Mini Normal 2095 - Game Over!

[Tchill13]

Why wouldn't I switch to a klick gobble scum team because of your long given stance on uzi?

[Luca Blight]

Why even ask me if when I provide reasonable better explanations (with someone kicking and screaming they hate having to TR icon in the game) for you just throw them aside when I provide them?

I don't think the alternatives you've provided are much better given they pose a greater element of risk, and it doesn't mean Gobble would have had the same thought process as yourself.

I don't believe Gobble even thought about it all that much, due to his lack of commitment upon joining the game. I believe he threw out an obscure claim after seeing all the VT claims and waited to see if anyone bought it before investing himself into the game.

[Luca Blight]

Why wouldn't I switch to a klick gobble scum team because of your long given stance on uzi?

At this point I think you're either partnered with Gobble or the scum team is Klick/Gobble, though I still need to re-read before I cement that.

You might have thought I'd reconsider my Uzi read after the Datisi flip, and all the other players in the game, bar Uzi himself, seem up for an Uzi lynch.

Actually yes, if Klick and yourself are a scum team then you've already won as the Uzi lynch will be forced, given Gobble's scumread of Uzi.

[Luca Blight]

Btw Tchill, there's been a common theme this game of you complaining about others not working with you, when you aren't willing to work with others on anything that doesn't suit you.

I townread Uzi and am unwilling to work with the idea of him being scum atm, but you're doing the same thing with Gobble. Yes, we're discussing him, but you're not allowing for a moment to consider he might be scum.

Double standards.

[Tchill13]

OK man. I'm hypocritical and nothing gets by you.

I see where we stand. Sorry for trying.

You just do your thing.

[Tchill13]

Yes gobble maybe scum. If he is we lose.

Because at some point we're gonna have to to come to the conclusion that it's in klick/uzi/gobble

I will never be OK voting gobble there. The only other thing is settling on a klick lynch.

We could do that eventually. Maybe.

[Luca Blight]

So we're resting the game on A50 being spiteful enough to throw the game....great.

Why did you claim Tracker during twilight of D2? I'm having a hard time believing this claim as a result.

[Luca Blight]

And you've gone from saying Klick is conf scum if Datisi flips green to saying you would '

settle

' for a Klick lynch...

What's changed?

[Luca Blight]

Although I guess from your perspective it would have to be Klick/Uzi, so scratch the above.

[Tchill13]

So we're resting the game on A50 being spiteful enough to throw the game....great.

Why did you claim Tracker during twilight of D2? I'm having a hard time believing this claim as a result.

because i thought i'd get killed by scum and keep icon alive. That was the plan.

[Tchill13]

So we're resting the game on A50 being spiteful enough to throw the game....great.

Why did you claim Tracker during twilight of D2? I'm having a hard time believing this claim as a result.

from your pov if its tchill/gobble

your'e resting the game on town having only 1 PR.

[Tchill13]

Although I guess from your perspective it would have to be Klick/Uzi, so scratch the above.

this is correct.

look i've been toxic. I've been an asshole and i have no problem looking like a fool if gobble is scum. I'll wear it with pride.

I just cant see it being MORE LIKELY than klick/LUV.

mainly because of the lack of manipulation his claim provides.

also i laid out the groundwork for what scum klick does here. He never slightly SR'd me until twilight d2. said i was full of shit. 1st negative thing i even recall him saying about me.

[Tchill13]

I am out of sync in this game (not the only one) and it feels best if you lynch me today because I won't be of much use in LyLo

My best bet is to go to random.org and let it decide where I should be voting, but not tell. When asked for reasoning I'd probably say "just because".

We lynch A50 today.

Scum probably kill in (klick/luca/me)

LUV/datisi will, still be in the game 100 percent. If not then scum are killing off a mislynch candidate in lylo, which they won't do.

And I'm pretty sure one of the vt's lied and is gonna claim something in lylo. Highly doubt all those vt claims are true.

If you are Town then I’ll be really disappointed. I can understand feeling out of sync in a game, but if you’re not even going to try then what’s the point? You’re just letting the rest of us down, as there is no way to really distinguish whether you scum who has given up or Town who is not bothered. There is so much info now and the game is there for the taking, and here you are saying ‘Lynch me as I’m out of sync’? I’m sorry but that is pathetic.

If you think anything I say or do will help you're far off base. Both Tchill & Icon have decided I should be lynched and there's no way to change that. ANYTHING I say or do will be seen as a scum move by me. Suppose I suddenly decided to effort. "That's scum him trying to get out of the nooze". Suppose I stayed the way I am. "That's scum him giving up". There is no way I'm getting out of this, and even if I somehow managed to escape the lynch today I am the designated lynch tomorrow. Too much trouble for no gain at all.

