Newbie 1963 - Game Over

[Formerfish]

VOTE: Ethos

An empty slot and a newbie perhaps?

[the worst]

While I'm at it: sorry to drag you into the fray teacher, do you think I should be townreading Fishy? Not going down trust tell territory but if you think my d1 misread was stupid I'll shelf it.

@fishy I'm surprised you didn't pick it up in my ISO

Out of interest did you guys pick up what I was going for here? The claim probably wasn't needed :{

[Uncrowned]

Uncrowned doesn't have many posts at all and their readlist is mediocre at best, but I can't say shiz on that behalf lol

You said yourself that inactivity doesn't mean a slot should be pressured. Interesting you bring that up now.

And my readlist was at the beginning of the game and besides the incorrect read on Gyro I think has been somewhat accurate. Not sure what you're going for there.

I am just going to say that scum would know who the town are so you can't really lean on that as your saving grace.

Obviously. I just don't get why you'd call it "mediocre" but then not explain why you thought so? Unless you just can't be bothered going back through all the info right now, then I gotcha.

@uncrowned, who'd you put as your scum-team?

In my readlist? I had Gyro as my most scum and Fuz's predecessor behind him.

[JacksonVirgo]

@Uncrowned, you said you were in aus right? You'd know the time here then lol, yeah I don't have the brain power at the moment so Ima explain more in the morning.

[Uncrowned]

Yeah I am haha, I get you, I'm about to head off myself. We still got plenty of time

[the worst]

My reads thus far

Town Leans

Datisi

- Liked his slot when Salad was playing it. Unvoted me when fast wagon occured, seemed like a town play. Questions and digs for info in his posts.

FormerFish

- Aggressive townplay imo, made a good connection in post 118 between bugspray's former slot (Chib) and a past game they had played.

Teacher

- I like the logic behind post 102 with the whole idea of "how does this benefit town?". I'm leaning toward Teacher/Fish being a TvT situation.

Gardenia

- After reading back, I like post 150 - except for including Fish in the trio, since he voted Teacher way before back on Page 1. I believe the vote on me was when we started "redoing" the RVS.

Null

Jackson Virgo

- Would like to see more activity. Don't really like his assessment of my vote on Gyro in Post 222 but I don't think that means anything.

Bugspray

- I don't mind this slot, since Chib was at least attempting to get things to progress earlier in the game. Fish's point about this slot in post 118 is a good one, but I'm not certain it's scum indicative.

Scum Leans

Marionette

- Little input, random vote on Teacher seemed out of place. Admittedly, we were redoing the RVS, but Teacher had been one of the more active players up until that point, so voting him without saying anything is odd to me.

Gyro

- Don't like his votes (Teacher, Gardenia) nor his reasoning in Post 140. Seems like a reach. Would like more reads and depth from his posts. A majority of them aren't helpful to town imo.

JV, one question for ya when you're up if you don't mind: you mentioned this being mediocre, could you unpack that a little?

It was posted pretty early in the game so I can understand why it's not a strong, high probability of accuracy readlist for sure. But do you think it's underwhelming in a way that makes it fake, or is it equally/more likely to just come from someone trying their best at a point in the game where there's not enough content to have concrete reads?

Sorry if this sounds a little abstract (and I'm fully risking coming across as condescending here so if I am, just give me a book). So to speak, town wincon is to find and lynch mafia, not to systematically lynch players who are underwhelming/underperforming. Mafia can be found by their need to make shit up in a way which is designed to look towny; the way they manipulate the gamestate in order to make themselves / partners hard to lynch and townies easy to mislynch; etc.

So besides finding the readlist underwhelming. Do you think Uncrowned is doing scummy things or things which benefit scum wincon?

I want a check on this because I like Uncrowned's d2.


pedit: hold on do we have 3 Aussies here? the fuck

[the worst]

We all need to sleep, mornings are the best time to lynch scums

[Formerfish]

It's 945 my time. I'm going to bed too.

[teacher]

I’m grading.

[Uncrowned]

I get JV's point about the list being mediocre, that's cool. I don't think it was amazing or anything, but I too want him to expand on why he said it's meh.

I've seen 2 other readlists with similar quality behind them. Fuz's Post 479 and Gardenia's (Ethos' slot) Post 258.

I don't want to cause offense either and say they're not good, because this game has been tough. I like JV bringing up the readlists, but if he's aiming at me based on the quality, we need to be looking at multiple instances of it.

I made that mistake earlier too imo, singling out only Gyro's early game inactivity was poor reasoning, I agree. I should've analysed more and waited for Fuz to give us something, which is what I want to give her the chance to do now before we rush into votes again like we did D1.

[the worst]

I'm still so sad it was Gyro who died d1. I felt so good about that read :<

[Formerfish]

VOTE: Fuz

This is where we landed.

[Micc]

Votecount 2.05

Fuzanglong (3) -

the worst, Uncrowned, Formerfish

JacksonVirgo (1) -

eth0s

Not Voting (3) -

Fuzanglong, teacher, JacksonVirgo

With 7 players alive it takes 4 votes to lynch.

The deadline for Day 2 is in (expired on 2019-11-12 22:45:00).

[teacher]

intent in a day.

[teacher]

Bueller?

