Large Normal 223 | New Beginnings | GAME OVER

[Cliff Booth]

Dave can't be scum in this game right

[Carcalilly]

simplistically there's no way in hell I'm staying up later than I need to to consider anything other than your direct interactions

let's play a point game, ele/cliff

Spoiler:

Hectic. Name 5 or more normal/non-bastard roles. all but one of which aren't your role, and one that is. Randomize the order. I want to see if I'm right about you.

what a stupid thing to ask

What a stupid thing to say

Fight me. I'll gladiate you

great start huh
0/0

Spoiler:

Just looking through the roll list and sorting people into 1 of three categories this is what I come up with

Town - Cliff, Rick, Hectic, Eevee, Gamma, Hop, carca, profii
Null - Kop, Billy, Fish, garmr, dave, bob, skellen, youare
Scum - Sharon, JJD, roster, Tchill

After our interactions so far I can't say I understand why I'm the first thing that comes to mind for "town". But I'm flattered.

@elements in case this wasn't apparent I want to know why I'm the first thing you thought of as town

The reason you're first is because your name in the first in the player list on page one that I think is probably town.
It's not an ordered list. Just a quick gut sorting into piles.

This whole ordeal was just strange and pretty useless. Eleme explained what it was (though it's an odd thing to do and sure, can be considered lamist, tho eleme directly explained that this was derived from hardly anything) So I understand why you can find this fluff or noise.
Cliff, I'm going to assume you noticed the same thing and wanted to question the action further, but specifically asking why he has you specifically under town is an odd way to do it. "Why do you think I'm town" is a weird question but I guess in retrospect it's not scummy because "why would scum ask that"
(0/0)

Spoiler:

I enjoy my Elements vote even more now

I was enjoying it to until people still didn't want to join in.

This interaction and the fact that you find a self-vote hypocritical makes me wonder if you even know the intention. So I have a question for you cliff.
Eleme's self vote. What do you think he was trying to accomplish?
(1/0)

Spoiler:

I'm down to lynch elements or hopkirk so far. My gut tells me I want to lynch Gamma but that's why I don't want to lynch gamma. I could compromise on kop

A few votes have been made on others with reasoning that could easily also be applied to me. That makes me think that maybe people think I'm something that I'm not?

Ooh, let me guess. People think you're town but you're not?
VOTE: Cliff Booth

BTW that's not just a joke vote. I happen to agree that the reasoning [not scumhunting] applies to you. Prove me wrong.

I'm not ready to scumhunt yet. But it was really easy to bait you into voting me. I'm gonna enjoy the feeling for awhile.

Btw your votes look really weird in a vacuum

A few votes have been made on others with reasoning that could easily also be applied to me. That makes me think that maybe people think I'm something that I'm not?

I can dig it.

I don't like any of theses posts
VOTE: cliff

Valid opinion but no reason given makes this hardly valuable.
(1/1)

and the rest of elements posts want me to consider Dalton and cliff as the same person. But I know better. I know better....

[Carcalilly]

Spoiler:

UNVOTE:
VOTE: elements

point me a direction where this whole "elements is scum" thing started and I'll give you your point back, because I legitimately cannot find it
(2/1)

Spoiler:

quick lynch elements go!

When he flips red I will have no choice but to scumhunt, and all of you will have no choice but to sheep me. it's a win/win really

same as above

And then there's post 1217 which is probably the only actual relevant content on this interaction. //Newpost
Doing this I kind of realized how little prerequisites this actually has. Your previous interactions were minimal for how you guys are acting right now. I get that looking into how they're playing is how you're getting these reasons and I'm a bit too early to expect much.

I'm going to be honest to myself and say this was a waste of time, but I already wrote it, so fuck.

[Carcalilly]

I'm not really sure if it's my place to challenge 1217 and it would be better for elements do address it directly so I guess I'll wait.

However, I do want that question answered by cliff. The self vote seems to be a heavy factor to you and I don't understand why you think there's an obvious scum motive in it.

[Carcalilly]

errrrgh something is urging me towards the pro-element campaign in this whole debate

Dame here. I just want Elements to define the "elements" on which he bases his reads though before I commit to it.

Jesus christ---

[Carcalilly]

but of course you both have this wonderful charm that caused the wagon's trailing your ass, such as

AKA WIFOM

There's at least 2 opportunistic scum on my wagon btw.

Like these two posts when I read them for the first time made my gut shrivel to the size and consistency of a raisin. They hurt. I can feel my soul decaying every time I read them.

[Carcalilly]

And very stupidly there are a couple things that made me think, what if they're scumpartners and they just got totally fucked up and have to choose one or the other to bus.

I feel like if I knew who cliff actually was I'd be able to decide whether to throw this or not.

But you all should tell me to throw it. It's a fucking stupid idea and I don't know where I got it from but one or two posts/instances had implied for 0.00001 second that this is the case. So Idk.

[Carcalilly]

particularly if we lynch elem. and the flip red I have an odd feeling I'll have reason to suspect cliff.

the latter is a little less foreshadowed but I guess it HAS to follow the same logic, huh?

[Carcalilly]

besides that I have a little list, in order. town top.

gamma
hectic/hopkirk
garmr
yag/profi
Bob/billy
Jjd
Dalton/Kop
Eevee/Eleme
Cliff
Dave/tchill

I'm aware I haven't explained the lowest end much yet. I'll do that someday.