All you've done is complain that you don't know what's going on or complain that you can't do anything at this point.

And you went out of your way to call me someone that's mislynched early all the time and provided one game of evidence.

You decided to call someone out on that and then play like this in the same game?

All you've done is complain that you don't know what's going on or complain that you can't do anything at this point.

And you went out of your way to call me someone that's mislynched early all the time and provided one game of evidence.

You decided to call someone out on that and then play like this in the same game?

OK. fair enough. I sincerely apologize for defending you and I promise not to do that ever again.

All I ask. Players that don't play the game at all should replace out instead of defending others. Pretty reasonable request imo.

Something doesn't feel right.
I feel like A50's making life really unnecessarily difficult for himself if he's scum.

damn it.

i'll go back and iso.

look at shit. make sure im ok with this.

The team is undoubtedly in LUV/Klick/A50

Luca is my conftown this day phase.

[Tchill13]

ignore that. i was trying to go back and messed up.

[Tchill13]

Klick
Billy
Datisi
Tchill
Icon

Alisae
Luca
A50
Emperor

Top is town to the point that I'm not interested in lynching anytime soon. Bottom is what's left. Datisi in particular has looked townie in her interaction with Icon - her motives in that exchange clearly seemed to be sorting Icon over anything else in a way that seemed genuine.

Also, thanks Ali. I'll have my own look soon.

half of his scum list are confirmed town here. IMO they're all town.

[Tchill13]

i'll agree to a klick lynch. dude is so scum. i just have to properly quote what im seeing. give me a bit.

[Tchill13]

Icon, claim your result.

Why don't you have a result Icon?

VOTE: Iconeum
Really not buying that.

I propose a massclaim. If enough people agree to one, I'm fine to start.

And yes, 'why isn't Icon dead' is a very valid question.

ok full disclosure

town loyal mailman

i get to send a message to a player every night
town gets the message
scum doesn't

if i was NK'd (fully expecting to be), Ali would get a message with information
the message was worded in a way that is undoubtebly coming from me and he would be able to prove so in game

if ali is scum then it was a waste upon my NK

What motivation was there to fakeclaim Cop?

so klick proposes mass claim. Is wondering why Icon isn't dead. So from here I can see this as looking for the protective. Now there's another post i have to find.

[Tchill13]

In order to assume Icon is town you have to have a scumteam that chooses to kill Alisae over a claimed Cop. The options for that are slim, methinks.

I propose Town directs Icon's N2 target.

I've been unexpectedly stuck at my in-laws for 8 days and am getting the weekend as a break before going back there for an even longer amount of time. This weekend should be good for my activity. Here in a bit ill give this game a solid half-hour.

Heres where my head is currently at:

TOWN
Klick
LUV, Tchill
--- do not lynch above this line ---
Datisi
A50, Luca


Icon
SCUM

Billy was blatantly obvious town.

The one thing giving me reservations about Icon being scum is that there are enough people who gave such little indication of Icon's claim yesterday that there might be a scumteam out there that just completely missed it.

I mean this is a game of mafia ffs. Lies are to be expected…

A game I recently played had a town player who faked a guilty on his scumread, then got CC'd by someone who cleared that 'guilty' the same night and he was on the speedwagon to Lynchville if it wasn't for me stopping that lynch and townreading the fakeclaim. We proceeded to lynch back to back scums and win the game.

It's all about perspective and how you deal with it.

This post should be taken as evidence that Icon would play like this for towncred as scum.

constant shade on icon here. still looking for one post in particular.

[Tchill13]

also reads LUV slot hard town consistently.

[Tchill13]

I'm VT.

Either we're in straight mountainous or Icon is town.

See, wasn't that fun?

absolout constant shade on icon even wanting to direct the night action up until the point the mass claim forced klick to hard TR icon just like everyone else had to.

b4 this the shade was CONSTANT. still looking for that special post.

[Tchill13]

Thank you for responding, Datisi.

Okay, here's the problems I have with your reads. They all seem weak and forced. They all seem to be based on reasoning that can easily be thrown away upon my Green flip. From my pov, I can see scum!Klick giving out reads like these, TRing everyone other than the lynchbait in order to avoid associates. And once his sole SR flips Green, he can easily throw away any TR (other than Icon, who likely won't even live to see Day 3) he needs to and then not seem suspicious.

This seems far more complicated and unnecessary than just lynching A50 or LUV today. Particularly A50, whose wagon I started and whom I hadn't given any townread on up until I unvoted him. Unless your theory is that I'm scum with A50, but you seem to be more strongly implying Klick/Luca.
Like, scum!Klick would have been in a fine situation a few IRL days ago when we were all gearing up to lynch A50 or LUV.

