Newbie 1973 | Mountain | Over

[Pine]

Pine replaces Nomanssky101! Please welcome him!

Thanks, great to be here. I’ll catch up over the weekend.

Spoiler:

Oh you big flirt!

[Plotinus]

Official Vote Count 1.09

Mount Asgard, Baffin Mountains, Canada

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Lynching

With 9 votes in play, it takes 5 to lynch.

chazary

(3): Mitillos, Farren, ArthurConyl

EspeciallyTheLies

(2): CheekyTeeky, chazary

CheekyTeeky

(1): EspeciallyTheLies

Mitillos

(1): PenguinPower

Not Voting

(2): Ph0enix, Pine

Deadline:

(expired on 2019-12-21 08:00:00).

Mod notes:

Mitillos replaced Gyro Zeppeli; Pine replaced Nomanssky101.

PenguinPower is V/LA until Sunday

Every few weeks, mafiaScum hosts a Song Contest. It's a fun way to share music you like and find new music. Entries are due on the 20th for this one.[/area]

[CheekyTeeky]

How do you judge my interactions with Arthur, given how you've said you'd handle this as scum?

Fine. I have implied you were voting to apply pressure after you noticed your questions weren't being answered. I think your unvote of Gyro kind of bothered me more so I'm still evaluating your voting pattern and reads to confirm you're applying pressure as town. Right now I feel there are more suspicious slots so I'm comfortable lumping you in the town basket at the moment.

[CheekyTeeky]

Yay a full game. Welcome Pine.

[Ph0enix]

Dodging the question how? You asked if I had any townreads. I gave you the townreads I had. This is a bad accusation.
If you don't find my answer to be satisfactory, that's what follow-up questions are for. You didn't ask any here. Why?
There's more information since post 100, yes, but none of that information led to new townreads at the time. Specifically:
Your question was at post 180.

Players active between posts 100 and 180:

PenguinPower (townread)
Gyro (didn't townread, got banned)
chazary (didn't townread)
Ph0enix (townread, but noted that I was continuing to work on the read)
CheekyTeeky (townread)
ArthurConyl (didn't townread)
ETL (didn't townread)

The more interesting stuff as far as my townreads go occurred after post 180:

Mitillos's entrance (183 / 197) - modified read on the Gyro / Mitillos slot from scummy to Town.
ETL's response in 186 - some iffy stuff, but some good stuff too. Tentative Town, pending the re-read of Cheeky.
Cheeky's response in 229 - notably increased likelihood of one scum between Cheeky / ETL.

Fair enough, valid explanation, I suppose I should have asked you about reads in general and not only townreads. But you did update your townreads, despite it being after I'd already asked the question, so I appreciate that.

Possible Town: Mitillos, Cheeky, PP
Unknown: ESL, Nomanssky101
Possible scum: Farren, Arthur, Chazary

Would you mind elaborating on your penguin read?

Given the explanation Farren gave above, I'm moving him to possible Town, based on all the other information about him, now that that's sorted out. As for Penguin:

PP and Cheeky are fine, both are being responsive and give fair explanations of their actions (although I'm waiting for Cheeky to explain the townread on chazary).

It's still the same, basically. It's not a lot, I know, and it's subject to change after I read the whole discussion between ETL and PP.

Then, later, I voted Chazary because by that point votes actually had done a pretty solid job of making people talk. So I voted him in order to get him involved in the conversation. However, my vote on Chazary was followed by a completely random vote on Arthur, followed by a completely random vote on PP (both by Chazary, but still). This made me think whether my vote could actually help me learn something this time. Unlike the situation in the first posts with the first couple of votes, this was no longer the case, a simple vote wasn't going to cut it.

So I decided to unvote Chazary in order to avoid starting some kind of wagon as with Gyro

. Also, I'm really curious as do when do you think Cheeky "questioned me" prior to me unvoting Chazary.

Why do you want to avoid starting wagons? Or is it something specific about not wanting to start a wagon on chazary specifically?

Oh no, it's not player-related. I'm just not a fan of them during RVS, I don't believe they do a good job in providing people with information, and in our case, considering we're in a Newbie game, some players who are less experienced and are at the receiving end of a wagon may panic and slip up because of that, regardless of alignment, which, considering the ratio between Town and Mafia players, is not in Town's favor.

[Ph0enix]

Also, welcome, Pine!

[ArthurConyl]

@Ph0enix please note that I wasn't trying to prove you were scum but I was just giving an explanation for suspecting you. Farren asked me if I had any reads and asked me why I thought Ph0enix was suspect. I just explained my reasoning to him. I don't think you're scummier than ETL and Chazary.