[davesaz]

VOTE: Carcalilly

[Cliff Booth]

/facepalm

[Carcalilly]

I foresaw that and I'm still surprised

[Cliff Booth]

Why are you acting like the foundation of my scumread on him is fact that he self voted? Why do you think that the self vote wasn't hypocritical given his explicit stance on the subject earlier? How does he gain a "point" for me pointing out the hypocrisy?

Like seriously what value are you seeing in his self-vote? Are you saying it's a town tell.

That was the least of my concerns in my case on him but since you want to act like my case revolves around it, I'm trying to kill that accusation quickly.

TBH your whole stance on our 1v1 (if you can call it that) just seems like you sticking up for elements while giving no reasoning for it. For how "strange and useless" the ordeal seemed to you it really appears you're putting a questionable amount of effort into trying to convince people to like him more while still putting some distance between the two of you via readslist.

I really thought Carcalilly was town before this but that logic makes me feel all sorts of weird. I need to sleep on my thoughts for now

[Cliff Booth]

Actually I'm not sure what I'm smoking but you didn't put as much into the self-vote topic as I thought. But it still seems awkward that out of all the questions you could ask me, it's about that.

I'm also disturbed that elements flipping red would somehow make you scumread me harder. That's actually just nonsense

[Cliff Booth]

It also fit's in line with a scum!you motive to distance yourself from him (like you have been) while also trying to make people like him?

What do you think happens when he flips red after something like this? You really think there's a chance in hell that I look like a better rope candidate than you in this scenario?

[Cliff Booth]

Why don't you think his early criticism of JJD vs a townread on me was weird? especially with JJD being so low on your readslist that would certainly be something that interests you? no?

[Gamma Emerald]

162 posts??? What is wrong with you, Carcalilly?

Catchup momentarily paused.

Nothing is wrong with Carcalilly lol
Let her enjoy the game

[Cliff Booth]

Actually I'm not sure what I'm smoking but you didn't put as much into the self-vote topic as I thought.

actually disregard this stance. I'm still mad about you painting my case the way you did. Somehow skipped over this gem on my reread before #1238

The self vote seems to be a heavy factor to you and I don't understand why you think there's an obvious scum motive in it.

clearly I need to sleep. I want to hear from elements before I talk about this more anyway. I'd rather see some organic defense from him than have all his answers handed to him on a silver platter.

[Cliff Booth]

one last thing though

VOTE: Carcalilly

please don't do this. not yet. and Dave although I don't disagree with you in finding her suspicious I really wish you hadn't placed your vote there yet.

[Gamma Emerald]

Why are people voting Carca

[Gamma Emerald]

Woah, what's going on here?

According to my memory of the wiki, wagons on people who probably aren't even reading the thread right now are utterly useless. Move your votes from roster to anyone else, people.
Either roster will get replaced or will make a return and we can judge/lynch him then if he continues to actively lurk.

the savior has returned to offer his wisdom!!

Ah yes. People often refer to me as Hec "the saviour" tic.
Could someone edit this into my wiki please?

Woah, careful there buddy. If we let just anyone edit the wiki it wouldn't stay the ultimate repository of scumhunting knowledge would it. You're going to need a LOT more permits for that.

I'm going to let you in on a little secret here btw. It's generally pretty discouraged to use the wiki like you're doing. Obviously all of the information in it is perfect, so you'll easily find the scum, which ruins the game for everyone else. You're definitely going to get killed night one, and a lot of people probably think you're a bit of a jerk since using the wiki is considered cheating by like 90% of us. Obviously people don't like to acknowledge this, which is why they're pretending the wiki isn't perfect, but don't be fooled.

---

@Hectic/Carcalilly: I'll want to hear why you like Garmr's read and why you agree/disagree with it. Nobody else weighed in there which is concerning me.

-Hop

You're allowed to maintain your own user page. You need permits to edit guides and such.

[Gamma Emerald]

I think it’s quite fair for me to not like that. We may be character alts, but I don’t believe I ever sheeped Cliff and acknowledged that I thought that read was 100% correct. It’s Day 1.

I think it’s incredibly fair for me to not like the wagon on Cliff, who has now become a town read based on the wagon on him, not him himself.

Sharon Tate is also part of the gang, and was someone I put in the proclaimed town block.

I did this on a recent Rick Dalton game as well. With Sakura Hana and Formerfish.

Guess what happened there? That ended up being the 3p lylo, and was a big 1v1 between FF and I, but in the end we caught ScumFF.

You actually did solving things that game -_-

Yup. But not Day 1.

You replaced in AFTER Day 1

Don't try to spin the facts to benefit your image, it makes my claws sharper

[Gamma Emerald]

If you truly think that me not doing anything is AI at all...

That’s just par for the course.

I don’t do stuff until I do stuff, either alignment, and when I do stuff, I take over.

I post whilst not invested to try to keep myself at least somewhat here to make it easier when I hard invest.

I'll talk about this later but I have a rebuttal to this

[davesaz]

Why are people voting Carca

It's a better alternative to my old reaction to things that upset me.
UNVOTE:

[davesaz]

I do find it funny (strange) that a couple people defend every wagon whether the recipient deserves it or not.