"A50 wouldn't have replaced out if he was scum." Not buying that. I can buy the slot cc'ing itself being NAI (if A50 was realy that spiteful), but not as a Town thing. And you were literally the one to call out A50's play in 1772, 1773 and 1775. You don't get to call out his play as scummy and then later say that his play doesn't make sense from scum!A50.

That's a pretty strong oversimplification of my reasoning for A50 being town. The big thing is that A50 could have really easily given more content in the tight situation he was in, but instead he gave little. Because town!A50 read the game and gave what he saw, which wasn't much. Go read A50's ISO and tell me that's scum faking half-assed reads.
And yes, I think the replace-out was town. He was upset that we were trying to make him play the game. That's not a scum mindset when you no longer have stake in the game.

Billy's TR's main reasoning is that he didn't know about the daytalk, and that scum wouldn't replace out where he did. I've asked you if the fact Ali called out a LUV/Luca team makes you reconsider, you said a bit then dropped it. Again, I'm not buying replacements as an AI thing, and I believe scum!Billy would've been able to pass that Towntest. LUV hasn't done anything to be TR fmpov, and you said so when you agreed that most of the TR is Billy's play.

Alright, this one I'm going to challenge you on. I have a few problems here.

'Again, I'm not buying replacements as an AI thing.' This reads like you're dismissing it without thought simply because it's in the same vein as the A50 read.

Why

do you disagree with me?
You didn't believe scum!Billy could pass the towntest when it was happening. In fact, you were the other person pushing it to happen/saying he was town for it at the time. Why bother doing it in the first place if you're now going to completely dismiss it? Because the only answer I can think of is because it was convenient for you to let go of your previous townread on Billy.

LUV's play has been bad, and he had potential motive to kill Alisae. Neither of those things invalidate the reasons I townread Billy's play.

(FWIW, I've now basically come to terms with the fact that scum probably saw Alisae's post that looked like a protective crumb and that's why they killed her.)

Tchill didn't realize Icon claimed cop Day 1. This is such weak reasoning that can easily be thrown away by "oh guess he didn't see it in scum PT", especially if you start pushing A50 as his partner (since scum!A50 could've not even told him about that, because he's so spiteful).

'oh guess he didn't see it in scum PT' is a terrible rebuttal. That doesn't happen.

And what else is there to do than to get away from the situation TRing Icon? He was the sole claimed PR. The fact that Tchill came away from that TRing Icon is NAI imo.

We're talking in the first few pages after Icon's full claim, when Tchill decided Icon's claim was so ridiculous that it had to come from town, while others were scumreading him.

Luca "feels" Town. Again, a read that could easily be thrown away if need be. Btw, Luca did an assessment of Billy in 1431, and concluded that Billy's play was more null than Town. And you never even challenged him on that, even though you did later say that Billy was obvtown. In fact, neither of you challenged each other there (already asked Luca that in 2156).

This isn't a rebuttal of the reasons I gave for Luca-town. Look beyond the first two sentences.

this is the post. Klick is the FIRST person to point out ALI's protective crumb.

[Tchill13]

idk how to manipulate the post and shorten it. i bolded it. its in the middle.

[Tchill13]

I think Klick saw the crumb d1. killed Ali. Applied pressure on the claimed cop until he no longer could (because he was the only PR that claimed).

fished for the protective so they wouldn't waste a nk. Saw there was none and killed icon.

Klick is the only person that mentioned they noticed the ali crumb. Had klick not said that we wouldn't be talking about it.

Did klick see this before the call for massclaim? Before all the events of d2? why wait until post #2159 to bring it up?

[Luca Blight]

If only you could manipulate the post as well as you can manipulate the game...

I’m not sure if Klick was the first to point that out, I’ll have to check to confirm that. Some interesting points though, keep it coming.

[Tchill13]

In order to assume Icon is town you have to have a scumteam that chooses to kill Alisae over a claimed Cop. The options for that are slim, methinks.

I'm going back to the eternal question: what scumteam actually decides to kill Alisae over Icon last night?

Knowing what we know now, scum probably don't have much power themselves considering all we have is Loyal Mailman. They could probably reasonably assume town didn't have much power. I don't think the immediate assumption is that we have a protective with a Cop claim.

Datisi/A50 both noticed and reacted to the claim. Luca claims to have noticed but didn't give any indication of that until D2 (but tbf I do think he noticed - I think he's the type to have read through the whole thread as either alignment). LUV didn't acknowledge the claim yesterday. Tchill actively claims to have not seen it.
But then Alisae's strong townreads were Tchill/LUV/myself. I really don't think they choose to kill her.

its odd to me that these posts come from the guy that was the first to notice the Ali soft crumb.