newbie 1956 - car seat headrest [we gotta go back]

[eth0s]

we are getting dangerously close to no lynch territory given the huge lack of activity today and the deadline creeping up. I think a no lynch is worst case scenario for us right now. We'd end up in mylo tomorrow with the only associations to be made coming from the NK and that's so much less info than a lynch -- even if the lynched is townie.

[Errantparabola]

hey, space cadet
didn't think it'd be this far
but that's the price for being a star

- Hey Space Cadet (Beast Monster Thing in Space),

How To Leave Town

votecount 2.7

Egix96

(3): faüstiv, Spangled, eth0s

faüstiv

(2): Egix96, Jamelia

Not Voting

(2): Geyde, Draynth

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to reach a majority.

Deadline is in (expired on 2019-10-08 12:24:00)

[Jamelia]

Then you must also disagree with my thinking that at that point in the game only an egix lynch seemed possible? If you agree with that line of thinking then you should see that an earlyish bus would absolutely make sense to buy extra towncred if he is expecting his partner to be the only possible lynch option.

Well I always said that my main scumlead was Faustiv. So, I do disagree that Egix is the only lynch that makes sense. Because it doesn't make sense to me as much as a faustiv OR a vote on you. Maybe I am playing into the "mislynch" play that some are saying Dyranth/Egix tried doing, (and you are definitely not as strong of a scumread for me as you were at the beginning of D2 based on your content especially now), but I believe we are being misdirected. Whether that's Egix b

[eth0s]

oh we have a few more hours than i thought. But it's still close either way. No one was posting today by the time the deadline ends tomorrow. if we go no lynch I will literally go insane trying to sort the game tomorrow. Like can all the non-posters just come out and cfd me if we arent going to achieve a lynch? because I would rather die than have a no lynch. it's that bad for us.

[eth0s]

Then you must also disagree with my thinking that at that point in the game only an egix lynch seemed possible? If you agree with that line of thinking then you should see that an earlyish bus would absolutely make sense to buy extra towncred if he is expecting his partner to be the only possible lynch option.

Well I always said that my main scumlead was Faustiv. So, I do disagree that Egix is the only lynch that makes sense. Because it doesn't make sense to me as much as a faustiv OR a vote on you.

then why did you state intent to hammer on egix in 716...

ugh

FoS: Jamelia

[Jamelia]

oh we have a few more hours than i thought. But it's still close either way. No one was posting today by the time the deadline ends tomorrow. if we go no lynch I will literally go insane trying to sort the game tomorrow. Like can all the non-posters just come out and cfd me if we arent going to achieve a lynch? because I would rather die than have a no lynch. it's that bad for us.

I agree. I really want to see more opinions on this.

[Jamelia]

Then you must also disagree with my thinking that at that point in the game only an egix lynch seemed possible? If you agree with that line of thinking then you should see that an earlyish bus would absolutely make sense to buy extra towncred if he is expecting his partner to be the only possible lynch option.

Well I always said that my main scumlead was Faustiv. So, I do disagree that Egix is the only lynch that makes sense. Because it doesn't make sense to me as much as a faustiv OR a vote on you.

then why did you state intent to hammer on egix in 716...

ugh

FoS: Jamelia

Because as I did with the Spam vote, I was and I am still FINE with Egix vote, due to what I have previously said about their shady posts and scummy switches D1. I don't think it's the strongest play but at the time Egix did not respond and I wanted to apply pressure - the same thing people accused me of not doing enough of previously in this game.

[Jamelia]

Now that I have seen their responses + looked back again, I still feel as though my main scumlead is Faustiv. In my head there was a strong possibility of a Faustiv/Egix team, but now I don't think that's the case.

[eth0s]

They aren't a team. What about egix makes you hesitant to lynch him? Or how do you not see egix as scummy as sin I guess? I'll be the first to admit my thoughts on him and faustiv have been extremely back and forth but after ISOing them both and posting everything that felt important I just think that faustiv as town makes a lot more sense than egix does at this point.

[eth0s]

like this is arguably the most scumhunting egix has done all game and it's laughable.

As for Spam, although I do think that they have tunnel vision on me, I don’t believe their questioning and analysis is necessarily scummy. I’d like to give them the benefit of the doubt that they’re at least analyzing a lot of the game and have set their sets on one specific thing. I think that Spam would help us more if he focused on others just as much as he focused on me, but I digress.

Last sentence feels a bit deflectional?

So we’re at a L-2 on Aidan with Faustiv/Spam jumping on this rather quickly. Just an FYI before people continue voting.

