask you why. Your response was extremely useful and explanatory, and not at all a passive-aggressive way of avoiding it.

I'm not sure how you turned me asking you for your progression on Flubber into attacking/discrediting me, but good job.
Again: it's not like I just hopped off him for no reason. I told you I already explained it and didn't feel like explaining myself again. That's not scummy. That's called being frustrated that you're half assing the game and not putting any effort in, then expecting other people to put in effort for you. I have no idea if you're scum or town, I'm not gonna bend over backwards to help you do the basic act of playing the game.

[Chara]

skitter, almost everyone said "okay, we can figure out Flubber tomorrow" after the IC claim. including you, Ank, Creature, and whoever else.
and i was scumreading Xtoxm more than i was Flubber. i agree it looks bad after the flip, but nothing i can do about being wrong earlier. but i wasn't about to switch to Flubber unless i thought Xtoxm wasn't likely to be lynched, because i was scumreading him more.

and the annoyance was real, and unfortunately one of the things i feel a lot more as scum than town.

[Chara]

i'd like your opinion on my Reck case.

which bit are you referring to here?

everything i posted at the beginning of day 3.
read it again if you like. do you think i can fake sorting through posts and doing my best to solve off the cuff like that? because i really can't. my scum solving is pretty good but in comparison to the fever at trying to win that i felt then it just doesn't compare.

[xRECKONERx]

Reck makes the most sense as scum here. more than NMSA. i'm trying to get past how he's approaching this day, but considering it got me to unvote him i wonder if scum Reck's approach was exactly what he meant to do.

I'm not sure -- do you really think as scum, I would panic vote and unvote my buddy TWICE? Like, I haven't been scum in a game in at least 3 years, probably closer to 4 years. I don't know what my "meta" is and meta is trash anyway, but I think my

skill level

shows that I'm not godawful at this game.

[Chara]

the bolded i think is townie; waiting for the ic claim is idk

????
who didn't do this??

[Chara]

or like this immediately after i get spooked off of xtoxm and go back onto flubber

is it weird that i would be annoyed you hopped off the player i was scumreading more to the one i was scumreading less?

[skitter30]

bleh idk how well i said this
basically none of that is impossible or particularly unlikely to come from town!you but it *also* looks exactly what i think a partner would be doing there which is why i'm feeling kinda :/ about it rn

[Chara]

so i didn't like this convo on your end super much, because i'm not sure how you ended up on with suspicious town here or why your vote ended up on xtoxm in middle of it; i thought that this convo was quite awful on flubber's end (esp. with his subsequent vote on you) and is one of the reasons why i thought he was scum

it ended up on Xtoxm because i was between the two of them at the time and i thought Flubber was being paranoid in how he kept assigning all these motivations to me. it's hard to talk about in hindsight because now i know he's scum so i just feel oblivious to have not seen how bad it was.

[skitter30]

i'd like your opinion on my Reck case.

which bit are you referring to here?

everything i posted at the beginning of day 3.
read it again if you like. do you think i can fake sorting through posts and doing my best to solve off the cuff like that? because i really can't. my scum solving is pretty good but in comparison to the fever at trying to win that i felt then it just doesn't compare.

yeah so i think your start of day3 is pretty townie; there's a couple of things there that i thought were unlikely to come from scum
like i think that *you* have been kinda townie but your associatives are ... not good and it's preventing me from being comfortable townbinning you rn

i read your reck thing and i don't have much to say about it honestly

[Chara]

bleh idk how well i said this
basically none of that is impossible or particularly unlikely to come from town!you but it *also* looks exactly what i think a partner would be doing there which is why i'm feeling kinda :/ about it rn

it just really bothers me that you keep bringing up the IC thing when you and Ank also immediately unvoted when you heard it. like... yes, that's what a scumpartner would say there. it's also what a lot of town would say.

i know, yes, it looks bad that i wanted Xtoxm over Flubber and pushed him over Flubber.
the townpings you're getting, that you've noted multiple times this game? listen to those. there's a reason they keep showing up. scum Chara is a coward, it's a lot harder for me to get those pings as scum.

do you think scum Reck reacts like he's doing here? am i wrong for wondering about it?

[skitter30]

Like out of everybody who has posted, skitter and reck are the two that haven't tried to bounce back and re-search for the scumteam

I don't like this

i don't think this is particularly fair or accurate wrt me

[xRECKONERx]

I am realizing I have zero read on Nimueh and that ISO is intimidating to even start to jump into.

