Undertale Semi-Open 1.1 - Snowdin Snowdown

[Oversoul]

Mastina I think if there’s scum in the spare chat it is Gingie. His spare happened very inorganically in my opinion. I was townreading Rakan’s aggression against me and my antics which is why I spared him. To Chemist, I like to think I am playing this game almost how I played the last Undertale game. I am less active here but I am also less toxic. I was only less active here because Baton Pass was a game I really wanted to win and it was an absolute slog to deal with past a certain point. That game made me hate mafia and honestly sapped my will to play.

[Chemist1422]

Hold up

Over when you mentioned the last game that made me realize we still have a PR

[popsofctown]

Sea Tea

[Elements]

Hold up

Over when you mentioned the last game that made me realize we still have a PR

Which we shouldn't comment on yet

[Xayah]

Elements what's your reads at right now?

[Xayah]

The one and only reason why I'd want you to have a read on me is if you having a read on me gets you to spare Oversoul.

I don't mind sparing Oversoul, yes the reason I wanted to get a read on you is mostly personal. I like Nachos case on Oversoul considering I had nothing better to do.

[Xayah]

I trust in Gin to have a better understanding on how to read Mastina so I won't spare her. I want to know why Chen and Ele want to though.
I know Rakan is lock town in my eyes. Gin well, I can't read them well but I can just go with the popular outlook and just gowith it. So I'm confident we have 2 town in the spare pt atm.

[Xayah]

Giving out candy right now, but this game feels so hard for like no reason. Sure I've got one read wrong on Nacho but besides that it feels like it's been pulling teeth. Maybe cause I haven't got my main scumread lynch I don't know.
Part of me wants to just move on but still I guess all I want is to be cocky

[Oversoul]

I think I am most struggling with Day 2's selection. Day 2 lasted all of 5 days. The last two votes and hammer on Ginngie came within a short period of time and it doesn't help that I have been scumreading one of the people who facilitated the speed of that day (Elements).

I find it especially odd that Elements would do such a thing despite everyone generally poo-poo'ing my speed spare tactic from the last game when I did it to Chennisden. Elements' behavior in context of what we know from last game is why I am having such a hard time believing he is town. I just do not think Elements acts the way he does in this game knowing all the things we know from that game.

However, now that I look back at what happened on Day 3, my stronger town read on Chemist did the same thing by quickhammering Nacho. I find that especially interesting given the fact that Chemist is now scumreading me for quicksparing Rakan when he quicklynched Nacho. I will maintain that quick sparing is not as detrimental as quicklynching by the simple reason we get to technically keep spares alive. I'm not sure if this hypocrisy is scum motivated. I don't know if Chemist is the type of scum player to try and keep his actions in a specific line/trajectory, or if he is a more play it by ear person. Honestly Day 2 and Day 3 happened so fast while I was wasting all of my time with Baton Pass is why I have literally no understanding or basis in this game. I basically wasn't even here for either of those day phases because they lasted less than a week, collectively.

I am beginning to wonder if that is designed to try and hold my activity against me since that is my main scumtell... Something that Chemist openly acknowledged earlier in the game. It is interesting that he is now scumreading me.

Mastina is a hard one... like Mastina and Nacho have intimate knowledge of me. They have played with me my entire career on this site. I am pretty sure both of them were in my first ever game on this site. But my general knowledge base of how Mastina behaved with me is that she almost always scumread me... and I almost always scumread her out of paranoia. She is a good scumplayer and I never wanted her to have upperhand on me. It helped that we could lock into an eagle death spiral of mutual scum reads on one another. The fact that she is so quick to townread me despite my activity being closer to my scum game. If there is one tell that I have it is that my activity is highly alignment indicative. I'm not sure how much Nacho influenced her to read me, but this is giving me pause on mastina given our extensive history together.

Then there is Xayah... who has in my mind done nothing except for quickhammer Nacho. Mariar has been commonly heralded as a good scumplayer by people on this site, but whenever I have played with scum mariar (in the Hidden Happiness hydra) she has just lurked her way through games. While I don't generally see the lurkiness here, mainly because it seems like everyone has been lurking, and I also have not been here, I am having a hard time seeing the townie motivated actions... I think Maria is a good enough player to realize that quickhammering Nacho is generally a bad idea. Then again, she wasn't the one who actually quick hammered from the looks of it, but like Elements, she did make it happen.

It is funny because this game seems like the antithesis to Baton Pass. I genuinely scumread everyone who is still alive. This is why I don't want to spare anyone else other than myself. Likewise, I don't want to lynch another player because if we are wrong on the lynch and there is a scum already in the spare room, that lynch is LyLo. I am thinking if there is a scum in the spare it is Ginngie. If it is Rakan, I trust that Maria can read whoever she thought she was close enough with to make the Lover Pair alt account.

At any rate, I do not want this day phase to be as fast as the others. We actually need content to parse before we make any decision even if it seems like the majority believes in what I want to happen.

So first things first, Chemist why did you quick hammer Nacho? Why are you scumreading me for something similar to what you did?

Mastina, what is your read on Rakan and Ginngie? What do you think of Chemist/Elements?

