Newbie 1961 | Trees II | Over

[skitter30]

Currently the only person i'm townreading, and am probably keeping out of my lynch pool is tictac.

I need to do some homework before i'm willing to vote.

Ddl i'm feeling ~anxious~ about you because of the open ... you were obvtown there but havent really been here

January do u have any scumgames on site for me to look at. Also i still kinda hate your progrssion on me/vork. Also i still dont know why you're scumreading me. Also i feel like your posts are townie on the surface but they lack the ~follow through~ that i expect from town. Like you make posts but the thought process doesnt seem to carry through or motivate later ones, necessarily

Zenith i need to decide if he's newbtown or newbscum. I'm leaning towards the former but i need to fo some more research.

[skitter30]

Also plz no voting yet, i want to try to solve this

[tictac]

I still think jan is town.

CJ could have easily unvoted buddy.zen in 164.
-> I still think skitt+zen is ruled out.

so I'm at:
skitt+doc 30%
doc+zen 60%
other 10%

I thought about early-voting doc but my reads have sucked this game, so I don't think I wanna force the issue if jan really wants skitter.
@jan: plz make sure tho, i think there's a fairly good chance ya wrong there.

[skitter30]

Ok. Why is jan town?

I'm not feeling great about the good doctor rn

[tictac]

kinda insane abount of sync basically, and figuring out how the site works in a townie manner.
I can towncase her tomorrow if ya want details.

[skitter30]

I would like that please

[Zenith]

Anyone one else having site issues? Wanted to be on around deadline but the site kept giving me connection error. Even now it's taking around 5-10 mind to decide if it wants to maybe load a page, or not.. It's weird because the rest of the internet seems to be working fine, just this one site having problems. =(

[DrDolittle]

Currently the only person i'm townreading, and am probably keeping out of my lynch pool is tictac.

I don't like this. You had the same issue with tictac flipflopping and now you've lock towned him while you are scumreading jan. I think the whole interaction of you and tictac is weird, and you two are my highest equity scum pair.

I still think your attack on vork yesterday is unfounded, and now with vork's flip I know his case on you is in good faith

[DrDolittle]

I also dislike how you stepped off the pressure on vork yesterday as you "convinced" tictac to flip.

[DrDolittle]

i think your read on me is also not in good faith? this game and that open (bless that game) is very different both in terms of circumstance and mechanics. i cant see your read from that game transferring over here.

[skitter30]

Currently the only person i'm townreading, and am probably keeping out of my lynch pool is tictac.

I don't like this. You had the same issue with tictac flipflopping and now you've lock towned him while you are scumreading jan. I think the whole interaction of you and tictac is weird, and you two are my highest equity scum pair.

I still think your attack on vork yesterday is unfounded, and now with vork's flip I know his case on you is in good faith

Tictac townlock has very litle to do with their trajectory on me/vork, it's because of the post they made wrt the potential teams and the fact that they dug up a scum pt reference from a game six months ago to reach a conclusion

I dont think scum goes to that much effort to evaluate someone most of the time

[skitter30]

I also dislike how you stepped off the pressure on vork yesterday as you "convinced" tictac to flip.

Because ...

[skitter30]

i think your read on me is also not in good faith? this game and that open (bless that game) is very different both in terms of circumstance and mechanics. i cant see your read from that game transferring over here.

Werent you referencing that game too ...

Why is this game different from that game in that my expectation for town!you to obvtown is unreasonable?

[skitter30]

There are nuggets of merit in vork's post. I think I'm concerned about other ~reasons~

Want to talk about this now?
Also how are you reading january?

[DrDolittle]

let me get back to you tonight skit! but in short
- Im townreading jan
-Backing off vork seems to me that you weren't committed.
- Reasons are not related to the open but I cant talk about it still
- I think tictac's list is actually scummy. and i you pushing that is scummy.