NMSA is a mixed bag for me, but the wild random vote on Flubber is sticking out to me as a reason to show hesitance on a scumread.
Chara is town.
Succinct is town.

Something keeps bugging me about Ank. I don't know what it is. Every logical bone in my body says she should be town but I keep getting premonition flashes of "this is the mastermind that pulled this whole thing off" and it eats away at me. I think Ank's continued reprisal of "omg this is so outside my scum range" is what's really bugging me. I hate self meta, especially when it is repeated over and over as a way to clear yourself as town.

I read skitter as town earlier. That has kinda faded. Esp since skitter's biggest read on Flubber was "gut-town" which is a very comfortable place to put a scumbuddy in your reads list. Flubber "moved" between null and back up to town. That sticks out as weird early movement for me. skitter calling out the resistance to the wagon yesterday has me thinking townier, and then the "i forgot flubber was in the game and would vote him" comment looks town too. I dunno, there's an outside chance skitter is playing a masterful scum game but those two comments seem natural enough to me.

Also just to defend myself: Flubber did the EXACT same thing to me that I did to him (voted, then turned around and said "wait no" and quickly unvoted). That is just so bizarre to me that people could read those interactions as SvS. It's just wild to me. He went out of his way to avoid me after that, I think because I was the loudest person calling him town, so why not just ride the idiot townie who is screaming to the game how town you are?

anyway, my overall reads list probably looks something like this, gun to my head

TOWN
Succinct
Chara
---gap---
tris
skitter
Ank
---gap---
NotMySpamAccount
Creature
---gap---
Elbirn
Nimueh
SCUM

elbirn/nim are kinda there by virtue of me having no read on them yet and having like at least some reason to argue everyone else on that list could be town (which is better than 0 reasons)

[skitter30]

bleh idk how well i said this
basically none of that is impossible or particularly unlikely to come from town!you but it *also* looks exactly what i think a partner would be doing there which is why i'm feeling kinda :/ about it rn

it just really bothers me that you keep bringing up the IC thing when you and Ank also immediately unvoted when you heard it. like... yes, that's what a scumpartner would say there. it's also what a lot of town would say.

i know, yes, it looks bad that i wanted Xtoxm over Flubber and pushed him over Flubber.
the townpings you're getting, that you've noted multiple times this game? listen to those. there's a reason they keep showing up. scum Chara is a coward, it's a lot harder for me to get those pings as scum.

do you think scum Reck reacts like he's doing here? am i wrong for wondering about it?

it's not the ic thing that's bothering me the most, it's the not being willing to vote/lynch flubber before the claim (the vc i quoted is before the ic claim - that's where the resistance was and where i think scum is and you *were* part of that
while i was going through your iso i saw the ic thing so i mentioned it but i don't find it inherently scummy really, only worth noting in the broader trajectory

and yeah the townpings are why i'm not full-out scumreading you rn and why i'm not liek trying to lynch you or anything
because you *have* said a bunch of things that i don't think come from scum

but like i'm trying to sort through the flubber associatives thing and i can't just drop your part of it because there were some townpings

wrt to reck - idk i'm still kinda reading through what was posted today and i'm undecided; let me get back to you once i've finished reading

[skitter30]

If you're town here i think that's prob going to have to happen. I just got to work so i only like skimmed your reck case cuz i'm voting there anyways.

But i'd like to pick up on these threads tonight after work

so why did you vote Reck?

cuz his reason for not voting flubber was handsdown the worst

[xRECKONERx]

the vote hopping and lack of giving a fuck about appearances said townie to me, idk what you want. it's my honest opinion

[skitter30]

then i kept seeing him do scummy things and would vote him only to remind myself "wait shit he did that stuff early game that makes him town" so i unvoted

like i guess idk why that early stuff made such a strong impression on you that it kept on making you unvote even after seeing him do scummy stuff later

[skitter30]

like the most defense i can give you is that if i was scum w/ flubber, im intelligent enough not to be so fucking awkward around him as to vote him then unvote TWICE.

i mean, yeah, fair idk why scum!you would do this either but like ... there's gotta be scum offwagon and your reason for townreading him was awful so like this defense is basically asking me to believe that you wouldn't be that bad/obviously associated with your partner if you're scum and i have no way of knowing if that is or isn't true really

[skitter30]

nmsa is still also being awful but like on some level i think he might be lynchbait and i'm not sure i want to spend the one mislynch on him if he's town if that makes sense?