Xayah, why are you now comfortable townreading me when you were not before? If I'm not mistaken, wasn't I a stronger scumread for you?

Elements, why are you now comfortable sparing me instead of Mastina?

[Oversoul]

MariaR I saw you here a moment ago

[Xayah]

You called?

[Oversoul]

Answer my question...?

[Xayah]

Xayah, why are you now comfortable townreading me when you were not before? If I'm not mistaken, wasn't I a stronger scumread for you?

I thought scum was in you Chem/Ele for some time now. But the day before when Wisdom was going on about how you and Nacho were a team and Nacho made this case. I figured the best way for me to get information was to vore Nacho. If he flipped scum then yay he was scum. If he flipped town than you're probably town. I've always had a hard time reading you. In the dance game I thought you were town when you were scum. So, I'm going to trust in Nacho and hopefully in others. I also feel better about this because it's basically a cop check fmpov. Since I'm confident in Rakan and Ginngie town.

I want to know why people townread Mastina.
I've had a scumread on Chem for most of the game and it hasn't really faded. For Elements some people say he's in his town meta but I just don't get his play. It pings me. So to say I townread you would be wrong. I think you're townier than the options left.

[Oversoul]

Why don’t you want to spare yourself, especially if you townread both the people in there?

[Xayah]

Because A) That takes a lot of effort and it's a waste of my time because no one here is gonna spare me
B) The more important reason is from my viewpoint it's a cop check. Sure, scum get an extra night kill on night 5 but that can still give me the info I need if I'm wrong.

How much have you played with Chem and Ele? I feel like you've played with them a lot more than me

[Oversoul]

I don’t have a specific number of games off hand but we all played in the last iteration of this game where Elements outplayed everyone.

[Oversoul]

I will say I felt fairly confident calling Chemist town last game and I do not have that feeling at all here.

[Chemist1422]

I will say I felt fairly confident calling Chemist town last game and I do not have that feeling at all here.

Consider

school

[Oversoul]

I dunno. Last time I scumread Mastina was in that xyzzy anyone can post game and I was very wrong. It’s possible I’m just letting my paranoia get the better of me and truthfully I probably am. I just find Mastina so incredibly hard to read. Wisdom and Nacho were definitely two people that I had more faith than average in being able to read her. Especially Nacho because they are good friends.

Under your assumption that Rakan and aginngie are both town that means both scum are still alive. What do you think scum would be trying to do in this situation?
How does this change if one scum is in spare and 1 scum is out?

[Oversoul]

I will say I felt fairly confident calling Chemist town last game and I do not have that feeling at all here.

Consider

school

It’s not an activity read on you really but I do have a penchant to scumread lurkers. Maybe that’s why I’m having so many scumreads this game actually now that I think about it.

[Xayah]

Under your assumption that Rakan and aginngie are both town that means both scum are still alive. What do you think scum would be trying to do in this situation?
How does this change if one scum is in spare and 1 scum is out?

Well, it depends on how confident the scumteam is that they can beat the others. Today has been a rather lax day and it makes me question if scum are comfortable or if we've all just been lazy. Do scum not want to be spared or do they think they can get one of Rakan or Gin killed? I was trying to not be so hard on my stances at first to see if I could give scum a chance in thinking they can mislynch Rakan. But the only one who really is taking a 'Rakan scum' stance seems to be Mastina. She's had that read since day 1.

Tell me, do you think both scum are playing right now or are they in the pt?

[Xayah]

where Elements outplayed everyone.

Outplayed how?

[Oversoul]

where Elements outplayed everyone.

Outplayed how?

He was universally townread and got spared and then town cannibalized itself in LyLo.

[Oversoul]

Under your assumption that Rakan and aginngie are both town that means both scum are still alive. What do you think scum would be trying to do in this situation?
How does this change if one scum is in spare and 1 scum is out?

Well, it depends on how confident the scumteam is that they can beat the others. Today has been a rather lax day and it makes me question if scum are comfortable or if we've all just been lazy. Do scum not want to be spared or do they think they can get one of Rakan or Gin killed? I was trying to not be so hard on my stances at first to see if I could give scum a chance in thinking they can mislynch Rakan. But the only one who really is taking a 'Rakan scum' stance seems to be Mastina. She's had that read since day 1.

Tell me, do you think both scum are playing right now or are they in the pt?

That’s a good point about this day being lax. Hmm.

My thoughts are that if scum are not in currently in the spare, they would want to get into the spare to cast doubt on the current spare members and to get that additional kill. However, if scum are already in the spare they wouldn’t care if anyone gets spared or killed as long as the outside member isn’t getting lynched. They’ve already locked in the second kill and any doubt for spare members and if a lynch goes through on a townie they just win outright.

Now that I’m walking through this logic it really seems likely to me that scum are already in the spare given there’s been like no effort from town this phase.

I almost don’t want to be in the spare because if my thinking is correct people are just gonna incorrectly scumread me and after Baton Pass I don’t think I have the mental or physical strength to deal with that

[Xayah]

where Elements outplayed everyone.

Outplayed how?

He was universally townread and got spared and then town cannibalized itself in LyLo.

....You know, I wish I knew this sooner. It makes me feel better about not just wanting to dismiss him.