Micro 900: Autumnal Mafia (Game Complete)

[Luca Blight]

Luca what did you think of this idea:

One could make the argument that scum wouldn't want to throw shade at their partner if their partner is a widely accepted TR. If you and Ico were partners, then you two were already popular town reads through most of days 1-2 so the town cred gained from distancing might not be worth the risk of attracting unwanted attention to each other.

You asked me how I played as scum and I said I naturally distance. It doesn't matter if my partner is widely TR or not, I like to distance anyway.

I hate WIFOM speculation, but that's exactly what you're doing by putting so much emphasis on the night kills. You thought it was me/Datisi yesterday based on night-kills, that's now been proven wrong but still you persist with this theory. Can't you judge me and emps by our actual play this game?

I know that night-kill analysis always needs to be taken with a grain of salt. In general, I just don't believe that scum teams go for the unexpected/wifomy kill as often as people think they do.

It feels like you're starting to get impatient with me again. My reads have never been based purely on night-kills. I didn't think it was you/Datisi very long (seeing as I voted to lynch Ico yesterday). And half of our conversation tonight has been based on your actual play this game.

Yes you eventually voted to lynch Icon, but I get the feeling it wasn't until the very end that you actually started to SR him. You seemed to think it was me/Datisi for at least half of the day.

Why would me/Icon not kill Datisi? Icon/emps makes more sense as I said given it aligns with the doc claim and Datisi was protective of emps until LYLO.

Furthermore, who has more reason to kill Datisi last night, scum!me or scum!emps?

[Wickedestjr]

I pushed Aldu when he had zero votes - that's not path of least resistance. It doesn't matter if he attacked me first, that's beyond my control.

I just think it's interesting that your only unique vote was in response to someone calling you out for being on the side lines (and that person was the person you uniquely voted).

I wasn't lazy D2 - it was a particular situation where I was at least 90% sure Pops was the right lynch. I didn't want to push her SR Icon because I thought he was Tracker. Both of my TR's had no interest going anywhere near emps, and Icon warned off pushing Alim. Given I thought Icon was Tracker, what was I supposed to do here? I felt for sure Pops was the best lynch, and as I said I stand by that.

How confident were you that pops would flip scum? You say you were 90% sure she was the right lynch - how much of that was just because of the informational benefit?

You left out me. Why didn't you put more pressure on me during day 2? And even if your TRs were uninterested in an emps lynch, I think you could have given him more attention.

[Wickedestjr]

Why would me/Icon not kill Datisi?

I can think of at least two reasons:

2) Icon has a lot of experience with Datisi and probably thought he could manipulate that
3) Datisi was a very convenient 'target' for a doc claim.

Furthermore, who has more reason to kill Datisi last night, scum!me or scum!emps?

I would say the Datisi kill is slightly more likely to come from emps-scum.

[Luca Blight]

I pushed Aldu when he had zero votes - that's not path of least resistance. It doesn't matter if he attacked me first, that's beyond my control.

I just think it's interesting that your only unique vote was in response to someone calling you out for being on the side lines (and that person was the person you uniquely voted).

Is it not natural to have some suspicion of someone who shades you based on poor reasoning? And I had more to my Aldu case than his attack on me.

I wasn't lazy D2 - it was a particular situation where I was at least 90% sure Pops was the right lynch. I didn't want to push her SR Icon because I thought he was Tracker. Both of my TR's had no interest going anywhere near emps, and Icon warned off pushing Alim. Given I thought Icon was Tracker, what was I supposed to do here? I felt for sure Pops was the best lynch, and as I said I stand by that.

How confident were you that pops would flip scum? You say you were 90% sure she was the right lynch - how much of that was just because of the informational benefit?

You left out me. Why didn't you put more pressure on me during day 2? And even if your TRs were uninterested in an emps lynch, I think you could have given him more attention.

I wasn't very sure, maybe 50%, but I felt like I needed that slot out of the game, it would have been a massive distraction in LYLO.

Icon hard TR you D2, and I thought he was the Tracker based on this. I thought it must be PR related and I therefore didn't want to draw too much attention to it.

And maybe I should have given emps more attention - that's hindsight for you. But I felt confident in my TR's at the time and was willing to follow their judgement while other dubious slots existed. You can see I did challenge Datisi and Icon a couple of times regarding emps.

[Luca Blight]

Why would me/Icon not kill Datisi?

I can think of at least two reasons:

2) Icon has a lot of experience with Datisi and probably thought he could manipulate that
3) Datisi was a very convenient 'target' for a doc claim.

Regarding number three - me and Icon as scum wouldn't have known a doc existed - in fact, given the Tracker and FN (that Icon knew about) it would have been very likely that no other PR's existed from our PoV.

Datisi is very convenient for a fake doc claim, however, given how TR she was.

[Wickedestjr]

Going to sleep now. Thank you for all those answers. This has been a helpful conversation.

One last thing: 'information' appeared to be one of your reasons for lynching pops on day 2? Can you show me any other town games where you have advocated 'information' lynching on days after day 1?


I want to take some more time to do some more rereading/digging. So I might be a little quiet in this thread for the next day or two.

[Luca Blight]

It was as much about getting rid of a dubious slot that would be a distraction in LYLO as for information. I'll see if I can find anything.

One more thing: I feel you've been quite critical of my D2 play, but you didn't actually push anything on D2 yourself despite not SR'ing Pops. Perhaps if you look back at that then you could relate to my stance a bit more.

[Luca Blight]

I posted this on D2 of a previous game:

Icon and Klick are near enough conf-Town for me; I’m not considering their lynches for the foreseeable future.

Today we must Lynch either A50 or Uzi - not only is there a high chance at least one of them is scum,

but the thought of them both being alive during a LYLO situation is hard to bear

.

