Mini Normal 2098 - Game Over! (Mafia Won)

[profii]

I dont think shirk responsibility is the right description. It was his first vote on the first page and in the actual post 24 he said he was sheeping Garmr, so one could argue he had already shirked the responsibility by not coming up with a reason and just sheeping someone...

It was RVS though so making a mountain out of a molehill comes to mind

[NorwegianboyEE]

I'd like to hear from Kraeg, not you Profii.
Thought it's interesting how much you defend him.

[Billy Pilgrim]

@Norwegian, I know you're new here. Have you read any of the articles on the wiki for strategies on how to play?

[NorwegianboyEE]

I've read some of the wiki articles, but i have not done any in-depth research no.

[NorwegianboyEE]

It was RVS

Was it now?

Game is already out of RVS after a few posts 'cause of Norwegian.

[profii]

VOTE: Billy Pilgrim

[Billy Pilgrim]

VOTE: Billy Pilgrim

Man I really wanted a Reds block and now you want to kill me? Sad.

Can you walk me through your progression? Because I reread your iso and I couldn't see how you got here. It didn't help that the vote didn't have anything explaining it.

[profii]

I'll caveat this with it is arguably pre-flip associatives and as much as people tend not to like them, i dont have a problem with them as much as usual

When I read through your iso, you go from kinda indirectly defending Kraeg, to then saying he is null (which on it's own was a surprise) then there was a point you said you wanted to vote him, just for inactivity, which, firstly I've gone over my issues with policy voting and secondly, this was someone you were earlier saying was trying to sort the game so, not really prime candidate for a PL, given the numerous inactive players.

Admittedly, you didn't vote him - however, because I've got this pre-flip narrative in my brain my brain was saying well you dont want to vote your pal.

I can get the quotes etc if you really want but I'll just leave it at that for now.

Kinda just wondered how you'd react to a naked vote.

[Billy Pilgrim]

I'll caveat this with it is arguably pre-flip associatives and as much as people tend not to like them, i dont have a problem with them as much as usual

When I read through your iso, you go from kinda indirectly defending Kraeg, to then saying he is null (which on it's own was a surprise) then there was a point you said you wanted to vote him, just for inactivity, which, firstly I've gone over my issues with policy voting and secondly, this was someone you were earlier saying was trying to sort the game so, not really prime candidate for a PL, given the numerous inactive players.

Admittedly, you didn't vote him - however, because I've got this pre-flip narrative in my brain my brain was saying well you dont want to vote your pal.

I can get the quotes etc if you really want but I'll just leave it at that for now.

Kinda just wondered how you'd react to a naked vote.

Ooh cool, a misrep. Now to figure out why you made it. Where did I say I wanted to vote Kraeg for inactivity? I remember saying I wanted to vote Emperor for inactivity to conjure him into existence, but don't remember saying it about Kraeg. Can you find that for me? And if so, why'd you mess that up?

[Billy Pilgrim]

Also, theory question what value do pre-flip associatives have if you don't have the flip? Although I guess I like the thought because that is part of what I was referring to when I said there were two reasons I could see scum!Garmr taking the air out of the Kraeg wagon. But I had a second reason which is why I asked Garmr the question about how many people he thought were gonna scumread Kraeg when he took the air out of that wagon.

To be honest, it's still early but Kraeg is still in my D1 Lynch pool. At the moment, I think it's him, Mohab, and Emperor. Skellen Garmr and you are out at the moment. Norwegian and Luca are sort of in a territory where I may be able to be talked into them.

[Billy Pilgrim]

Kinda just wondered how you'd react to a naked vote.

Kinda figured this. Did you get anything?

I haven't been able to get anything out of reaction tests. I think they're too easy to fake. Similarly I don't put much weight in slips. But if you got something great.

[Jackal711]

VOTE COUNT 1.6

Mohab500 (0) -
Skellen (0) -
Luca Blight (2) - Garmr, Emperor FlippyNips
Garmr (0) -
Emperor FlippyNips (1) - Billy Pilgrim
profii (0) -
NorwegianboyEE (1) - Kraeg
Kraeg (3) - NorwegianboyEE, Mohab500, Skellen
Billy Pilgrim (1) - profii

Not Voting: Luca Blight

ACTIVITY NOTES:

With 9 alive, it takes 5 votes to lynch.

Day 1 deadline is Friday, September 13th at 10:00 am PDT which is in

(expired on 2019-09-13 10:00:00)

[profii]

UNVOTE: Mohab

No need to be on a vanity wagon. Felt like turning up the pressure on the Kraeg wagon may help sort, but the Garmr/Luca 1v1 produced some interesting content.

I will have some thoughts on this later.

When I skimmed it, Luca felt town. Wanna go back through the isos though.

I read the bold bit as "No need to [leave my vote on Mohab, as it is] a vanity wagon. Felt like turning up the pressure on the Kraeg wagon may help sort [that inactive slot], but the Garmr/Luca 1v1 produced some interesting content [so can convieniently vote 1 of those 2 {Garmr} as I know they are both town players, meaning I dont have to get stuck on scum wagon]


I am aware this is very pre-flippy kraeg/billy scum team.