I’d like to hear what Aidan has to say before we get to a L-1. I agree with what you’re saying but I don’t feel as strong of a scum read on Aidan as I do Faustiv at the moment. Especially after Faustiv switching his vote onto Aidan and then automatically talking about “oh I could have jumped on the other bandwagons but I jumped on THIS one, which is not scummy.”

With that being said I’d be fine with an Aidan lynch if his response is inadequate.

Jamellia why are you ok with an Airan lynch if I’m on the bandwagon? I’m one of your scumreads and I am advocating this lynch. Do you think me and Airan are a team?

I am ok with it if I believe that the response Airan gives is inadequate and scummy. I already said I don’t agree with the idea of Aidan being scum, but people expose themselves when the pressure is on, especially new players (from what I saw in my last game).

If that’s the case, then I may be wrong about you. For now, you’re still my main scumread which is why my
vote hasn’t changed off of you.

Beginning of first quote has a running commentary sort of tone which feels out of place.
Second quote feels like trying to walk back from an awkward position (first sentence in last paragraph especially).

Hi eth0s! Great analysis so far, except of course when you say you would have voted for me!

Part after comma feels strange, but the emote implies it's not entirely serious so... idrk.

UNVOTE: oh thank goodness someone is actually playing in the slot now and that's a good catchup. Airan scummed it up enough that I'm def still suspicious, but we're not lynching there today. Also, huh I'm not usually at L-1 d1, I might actually have to put in some effort.

If you put in this same effort as you’re doing right now, maybe you wouldn’t be in a L-1 situation? Can you please explain to me why you haven’t put in effort until now?

Tone here feels unnecessarily aggressive.

When is the deadline? If we don’t have a lynch by then, does it just go to the person with the most votes?

Not a tone thing per se, but I feel that the "no maj = no lynch" rule is something you likely would have remembered from your first Newbie game (iirc it's quite hard to miss in the rules) so this doesn't really feel like a genuine derp.


Whew that took a while. That only goes as far as EoD1 (it's a pretty big iso). Now I gotta eat and stuff. Bye for now.

I just don't see how faustiv's progression doesn't give you any townpings at all while you feel okay enough with egix's progression since you'd rather see faustiv eat rope.

[eth0s]

Spoiler:

Self meta sucks but here's one thing I will say about myself that is true. I do not self vote as scum. If I have ever done it than that was before my return to the site a few months ago. I do, however self vote as town. Take this with a grain of salt. I shouldn't have done it here regardless. I was mad. I was actually in a horrible mood towards the end of Day 1 and that isn't much of an excuse for my bad play there but I am genuinely sorry for shitting the bed there. I've been trying to work on forcing myself not to play when I am in a bad mood, but it's a work in progress.

I want to believe this.

Anyway VOTE: Egix96

Considering that you've been tunnelling on that slot since last Monday, I highly doubt that. If you were town I would not have expected you to believe him at all.

Not to mention it makes a big change from this:

eth0s you better give me a good reason not to get you lynched today.

I would hardly say that self-meta is a 'good reason'.

So you think I am scum. Why?

Not only for your previous post, but also:

- Scumreading Spangled for being passive when you yourself were being passive
- You jumping from Geyde to Airan which felt opportunistic (to me it reads as you moving to an easier target)
- WK-ing NMSA seemingly out of nowhere when your only mentions of him prior were a) stating that you had him as "Null leaning scum" in your readslist, and b) mentioning that his interactions with Jamelia seemed to be coming from an uninformed viewpoint.
- vvv

Faustiv, you mentioned that you don't like those on NMSA's wagon
who other than eth0s do you think is scum out of {Draynth, Geyde, Veggie}

Not sure. All you and Egix are at least scumleans at the moment. I’d also add Egix to that, but his alignment would be more clear based on what eth0s flips.

Okay, so I get that from your perspective there's a scum between me and eth0s. But you're going after me now, not because of eth0s dying and flipping town, but because you've seemingly suddenly decided that he's town based on little more than a self-meta trust tell. Just... what.

I think you've been asked for this before Egix, and you still haven't done so yet. Where do you think people lean at this point?

Right now I'm thinking something like

Town:
Spangled
Geyde

?? (Need to look at when I get the chance)
Jam
Draynth
eth0s

Scum:
faust

With this day having gone on for 4.5 days now I think the fact that there's 4 people not voting is very odd. And I am somewhat inclined to believe the scumteam may both be apart of those 4...

Like we are halfway into the phase and 4/7 players haven't voted yet. That's weird, right?

Might just be from people holding their votes to see how their scumreads act or something, idk.

VOTE: faustiv

I still think he's the most likely scum here. I could've just gone ahead and voted him much sooner but oh well.