[ArthurConyl]

VOTE: chazary

Imagine this vote in a bikini. Can't have it being charged with indecent exposure or something. Or maybe a strategically placed cloud passing by in just the right spots.

It looks like Mitillos and Darren want to lynch Chazary. It looks like a coupla other guys (including me) want to lynch ETL. While I think both of them are suspect, we should agree on one person, the most suspect person, to lynch. I think some good points have been made about Chazary. I want to hear more from him. VOTE: Chazary

Also to explain why I voted for Chazary, I initally was voting for ETL but I saw we weren't getting anywhere, so I switched to Chazary. I wasn't trying to lynch anyone, I just switched so there'd be a better chance of getting a read out of someone.

[Ph0enix]

Okay, so:

As for the discussion between PP and ETL, ETL's arguments against PP were, to a great extent, unfounded, such as him "harassing" me to unvote, despite him not harassing me and me not voting at that time, and also the argument that he is defending Cheeky, which was (almost) solely based on one quote which she messed up during her post, somehow.

As for ETL vs. Cheeky:

I agree that ETL's contradicting herself, given the fact that she said Cheeky was trying to "set up a distance from a buddy" and putting Gyro/Mitillos in Town on her readslist.

I believe both are making too much of their votes against each other, given the fact that we were still in RVS back then.

And that's about it. Overall, PP, now that I read that discussion as well, has still not given me a reason for me to think he's scum, so that's good.

Something's really bugging me when it comes to ETL. Unfounded accusation of PP, followed by what is to me an unfounded accusation of Cheeky as well, makes me want to put him in "possible scum" territory.

As for Cheeky, solid defense.

[Ph0enix]

@Ph0enix please note that I wasn't trying to prove you were scum but I was just giving an explanation for suspecting you. Farren asked me if I had any reads and asked me why I thought Ph0enix was suspect. I just explained my reasoning to him. I don't think you're scummier than ETL and Chazary.

So I'll assume my response was unsatisfactory and you still suspect me. Quite interesting.

[CheekyTeeky]

some players who are less experienced and are at the receiving end of a wagon may panic and slip up because of that, regardless of alignment, which, considering the ratio between Town and Mafia players, is not in Town's favor.

I like this, it explains a fair bit about the hesitancy I read in your play.

[CheekyTeeky]

PP becomes easier to read as the day goes on as I've found he struggles to stay genuinely engaged as scum. I'm becoming suspicious.

[Ph0enix]

VOTE: chazary

Imagine this vote in a bikini. Can't have it being charged with indecent exposure or something. Or maybe a strategically placed cloud passing by in just the right spots.

It looks like Mitillos and Darren want to lynch Chazary. It looks like a coupla other guys (including me) want to lynch ETL. While I think both of them are suspect, we should agree on one person, the most suspect person, to lynch. I think some good points have been made about Chazary. I want to hear more from him. VOTE: Chazary

Also to explain why I voted for Chazary, I initally was voting for ETL but I saw we weren't getting anywhere, so I switched to Chazary. I wasn't trying to lynch anyone, I just switched so there'd be a better chance of getting a read out of someone.

Given the fact that your sole argument against her had to do with a RVS vote, what did you think your vote was going to accomplish? Also, I still miss what was the actual reason you voted Chazary (unless it was a RVS vote, which would be questionable, considering we were out of RVS by that point, imo). Please quote the post if I've missed it, and explain if not.

[Mitillos]

@ETL: Oh. I feel old now. But then that makes it even weirder that you'd bring up people being coached. By definition, you wouldn't be able to see this happening, unless you were in the mafia PT, so you wouldn't be able to tell if someone is or is not being coached. As such, determining that someone isn't being coached seems either spurious or suspicious.

Also, I'm starting to like Chazary more, from his recent posts. If he is scum, that daytalk is really great for coaching.

@Pine: Hello.

@Phoenix: So, are you down to two possible scumreads? If so, why are you not voting for one of them? If not, how else have your reads changed?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Quickly skimmed for now as I’m quite busy today/tonight. First of

HI PINE!! <3

Secondly, to whoever gave me shit for PPs pronoun, pronouns change. I’ve been around this site for a long while and I have a great affinity for PP.