[Fuzanglong]

I mean i can't rly say much in my defense other than im a newb so if I die, I guess I die lol
I am town tho but I doubt that's gonna change anyone's mind lol
If someone can gimme a real concrete piece of evidence that I am scum, then I'll vote myself :3

[teacher]

So fmpov, JV is either pure town or paired with duck. I can see a world In Which duck knew it was a reaction test and coached JV on how to respond, but I don’t see a world in which duck is town and JV is scum given his reaction to that hammer test.

I need to go back and check my ethos-uncrowned associatives with ethos, but I remember thinking that was relatively unlikely last time I looked. So my suggestion if fthjs flips green is to lylo duck, and red to go (ethos incrowned).

I’m putting this out there now since the nk is fairly chained at this point.

[the worst]

Fuz - there is rarely "evidence" that players are scum. That's what makes this game so delicious. At the moment consensus is that you are scum - most of us have spoken a fair bit as to why.

If we're wrong could you help us see it? - excluding yourself, teacher and Formerfish, could you tell me the strength of your reads roughly?

[the worst]

@teach- after the hammertest (JV's reaction wasn't scummy but wasn't super towny either) I literally coached JV on how to respond to what was happening in this thread and they took another path. THAT looked pure to me. No effort to try and pocket me when I reached out or change the way they presented after they were run to L-1 at a point when the thermometer of the game was soaring.

Not powerscum play but I think it comes a lot more often from town who is exasperated/somewhat isolated in the gamestate.

I'm stuck on mobile. was posting too fast to coach them effectively in realtime without a discord. the only suggestion I made was itt to post fast with all of their thoughts.

What's the point of this post? Who knows. JV and I aren't aligned but I don't think they're scum anyway.

[teacher]

Eh that’s a fair take. Either way I agree that they >you on the town meter

Be well.

[JacksonVirgo]

My reads thus far

Town Leans

Datisi

- Liked his slot when Salad was playing it. Unvoted me when fast wagon occured, seemed like a town play. Questions and digs for info in his posts.

FormerFish

- Aggressive townplay imo, made a good connection in post 118 between bugspray's former slot (Chib) and a past game they had played.

Teacher

- I like the logic behind post 102 with the whole idea of "how does this benefit town?". I'm leaning toward Teacher/Fish being a TvT situation.

Gardenia

- After reading back, I like post 150 - except for including Fish in the trio, since he voted Teacher way before back on Page 1. I believe the vote on me was when we started "redoing" the RVS.

Null

Jackson Virgo

- Would like to see more activity. Don't really like his assessment of my vote on Gyro in Post 222 but I don't think that means anything.

Bugspray

- I don't mind this slot, since Chib was at least attempting to get things to progress earlier in the game. Fish's point about this slot in post 118 is a good one, but I'm not certain it's scum indicative.

Scum Leans

Marionette

- Little input, random vote on Teacher seemed out of place. Admittedly, we were redoing the RVS, but Teacher had been one of the more active players up until that point, so voting him without saying anything is odd to me.

Gyro

- Don't like his votes (Teacher, Gardenia) nor his reasoning in Post 140. Seems like a reach. Would like more reads and depth from his posts. A majority of them aren't helpful to town imo.

JV, one question for ya when you're up if you don't mind: you mentioned this being mediocre, could you unpack that a little?

It was posted pretty early in the game so I can understand why it's not a strong, high probability of accuracy readlist for sure. But do you think it's underwhelming in a way that makes it fake, or is it equally/more likely to just come from someone trying their best at a point in the game where there's not enough content to have concrete reads?

Sorry if this sounds a little abstract (and I'm fully risking coming across as condescending here so if I am, just give me a book). So to speak, town wincon is to find and lynch mafia, not to systematically lynch players who are underwhelming/underperforming. Mafia can be found by their need to make shit up in a way which is designed to look towny; the way they manipulate the gamestate in order to make themselves / partners hard to lynch and townies easy to mislynch; etc.

So besides finding the readlist underwhelming. Do you think Uncrowned is doing scummy things or things which benefit scum wincon?

I want a check on this because I like Uncrowned's d2.


pedit: hold on do we have 3 Aussies here? the fuck

Okay so I am awake now and has a bit more brain juice than last night.

Like mine, I know that, his reads aren't really anything special and mainly they labeled obvious reads. I don't necessarily think that Uncrowned is scum, he's new I believe and is acting similar to how I have been (if I take away the salt lol). Fuz however I feel is scum.

Considering Uncrowned plays ToS and Ultimate Werewolf I assume they have deduction skills even at the very minor margin even if they haven't played FM before this.

However the read on Marionette (now fuz I believe) is telling me a bit but I won't add on to that just yet.

Did that answer the question at all?

[JacksonVirgo]

Okay so looking at the information given.

Masons:

Teacher + FormerFish

Confirmed Vanilla Townies:

(from my pov)

JV, bugspray (dead), gyro (dead)

All possible scum:

• Fuz
  
• Uncrowned
  
• Eth0s
  
• the worst

Uncrowned matches my thoughts

-uncrowed

the worst seems towny as heck with that hammer test thing

-the worst

Leaving Eth0s and Fuz in my current scumlist. It could very well be Fuz/Uncrowned but regardless Fuz is in both so Ima vote them.
VOTE: Fuzanglong

[Formerfish]

I mean i can't rly say much in my defense other than im a newb so if I die, I guess I die lol
I am town tho but I doubt that's gonna change anyone's mind lol
If someone can gimme a real concrete piece of evidence that I am scum, then I'll vote myself :3

Teacher, hammer this.

[Formerfish]

Fair enough.

[JacksonVirgo]

Wait, did I just hammer that?