I also note your distinct change in buddying tone from red block to oh you are mis repping me. I dont think I am. Based on the following:

50: So he's [kraeg] getting scumread by two people because he came in trying to sort? I don't know that I agree with Kraeg's reasoning, but points for trying. - this is you querying someone attacking Kraeg, white knighting, if you will

62 making sure someone is/isnt scum reading kraeg

70 i felt like because kraeg comes in and makes a point about your VLA, even though, as i mentioned at the time, you were actually posting (and have been doing so a lot more than he has) it was a good cop/bad cop act - i mean, we can vote kraeg together at this point if you want?

71 again querying people who have an issue with the vla point, again white knighting if you will

73 giving kudos to garmrs "slayers gambit" theory - i.e. acknowledging there is something scummy about him, despite never having expressed this yourself, whilst also giving momentum to a theory from Garmr that Kraeg isnt actually scum.

I am guessing you are going to say I've got that all wrong, because despite what I am reading as white knighting, you said Kraeg is null/need more info in 92 ? I just find it a weird progression on your part...

ok so 109 does offer some motivation for that. You call it shading and your exception to the vla stuff is consistent with 71


and ok I'm bored of getting all the post numbers and linking them back but here is the crux of the issue:

there is an element of a white knight vibe coming across as i've highlighted above
there is also a consistent explaination that you acknowledge the surface level scummy-ness of Kraeg and are probing the voters to see who goes where

given those voters have dissapeared I think it's probable i am off the mark and you are actually sorting so I'll unvote

UNVOTE:

I'll even try and summon EFN with you

VOTE: emporer flippy nips

[profii]

Also, theory question what value do pre-flip associatives have if you don't have the flip? Although I guess I like the thought because that is part of what I was referring to when I said there were two reasons I could see scum!Garmr taking the air out of the Kraeg wagon. But I had a second reason which is why I asked Garmr the question about how many people he thought were gonna scumread Kraeg when he took the air out of that wagon.

To be honest, it's still early but Kraeg is still in my D1 Lynch pool. At the moment, I think it's him, Mohab, and Emperor. Skellen Garmr and you are out at the moment. Norwegian and Luca are sort of in a territory where I may be able to be talked into them.

obviously as scum are informed i think they will surely give away signals even if they try their hardest not to so i dont mind taking the gamble on trying to spot team work pre-flip

[profii]

also what makes Skellen clear of your lynch pool?


I am thinking norweigan is trying to sort the game so i dont want to lynch him and i doubt a luca lynch will go through today

[NorwegianboyEE]

Profii, if you’ve started coming around to the idea that Kraeg might be scum i suggest you vote him first rather than probing for his potential teammate (s) on day 1. I read on the wiki scum-hunting tactics, and it’s stated that scum team speculation is not much use until the suspects lynch has gone through and flip has confirmed alignment.
Though i commend you for trying.

[Mohab500]

I'd like to see those 5 players take a stance on Luca vs Garmr and I will accept any of SvS, SvT, TvT as long as it comes with a rationale

Seems like I missed this so I'll give a quick response as I am catching up; Garmr is the scummier of the two (as I've previously stated), and this doesn't not look like an SvS to me at all. I am leaning more SvT here because of Garmr, but TvT is still possible.

[Mohab500]

I haven't really delved into the possibility of a Garmr + Kraeg scum team, on the surface from what I remember it looks a bit unlikely but not impossible.

I am not too good with these pre-flip team associations, but I don't get why you stick these two together? (sure, they are both your scumreads) Particularly if your first tendency is that is a bit unlikely?

I am not sure if I missed something regarding this question; I am sticking these two together because they're my current scumreads. I think it's unlikely they're both scum together. I am just pointing out my thoughts on them for everybody to see.

[Billy Pilgrim]

@mod - Flippy looks to be in prod range. Maybe if I can't conjure him, you can poke him back?

[profii]

Profii, if you’ve started coming around to the idea that Kraeg might be scum i suggest you vote him first rather than probing for his potential teammate (s) on day 1. I read on the wiki scum-hunting tactics, and it’s stated that scum team speculation is not much use until the suspects lynch has gone through and flip has confirmed alignment.
Though i commend you for trying.

Well the theory only works with a billy kraeg pairing and I've reconsidered billy

Kraeg is in the needs to post more camp

[Emperor flippyNips]

im here don't kill me

[Emperor flippyNips]

trying to get some work done with some peeps so I'm not going to be reading back a lot. but if someone wants to talk & refer me to something then I'll jump back & check it out

[Emperor flippyNips]

@mod~thanks for the grace period

[NorwegianboyEE]

That's it Emperor? Give us your thoughts on recent events at least.
- Kraeg bandwagon, approve or disapprove?
- Who's your main townread/scumreads?
- Gramr and Luca 1v1, do you think it's TvS, SvS or TvT?

[Emperor flippyNips]

VOTE COUNT 1.6

Emperor FlippyNips (1) - Billy Pilgrim

Day 1 deadline is Friday, September 13th at 10:00 am PDT which is in

(expired on 2019-09-13 10:00:00)

billy what's this thing we're doing? I get busy you vote me, I jump back in you don't vote. & here we are, you voting me again