Third, I think Cheeky’s assessment of my catchup post is incredibly disingenuous and more of a misrep than she is tying to say mine is. I gave my honest thought process as I read posts. My first post was intended to gain reactions. I do it every single game. Go look at any of my past town games. Do some damn research. If you don’t like my style I honestly do not care because my methods work for me and I’m not changing them until I see I need to.

Farren, I was saying that if he was scum I’d expect less off the cuff posting. Coaching implies in a PT, which I even said in the post. Go look. I’m mobile or I would go grab it and show you. I am getting frustrated at the fact that people don’t seem to understand simple things such as the fact that my comment about cheeky setting g up a distance was a possible explanation for what I was seeing. Whether t is or not remains to be seen. I would think that was obvious. If I’m responding to a post and offering ideas it’s because I’m trying to figure out possibilities and hoping others will engage in the discussion.

Cheeky, you have not engaged me at all either so do not even try thathypocritial bullshit. I have asked plenty of questions for you to respond to, you have yet to explain anything I’ve brought up except to try to spin it into a case against me. How about taking responsibility for the actions that gave me the impressions I had in the first place? It’s a dodging technique and it’s not towny at all.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Something's really bugging me when it comes to ETL. Unfounded accusation of PP, followed by what is to me an unfounded accusation of Cheeky as well, makes me want to put him in "possible scum" territory.

How the fuck is t unfounded when I SHOWED EXCATLY WHAT POSTS GAVE ME THAT IMPRESSION? Like who the hell are you to tell me what I’m seeing isn’t there? What are you even saying? Like where are you pulling this garbage from? Are you just making it up to sound like you’re involved and doing town things?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Also shame on you cheeky for throwing shade on me for wanting to get rid of gyro. He was toxic AF. If I was intent on pushing policy lynches I would have fucking voted him AND YET I DIDNT EH? but sure. Shame on me for mentioning it lol

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Everything you have said about me is twisted bullshit and it makes me more and more confident my read is correct.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I’m your biggest threat. So of course you’re going to try to misrep everything I say instead of explaining why I’m wrong.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

with so much evidence. Seems like grasping at straws.

You realize this doesn’t make any sense, right? If I provided evidence to support my read, how the fuck is it “grasping at straws”?

[Farren]

223 reminded me ... Cheeky, did you ever get around to explaining what you were thinking on this, and the scumread you had prior to this?

Post 221

On re-read: yup, 221 covers initial scumread ... then tonal change triggering read change. Thanks; sorry for missing it.

[Farren]

How do you judge my interactions with Arthur, given how you've said you'd handle this as scum?

Fine. I have implied you were voting to apply pressure after you noticed your questions weren't being answered. I think your unvote of Gyro kind of bothered me more so I'm still evaluating your voting pattern and reads to confirm you're applying pressure as town. Right now I feel there are more suspicious slots so I'm comfortable lumping you in the town basket at the moment.

My style of pressure tends to involve lots of questions, with those questions relaxing as I townread people, or sharpening as I scumread them.

As a personal preference, I don't like pressuring people that have just replaced in. Give 'em a chance to catch up and see what's going on. Regardless of what my alignment is or what I think their alignment is.

Sometimes the gamestate doesn't allow for that, but it's a rare gamestate on D1 where that's the case.

[Farren]

Oh no, it's not player-related. I'm just not a fan of them during RVS, I don't believe they do a good job in providing people with information, and in our case, considering we're in a Newbie game, some players who are less experienced and are at the receiving end of a wagon may panic and slip up because of that, regardless of alignment, which, considering the ratio between Town and Mafia players, is not in Town's favor.

Astute point.

Pressure can cause scum to panic. But it can also cause Town to panic as well. Trying to distinguish between the two ... still working on that.

I don't know that RVS matters so much as far as that's concerned, though?

[CheekyTeeky]

Cheeky, you have not engaged me at all either so do not even try thathypocritial bullshit. I have asked plenty of questions for you to respond to, you have yet to explain anything I’ve brought up except to try to spin it into a case against me. How about taking responsibility for the actions that gave me the impressions I had in the first place? It’s a dodging technique and it’s not towny at all.

I feel like you're reading a different game. I engaged you by voting you in retaliation to your unexplained vote. You started it therefore you are the hypocrite for accusing me of not engaging. Give me one question you have directed at me that has not been answered?
I have responded to your impressions.
I'm not dodging and have dedicated my longest post to you...like what the actual eff are you talking about?

[CheekyTeeky]

I’m your biggest threat. So of course you’re going to try to misrep everything I say instead of explaining why I’m wrong.

LOL I don't even know who you are and am not threatened by this mystery person tunnelling me.