[skitter30]

Ok fair enough wrt the things u cant talk about, i thought it was the open

When you have time, i would appreciate an elaboration on why you're townreading jan and why you think tictac's list is scummy

It's not that i wasnt committed to vork so much as:
- i wanted people (jan in particular) to flesh out the townread so i gave room for that
- i apparently dont like to commit to things and get spooked easily (esp when wagons are growing faster than i expected)

I dont get why you think scum!me backs off there if i'm aiming for a vork mislynch

[january]

January do u have any scumgames on site for me to look at.

first game on this site, so not here. and i don't think there's a way for u to view my games on the other site i've played on
not really sure why this is necessary tho, i think you should have no problem with just reading my lines instead of having to compare it to something else (which can change anyways)

Also i still kinda hate your progrssion on me/vork. Also i still dont know why you're scumreading me. Also i feel like your posts are townie on the surface but they lack the ~follow through~ that i expect from town. Like you make posts but the thought process doesnt seem to carry through or motivate later ones, necessarily

my read on you was mostly some sort of tone/instinct read at first, but i do believe that it followed a (mostly) reasonable town-process. if anything, i think my process comes from a town POV even if its completely wrong - a bit surprised that you think my process is scummy

@tictac im still not sure enough to vote, hence the unvote - still waiting for something to convince me i guess

[tictac]

@skitt: here's some towny things january did on day1. I can continue to day2 tom if ya want

Yeah played a lot of live chat mafia so i’m familiar with the game but just not what to do here on d1

claim offsite exp in first game +town

Suspicious, but I feel like his response to the votes seemed very kneejerk-y with the thing about there being a mafia who voted him. It doesn't seem like a real "read" that comes from actually looking for mafia

susp response to wagon seemed artificial to me too. sync.

@Jamelia i find it hard to believe that’s the only thing you noticed if you read everything i’ve said

but no, i’m not new to mafia just to forum mafia

feels like a big deflect of tictacs question but u might want to read again

sync.
also jan took a soft approach w Jam despite pressure to be agressive. if she was pushing for mislynch/trying to look town, i don't think she would have.

I just realized that I was combining Zenith and Vorkuta into one spot in my brain and I thought they were the same person (same number of letters and starts with letter near the end of the alphabet lol)

mixing up zen and vork is a zen anti-association.

(snip)
Vorkuta’s lines feel really jumpy, like he’s just reacting to random posts but not really contributing anything. Not sure if that’s just a normal playstyle for them or a sign of nervous mafia. Is there a way to review previous games that someone has played to compare and is that allowed?

impulse to sort leads to impulse to learn about the site. big townpoint for this.

fair enough, just seemed to me like you avoided answering at all. not gonna keep pushing u on that, just felt a bit noncommital with the answer

thoughts on anyone else? who's your scumread right now?

this is that soft approach w Jam again.

out of curiosity, how much “coaching” between mafia members usually occurs in the mafia chat?

when I played live chat mafia, mafia couldn’t speak to each other during the day so there wasn’t really any way for partners to coach each other.

-don’t think this is that relevant right now, but if coaching is common or likely then it might be easier to figure out partner/team reads later on. (for example a newbie with really bad plays that flips maf probably has a newbie partner)
-i know this has way too much meta to ever back up a full read, but it might help with pointing us in the right direction later on, just felt like asking now because it came to mind and i didn’t want to forget

There was talk of daytalk in thread, which led to a theory on what might be happening in the scum-thread.
valid perspective, that scum might want to not introduce to conversation.
not super relevant to current moment, but lack of self-censorship is also a towntell.

just attacked tictac’s use of meta just because it was meta, rather than attempting to disprove it. meta is a part of the game, so I don’t really see a problem with including it in a read. you are playing a lot differently than it seems from that quote. however, i think there is a somewhat reasonable meta-based defense of jamelia since newer players tend to respond more reactively from my experience

sync and sorting.

robably a ridiculous idea but i’m actually considering the possibility of it being a scum-scum distancing strategy because it just seems so unnecessarily extended. very unlikely because it seems like a useless expenditure of energy but it‘s be funny if it was.

very strong sync.

just realized almost all of these rely on jamelia being scum but uhhh...