Same kind of idea - getting rid of dubious slots before LYLO.

[Plum]

Votecount 4.2

emps

- 1 (Luca Blight)

Luca Blight

- 1 (emps)

Not Voting

- 1 (Wickedestjr)

With 3 alive it takes 2 votes to lynch.

Deadline:

(expired on 2019-12-07 19:00:00)

[emps]

My biggest issue with emps is his lack of interest in scum hunting on days 2-3.

im not trying to solve the game that much because i dont rly like want to i guess

the 1st 20 pages and the fuckfest the rest of this game has been hasnt exactly made me want to play the game more

emps, I find this explanation hard to believe. I agree that the first 20 pages of this game kinda sucked. But that was 80+ pages ago. I feel like the Mena/Wimpy thing is very much in the past.

And it also didn't seem like your effort level dropped until a few days later.

What can you say to convince me this explanation is true?

well, i kinda usually have problem w losing effort midway through games

but it usually doesnt take place till later

i was forcing myself to effort through the first few irl days of this game

[Wickedestjr]

One more thing: I feel you've been quite critical of my D2 play, but you didn't actually push anything on D2 yourself despite not SR'ing Pops. Perhaps if you look back at that then you could relate to my stance a bit more.

Honestly I feel like our stances were completely opposite. I think you're still missing my point.

You put Pops at L-1 in spite of having some doubts, just because your strong TRs weren't allowing any other lynch that you would be interested in. I never pushed anything because the day ended before I even got the chance - I had asked someone to un-vote so I could have time.

[Wickedestjr]

the ico maf informed flip makes me think that ico was informed abt a backup tracker and they nked aldu n1 so then luca was able to fakeclaim informed town n1

emps, can you explain this again?


And can you name/show me another game of your's where you lost interest like this?

[Wickedestjr]

It all comes down to this lynch emps. I know it's not your decision, but you're making it pretty tough on me if you're town. Why should I be townreading you right now? If you're feeling up to it, tell me whatever you can to convince me that I shouldn't vote for you right now.

[Luca Blight]

One more thing: I feel you've been quite critical of my D2 play, but you didn't actually push anything on D2 yourself despite not SR'ing Pops. Perhaps if you look back at that then you could relate to my stance a bit more.

Honestly I feel like our stances were completely opposite. I think you're still missing my point.

You put Pops at L-1 in spite of having some doubts, just because your strong TRs weren't allowing any other lynch that you would be interested in. I never pushed anything because the day ended before I even got the chance - I had asked someone to un-vote so I could have time.

Fair enough, but you had the benefit of knowing why Icon had switched his read on you, I didn't and thought it was because he was the Tracker, which influenced the decisions I made on D2.

emps suddenly ending the day was something beyond my control. I wanted a claim from Pops as I thought it was necessary to progress at that point. If she'd claimed VT then yes, she would most probably have been lynched anyway, but again I had no way of knowing this at the time.

[Luca Blight]

I haven't played with emps before, but I refer back to this from Datisi:

while emps was a tonal/PoE TR. That quickhammer is simply bad, the Doc claim doesn't make sense, and the crumb is so odd.

Plus I know he often loses motivation as scum late-game,

and here he's barely existant.

[Luca Blight]

It all comes down to this lynch emps. I know it's not your decision, but you're making it pretty tough on me if you're town.

His gameplan ever since the quickhammer on Pops has been to do nothing and hope the idea that

'scum wouldn't play so bad'

would save him.

Icon used the same kind of defence on D3 with

'I was all over the place

'.

[Wickedestjr]

Fair enough, but

you had the benefit of knowing why Icon had switched his read on you

, I didn't and thought it was because he was the Tracker, which influenced the decisions I made on D2.

True.

[Wickedestjr]

I can't believe it, but I'm actually coming around to an Ico/emps team... after I spent so much energy arguing against it yesterday.

What a game...

[Wickedestjr]

Hmm. Luca, it's interesting to me that you were so adamant about how you would have distanced from Ico if you were scum given that it seems like you have a tendency to distance whenever you are scum. You're telling me that, as scum, you would just follow your typical routine and distance from Ico? Do you never mix it up at all and town read a partner?

The other interesting part of this is that you said you would go with the flow as scum but that you also would have distanced from Ico (which would have gone 'against the flow' given that Ico was a popular TR).

[Luca Blight]

As I said I haven't played much as scum for a long time, but I generally like to distance/have arguments with my partner as it's easy to look busy that while while not making too many enemies. I guess I might mix it up of course, but that's how I would generally play as scum.

And 'go witb the flow' is how I would imagine my newer scum play style to be, as I prefer playing as Town and find it hard to stay engaged as scum. Again, I haven't played much as scum for a long time so it's all hypothetical really.

[Luca Blight]

I can't believe it, but I'm actually coming around to an Ico/emps team... after I spent so much energy arguing against it yesterday.

What a game...

That's why I was feeling frustrated Yesterday, because fmpov Icon/emps was always the most likely team, and when I saw you had it as your least likely team I thought the game was lost.

[Wickedestjr]

Random thought: I wonder if Ico knew there was a FN in the game before I had even targeted him...

[Wickedestjr]

All the other investigative roles have some sort of weakness to them. Alduskkel was seemingly a backup to nothing. Luca didn’t get his info until after night 1. Maybe my weakness was that my role’s ability was not a complete secret to scum.

And Ico’s play at start of day 2 (saying “we’re not lynching Wicked” or putting me at the top of his reads list) could have been an attempt to broadcast to his partner that I was the FN. If his partner already knew that there was a FN, then they may have gotten the hint.

[Wickedestjr]

I’m probably gonna cast my vote tomorrow morning.

[Wickedestjr]

Alright here it comes...