Newbie 1951 (Day 4)

[teacher]

[emps]

eh fuck it VOTE: creeper

[Farkran]

Proper Mason play is to convoluted crumb and provide the key.

I have come around to the opinion that it is a good idea to crumb generally, to trump scum counterclaims in a gamestate where that makes sense. Plus as PR I generally scum it up a bit.

PEdit: I think you played well, and also bled through a bit (enough that Skitter sided, and I was tight), but I also think you guaranteed your NK as scum would know you were indeed PR -- that was the logical conclusion of PR spec, too. I think better to use your systems, but also follow common practice a bit more.

I can agree to this - however, my role in this setup allowed for some SERIOUS risky plays, i wouldn't have done that if i was any different role. I didn't care at all about being SRed. It was also kinda one of the staples in my strategy here, to provide n1 wifom so that i could survive as lynchbait who could turn into conf!town instantly, also reaction testing everyone else in the process. Risky, but in the end it has been rewarding.

[Farkran]

VOTE: creeper

just to make sure

[teacher]

When nexus comes online, he will lock, but we can chat until then.

[Farkran]

Also, "reaction test" wasn't even part of our terminology. Here, you basically townread someone if they just say "hey, i was only reaction testing!" - you would have been insta-lynched in my world. Paranoid town was the norm.

[teacher]

Also, remember @Menalque - no kill is perfect game.

And no, its not an insta-townread (see Creeper's attempt). It has to be a logical play, with logical follow through. Hammer testing and what NMSA at least claimed to do makes sense.

[teacher]

Also, if youre a PR who is unfortunately also a universal townread, a lolhammer is a good way to avoid the nk.

[Selynee]

Ahh, lol at NMSA's reaction testing not actually being a reaction testing

[Farkran]

Also, remember @Menalque - no kill is perfect game.

And no, its not an insta-townread (see Creeper's attempt). It has to be a logical play, with logical follow through. Hammer testing and what NMSA at least claimed to do makes sense.

Eh, in this game i could say i have reaction-tested emps back in page 15 or something, but didn't know i could even say it was a reaction test because i didn't know what it refers to. My bad for not educating myself before joining in. I was looking to play a FM game since forever this summer, when i found this site i was like "omg i'm in". Didn't read anything else.

[Farkran]

Oh, and the mason group usually (but not always) had a Mason Leader role who could recruit any citizen but died on scum!recruit, disallowing any further recruit for the rest of the game. He did, however, kill any cult!recruit except the cult leader.

[teacher]

yea, thats essentially the neighbor in this setup.

[teacher]

ou guys definitely do not play by associations, do you? Back in my days everyone and their dog would have put me and nmsa together as obvious partners.

Definitely not. COmmon approach here is VCA/NKA/Sheep dead town. We value progressions over associations because scum tend not to obviously associate. This game had stronger D1 associations than most Ive seen, and I've lynched scum D1 in like half my games (new queue skews the value of D1 far over normal).

[teacher]

And never lynched scum D1-D2, because some other player almost always had stronger associatives.

[teacher]

something else pops up.

Masonry?

[Menalque]

yo I just got on, so creeper scum and fark is masons with who?

[Menalque]

oh, NMSA

why did you hammer before I could post about skitt?

[teacher]

Because its like midnight where you are and you had all day but didnt?

Nothing stopping you now friend.

[NotMySpamAccount]

oh, NMSA

why did you hammer before I could post about skitt?

cause you and creeper are the scum team and skit is town.

[NotMySpamAccount]

Because its like midnight where you are and you had all day but didnt?

Nothing stopping you now friend.

that too

[NotMySpamAccount]

but pls no kill tonight so we get the perfect game.

[teacher]

@Sely, you want to make it an all-town wagon on Creeper? Ive never had a 7person wagon D1

[Menalque]

Oh my... VCA analysis is useless? I mean i come from another site and all but it seems to me that you analyze all the wrong things in here. Analyzing progression flow is useless especially in d1, reads flip all the time due to sheer lack of info, people playing tricks on others for reaction test purposes, post count skyrocketing so it takes a lot of rereads from all povs to get a clear idea of what's going on on people's heads, and stupid rvs/rqs to boot (i mean stupid as in they don't make a lot of sense and are usually used to get people to speak). I update my readings a billion times during d1s and so far i only got a secure position on nmsa and emps, everything else may go from TR to strong SR and vice versa in a second.

D1 you mostly analyze VCA and behavior, then possible pairings depending on vca/behav, finally you may look at words used while hunting for scumslips or strong towntells. Actual words used (aka progression) have little importance if not backed up by actions (aka relevant VCA).

i.e. emps has potentially bad VCA but very strong behavior and i can see no pairings on him.

This is how to play imho.

I did forget sushi was on my train at some point though.

short answer: yes, VCA is useless bc scum is aware of the fact that VCA and you don't know if they're going to WIFOM it

like, my first scum game me + my partner both hopped on the wagon for the D1 lynch but people defaulted to "1 on, 1 off" making one of us less susp

so the problem is you never know in a given game if that game is conforming to conventional wisdom, or if scum are aware of that and playing against it, making it worthless

same reason why scum!ranges are worthless -- you never know if the given game you're in is the one where someone is choosing to expand theirs

[Menalque]

I mean I'll try to get it out before nexus locks the thread

[Menalque]

hmmm, you're very wrong on me, so you're not getting a perfect game even if you do mislynch me tomorrow

still, this does suggest prob not teacher!scum bc I don't think he'd suggest such a bad fakeclaim from creeper?