So you think I am scum. Why?

Not only for your previous post, but also:

- Scumreading Spangled for being passive when you yourself were being passive
- You jumping from Geyde to Airan which felt opportunistic (to me it reads as you moving to an easier target)

I found this post to be interesting looking back. Egix, if you find that faustiv is being scummy due to the targets they have, how do you feel about me? I am scumreading Spangled for the same reasons as faustiv, atm. Does that make me scum?

Also, you said that Faustiv jumped from Geyde to Airan. But you jumped to Airan, then to NMSA during D1. Do you think that jumping on bandwagons make people scummy? If so, how does faustiv's or anyone else's case of this different than yours?

- The difference is that you haven't been being passive like faustiv was in the early game - you've actually been really active this game, so coming from you it's not hypocritical.

- Jumping on a wagon is scummy if it's done without a clear sense of progression (e.g. voting someone you had previously been tr-ing all game). When faustiv voted Airan D1 (or at least attempted to) it just seemed to me to have come out of nowhere, like he just suddenly decided to push there. Now I will admit to my own hypocrisy on this matter, but in my defence, a) I had been leaning scum on NMSA prior to me declaring intent on him, and b) I could not in good faith continue to push on the Airan slot post-replacement, because my impression of eth0s's catchup/readslist posts was they were too well-made to have come from scum.

Your jump from Spangled to Airan doesn't strike me as a 'clear sense of progression', especially since Spangled was your vote before switching to Airan and there were no indications from yourself about townreading Spangled. You also said in 217 that Spangled's post was 'starting to sway you', then in 218, criticise me for jumping on this vote for being opportunistic.

For context, Spangled's case on Airan came in post 213. Your post about Spangled's case swaying you in voting in that direction came in 217. I'd like to know why you sheeped the player you voted for in 75 because to me, your vote reads as opportunistic. For clarification, your reasoning for voting Spangled in 75:

Spangled - 61 - "...but I don’t think I can call [Jamelia] scum over it. I am not willing to put my vote there just yet, but I will consider it." Seems non-committal and maybe self-contradictory?

Fair enough, your progression on NMSA does seem a little more structured, but I still believe that it was, along with your other votes, opportunistic. I already did a dive on this in post 667.

Yes I am aware that what I did was hypocritical, I already admitted it and there's no need to keep hammering on about it.

The reason why I chose to follow Spangled on Airan was because I found his case to be very solid and to me it simply didn't read like scum pushing for a mislynch. I know that might sound superficial but I really have no better reason than that.

So I was about to start writing up the Egix/Faustiv relationship but eth0s just beat me to it. lol. I do think that Egix was implying early on that they scumread Faustiv, but it was not clear at all. I read it that way but it was absolutely not clear.

I don't agree that Egix voting for Faustiv was random, however. I think Egix has a clear path to why he felt that way because... well I felt the same way, except I actually wrote it out since D1.

if you and I are on different sides of the argument then why did my post deter you from writing yours? shouldn't a different point of view be an important thing to state at this time? especially if you want my vote (disclaimer: you probably won't get it) I don't see why you'd just be like "oh okay he talked about the relationship between them but came to the opposite conclusion I did so I don't need to post my thoughts anymore"

[Jamelia]

Spoiler:

Self meta sucks but here's one thing I will say about myself that is true. I do not self vote as scum. If I have ever done it than that was before my return to the site a few months ago. I do, however self vote as town. Take this with a grain of salt. I shouldn't have done it here regardless. I was mad. I was actually in a horrible mood towards the end of Day 1 and that isn't much of an excuse for my bad play there but I am genuinely sorry for shitting the bed there. I've been trying to work on forcing myself not to play when I am in a bad mood, but it's a work in progress.

I want to believe this.

Anyway VOTE: Egix96

Considering that you've been tunnelling on that slot since last Monday, I highly doubt that. If you were town I would not have expected you to believe him at all.

Not to mention it makes a big change from this:

eth0s you better give me a good reason not to get you lynched today.

I would hardly say that self-meta is a 'good reason'.

So you think I am scum. Why?

Not only for your previous post, but also:

- Scumreading Spangled for being passive when you yourself were being passive
- You jumping from Geyde to Airan which felt opportunistic (to me it reads as you moving to an easier target)
- WK-ing NMSA seemingly out of nowhere when your only mentions of him prior were a) stating that you had him as "Null leaning scum" in your readslist, and b) mentioning that his interactions with Jamelia seemed to be coming from an uninformed viewpoint.
- vvv

Faustiv, you mentioned that you don't like those on NMSA's wagon
who other than eth0s do you think is scum out of {Draynth, Geyde, Veggie}

Not sure. All you and Egix are at least scumleans at the moment. I’d also add Egix to that, but his alignment would be more clear based on what eth0s flips.