I think this happens to town more than to scum. jan thought Jamelia was scum and her speculation was based on that erroneous info.

mostly reads to me as two people being annoyed with each other. if anything, i scumread you more for the zenith-suspicious interaction.

sync
338,433,434,435,456,457 ok, i'm not gonna list every post clarifying the Jam-push. basically nothing I disagreed with there.

eh ok i’ll stop pretending i’m misunderstanding your argument lol
it’s just annoying as fk and i’m annoyed

sure i acknowledge that mafia is often aware of and concerned about a wagon on them but that’s usually more significant earlier in the day when votes are more for pressure

right now any vote that’s up SHOULD be for the sake of lynching. and i really really don’t think i’m the scummiest player at this table so i’m a bit confused why you want to flip me first even if you agree that other people are scummy

annoyance at people vanity-voting instead of trying to lynch a thing when deadline approaching is something I empathize with superhard.
also confidence in herself looking towny is in itself towny.

clarifying #517:
vorkuta seems reasonable. i’m trying to appeal to him and if i feel like he’s blatantly ignoring my appeal and not considering it at all, i’m going to say he’s mafia. i’m not saying he’s maf if he doesn’t agree with my appeal but if he’s clearly making no effort to listen then he’s not genuinely looking for mafia

so far feels like he’s actually responding

ah, here's the vork TR. I think I missed this before this ISO. I buy it.

well hello george
way to split the vote even more

more annoyance about the vote being split.

unvoting for now i think there’s a chance jam might be just a town crumbling under pressure, gonna give them a chance to respond and make decision later

also dunno what motivation scum-jan would have to unvote jamelia here.

but in all seriousness we need to agree on a vote soon i’m gonna hate you all if we end up nolynching

more annoyance about vote being split. gonna stop quoting these.

well damn

both of u so scummy though

yea,sync.

so you actually don't think you were scummy at all.

neither of you.

lol.

this attitude to Jamelia and Susp, completely believable from town!jan and I think would be hard to pull off as scum.

little bit of a meta read but if george is maf here then his partner is definitely not online atm because this isn't playing dumb this is actually fullblown obliviousness

going back to the daytalk-thought she had earlier.

vork = zenith, basically even idk i still keep getting u two confused a little bit

this is a consistent thing so I believe it's real.

the whole time i put you near the scum side of my list was just based on other people's reads

i didn't think it mattered that much since i wasn't going to lynch you

i don't see scum-jan saying this.

i think skitter might be a better lynch here. they still read as null to me even after that many posts, which feels strange to me, kinda like they're trying to pass as town but they're not quite towny.

i totes buy this read. I'd probs have ya as poe-scum also if it weren't for the no-partner thing, and jan doesn't have background on ya so 'dont lynch skitt on day1' isn't a thing for her.

[skitter30]

not really sure why this is necessary tho, i think you should have no problem with just reading my lines instead of having to compare it to something else (which can change anyways)

meta tends to be a p strong component of how i form reads, so i figure if more info is available i might as well avail myself of it

[skitter30]

if anything, i think my process comes from a town POV even if its completely wrong - a bit surprised that you think my process is scummy

i dont' like how you:

- started off tr'ing vork
- wouldn't/couldn't explain the read
- unvoted me (?)

i still don't understand this

can u summarize all of your reads please?

[DrDolittle]

Tic tac did you just quote everything Jan said

[Plotinus]

Official Vote Count 3.01

---

Lynching

With 5 votes in play, it takes 3 to lynch.

Everybody

(0): Nobody

Not Voting

(5): DrDolittle, january, skitter30, tictac, Zenith

Deadline:

(expired on 2019-11-14 08:15:00).

Mod notes:

[/area]

[DrDolittle]

When you have time, i would appreciate an elaboration on why you're townreading jan and why you think tictac's list is scummy

It's not that i wasnt committed to vork so much as:
- i wanted people (jan in particular) to flesh out the townread so i gave room for that
- i apparently dont like to commit to things and get spooked easily (esp when wagons are growing faster than i expected)

I dont get why you think scum!me backs off there if i'm aiming for a vork mislynch

"Ruling" out scum-pairs is oft a scum used technique to almost force lynches without seeming so. I.e. vork flipped town (tictac scum would know this), therefore, here is the potential lynch options for today. It looks natural, and is a way to push votes without thinking. Plus I don't think it's a very good POE in the first place.

let me know what you think of tictac's post on jan town before I provide mine.

dw i get you my ex girlfriend also said the same thing about how she "apparently dont like to commit to things and get spooked easily (esp when our relationship is growing faster than i expected)"

[DrDolittle]

am feeling concerned that this game is stagnating. Come on people its lylo lets get scum

[DrDolittle]

zen whats ur reads