Okay, so I get that from your perspective there's a scum between me and eth0s. But you're going after me now, not because of eth0s dying and flipping town, but because you've seemingly suddenly decided that he's town based on little more than a self-meta trust tell. Just... what.

I think you've been asked for this before Egix, and you still haven't done so yet. Where do you think people lean at this point?

Right now I'm thinking something like

Town:
Spangled
Geyde

?? (Need to look at when I get the chance)
Jam
Draynth
eth0s

Scum:
faust

With this day having gone on for 4.5 days now I think the fact that there's 4 people not voting is very odd. And I am somewhat inclined to believe the scumteam may both be apart of those 4...

Like we are halfway into the phase and 4/7 players haven't voted yet. That's weird, right?

Might just be from people holding their votes to see how their scumreads act or something, idk.

VOTE: faustiv

I still think he's the most likely scum here. I could've just gone ahead and voted him much sooner but oh well.

So you think I am scum. Why?

Not only for your previous post, but also:

- Scumreading Spangled for being passive when you yourself were being passive
- You jumping from Geyde to Airan which felt opportunistic (to me it reads as you moving to an easier target)

I found this post to be interesting looking back. Egix, if you find that faustiv is being scummy due to the targets they have, how do you feel about me? I am scumreading Spangled for the same reasons as faustiv, atm. Does that make me scum?

Also, you said that Faustiv jumped from Geyde to Airan. But you jumped to Airan, then to NMSA during D1. Do you think that jumping on bandwagons make people scummy? If so, how does faustiv's or anyone else's case of this different than yours?

- The difference is that you haven't been being passive like faustiv was in the early game - you've actually been really active this game, so coming from you it's not hypocritical.

- Jumping on a wagon is scummy if it's done without a clear sense of progression (e.g. voting someone you had previously been tr-ing all game). When faustiv voted Airan D1 (or at least attempted to) it just seemed to me to have come out of nowhere, like he just suddenly decided to push there. Now I will admit to my own hypocrisy on this matter, but in my defence, a) I had been leaning scum on NMSA prior to me declaring intent on him, and b) I could not in good faith continue to push on the Airan slot post-replacement, because my impression of eth0s's catchup/readslist posts was they were too well-made to have come from scum.

Your jump from Spangled to Airan doesn't strike me as a 'clear sense of progression', especially since Spangled was your vote before switching to Airan and there were no indications from yourself about townreading Spangled. You also said in 217 that Spangled's post was 'starting to sway you', then in 218, criticise me for jumping on this vote for being opportunistic.

For context, Spangled's case on Airan came in post 213. Your post about Spangled's case swaying you in voting in that direction came in 217. I'd like to know why you sheeped the player you voted for in 75 because to me, your vote reads as opportunistic. For clarification, your reasoning for voting Spangled in 75:

Spangled - 61 - "...but I don’t think I can call [Jamelia] scum over it. I am not willing to put my vote there just yet, but I will consider it." Seems non-committal and maybe self-contradictory?

Fair enough, your progression on NMSA does seem a little more structured, but I still believe that it was, along with your other votes, opportunistic. I already did a dive on this in post 667.

Yes I am aware that what I did was hypocritical, I already admitted it and there's no need to keep hammering on about it.

The reason why I chose to follow Spangled on Airan was because I found his case to be very solid and to me it simply didn't read like scum pushing for a mislynch. I know that might sound superficial but I really have no better reason than that.

So I was about to start writing up the Egix/Faustiv relationship but eth0s just beat me to it. lol. I do think that Egix was implying early on that they scumread Faustiv, but it was not clear at all. I read it that way but it was absolutely not clear.

I don't agree that Egix voting for Faustiv was random, however. I think Egix has a clear path to why he felt that way because... well I felt the same way, except I actually wrote it out since D1.

if you and I are on different sides of the argument then why did my post deter you from writing yours? shouldn't a different point of view be an important thing to state at this time? especially if you want my vote (disclaimer: you probably won't get it) I don't see why you'd just be like "oh okay he talked about the relationship between them but came to the opposite conclusion I did so I don't need to post my thoughts anymore"

First of all, I am not trying to change your vote. I am just explaining what my opinion is on the current state of the vote. I think you are equating me defending Egix to me thinking they're town. I am not looking at this game as who is town and who is scum, but rather who is MOST LIKELY to be scum from my point of view. I cannot assume that your opinion holds as much weight as mine because you might not be on the same team as me.

I didn't deter from writing my opinion because what you did, which focused on Egix's reads on faustiv, was EXACTLY what I was going to do - except we came to the different conclusion, which I actually did write about...

You say that I am dismissing ALL of faustiv's posts (which I haven't) and just because I think faustiv is the my main scumlead that I'll say anything to get him lynched - wrong.

I don't appreciate you (from my opinion) implying that my opinion about this vote is based on my personal agenda rather than us trying to win. I have said this over and over, I have my opinion - but I'd rather win than be right. If I am right and Egix doesn't flip scum, then cool. I have (in my opinion) who I think is scum and we'll be in F5 and just hope we get it right with horrible odds. If Egix DOES flip Scum, then GREAT! We have a great chance of figuring out who their scum partner is.

What I am saying is, I don't think Egix is MY main scum lead, and if I have a choice between them and faustiv, who has been my main scumlead, I am choosing faustiv.

[Jamelia]

They aren't a team. What about egix makes you hesitant to lynch him? Or how do you not see egix as scummy as sin I guess? I'll be the first to admit my thoughts on him and faustiv have been extremely back and forth but after ISOing them both and posting everything that felt important I just think that faustiv as town makes a lot more sense than egix does at this point.

I've said this literally on this page. Egix has been way less active than me, but they have a scumread on faustiv that I have agreed with since the beginning. This changed when the bandwagon on Aidan was heavy, but I just strongly feel that Faustiv shouldn't have been that confident in Spam being TOWN even though they were acting shady.

If you were to ask me right now - Jamelia, do you think that Egix is town. I would say, not as much as other players in this game. Which is how I feel. But right now my absolute strongest scum lead is faustiv, and that's where I want my vote to go.

[eth0s]

I meant the bit about my vote as more of a statement for getting other votes too, but I wanted to personally make it clear that I don't want to vote faustiv today anymore. And I was expecting a long write up which is why I thought you jumped ship after I posted my thoughts on them.

It's fair for you to have your own thoughts and I'm not trying to discredit you. I'm just in a weird place now that I'm finally settling down on a lynch and it's the most popular wagon of the phase and somehow still looks like we are going into no lynch territory. idk what to think anymore. I've never seen an entire playerlist stop caring right before deadline before.

[Egix96]

I really don't like that so much of spangled's reasoning hinges on a POST 75 read list. That hardly means anything at this point except for potentially outing associations and that's part of what contributed to my bad hammer on nmsa

Yeah I know it’s a bit iffy — and I am worried I’m wrong, oh so very worried — but my biggest thought is: why did he feel the need to comment on every player? Post 75 he shouldn’t have that much to say about AI things, and he really didn’t. So why bother say most of it?

The biggest thing that’s holding me back from kinda locking this scum — although that’s not correct but any other way I try to type it makes less sense — is why he decided to go at anyone at all; wouldn’t the safer move as scum be to not attack anyone?
But then again it can be explained from a scum pov; if he has a super null readslist that’s scummy in and of itself.

Because they were still thoughts that I had, and even if they weren't necessarily alignment-relevant I figured there was no harm in stating them.

@ Second paragraph: In all honesty I really don't think that's a valid argument. You've answered your own question anyway.

Excellent! Why isn’t it a valid argument?

Because I'm aware that having a null readlist would look bad
Not attacking anyone might be playing it safe but that's simply not how I would have played it

[Draynth]

Ok I'm awake
Reading through the past few pages now
I'll be around to hammer either before the deadline if needed so we need not worry about a nolynch

[Draynth]

Gah, I feel like I'm being persuaded by other people too much this game and I'm not really analysing whether what someone is saying makes sense or not

[Draynth]

Intent to hammer Egix

I think I'd be fine with either an egix or a faustiv lynch today, primarily because I'm feeling quite lost.
I'm going to try to do a lot of rereading during the night and try to sort out my thoughts because I'm next to useless right now

[Egix96]

Intent to hammer Egix

I think I'd be fine with either an egix or a faustiv lynch today, primarily because I'm feeling quite lost.
I'm going to try to do a lot of rereading during the night and try to sort out my thoughts because I'm next to useless right now

I'm the doctor

[Draynth]

VOTE: Egix96[/v]

[Draynth]

VOTE: Egix96

[Spangled]

UNVOTE:

[Spangled]

VOTE: Egix96

What the heck

[Draynth]

VOTE: Egix96

What the heck

Hard CC'ing that claim

[Spangled]

I’m about to post some thoughts on Egix and you and you bloody damn hammer a claimed doc
no bloody reasoning, nothing
What the heck, man?
What kind of stupid!town are you?
Pedit: I just realised that that was the likely alternative