Mainstream Mafia II: D&D Edition [FIN]

[Almost50]

If UT is scum then he's the Aasimar woman. We know Amrun was telling the truth about her lists, so fmpv I'm either wrong on the Aasimar woman flavour or UT is guilty.

I thought you thought UT was suspect of being the Cult Leader.

[Almost50]

Hey, Elements. Can you claim if you leave when we hit 10 players so I can check that?

If this is the case then we should just leash Elements and wait for him and ML to leave at that point in time. It does 'waste' one of my shots but it would get that out of the way for good.

I'm curious if what happens if Elements ended up killing ML.

[Elements]

I think chenn is scum here

[EspressoPatronum]

I'm not necessarily asking you to play to live, I'm asking you to play to help us kill the CL.

OK. So, in order to "play ball" I am telling you honestly that I am NOT the Cult Leader (nor have I been culted up to this point).

Rauth "could" be it, but I doubt it. The way he went "state your win con" would have benefited the Cult recognizing their safe targets (assuming he is a Lie Detector). He could have even falsely cleared someone if that was the case. The reason I doubt it is he has set himself up to die before the game is over for certain. Unless the Cultists do NOT commit suicide upon the lynch of their Leader I find that an impossible route to take from the Cult Leader. Even if they don't (suicide) he should not have doubled down in it when the 1st 3 members of his Cult went down in the opening 3 cycles.

UT I can't argue mechanically for him, but I maintain my read on the slot is TOWN by play.

IMHO, the Cult leader is in these 4:

1- DEB: I googled Viqtor Lionheart (his flavour) and was redirected to this page. I noticed this character has "minions". It's not exactly "undeniable evidence" but it's very much a clue.

2- davesaz: Hasn't been doing much (I know.. I know.. kettle/pot) and I have not much info on him either. Has he been checked by ANYONE?

3- Xofelf: As silly as it is, giving us the count of living cultists us the most accurate statement a Cult Leader can give. They can't go wrong in this one.

4- Pink Ball: This is admittedly as low a probability as it is for UT to be the Cult Leader. I just seem to have it down that they claimed Benevolent 3P at some point. (I don't even remember where I got that from. Probably Nero or Bingle when they were trying to catch me up whne I joined the game??)

If I were you I'd kill one of DEB/dave and lynch the other (unless your vig ends the day, which would be bollocks). I'm like 70-80% it's one of the two.

Happy?

Thanks for taking the time to help. To clarify, the dayvig won't end the day. I want to get as much information on the table today as possible becahse we have two chances to hit the CL.

Regarding your list:
0. Rauth can't be the CL. Rauth has an unCC'd jailed claim on N1. The night flavour supports this claim.

1. Interesting point about DEB. The link you posted is about final fantasy though, and I don't see any reason to believe this game is pulling on an lore outside of D&D and Pathfinder (which are effectively the same game).

2. I agree that davesaz hasn't been doing much. Hell, he's even been pretty scummy, as I pointed out in my push on him earlier today. Gobble has RC's letter about davesaz though, which suggests dave is town.

3. Xofelf is another good suggestion. Per the night flavour, however, xofelf appears to be the old man etching ash marks into the tower wall. Meanwhile, the N3 flavour heavily suggests the cult leader is a snake lady (as gobble has already demonstrated earlier). Both of these points suggest it is highly unlikely that xofelf is the CL.

4. PB is mod-confirmed inno child. He can't be the CL.

So in my eyes, that circles back to you, chenn, and maybe UT. As you mention in a later post (which I'll address in a sec), I have some reservations about UT as CL.

[Cephrir]

VOTE: UT

Choooo choooo

What’s our thought on turkey? That “let the CL live” tripe is sus af

How many if UT's checks are still alive? Because if we lynch him and he flips what he says he is then -at least- you'd want to use that list to clear a few players from being the Cult Leader.

Disclaimer: NOT saying we should lynch UT though. I am saying that you do NOT want to do it without considering your next move if he flips P.O. (A Cult Cop is a Private Investigator. Right? The wiki doesn't have a page for that, but I seem to remember the Role from Great/Greatest Idea Mafia)

i wish you would either read the game or stop trying to discuss mechanics

[Cephrir]

So, in order to "play ball" I am telling you honestly that I am NOT the Cult Leader

oh okay never mind then you're free to go

[Cephrir]

Just a thought, overrelying on flavor is the surest way to lose ya?

It's clearly a mechanic in this game given the number of flavor cops

[EspressoPatronum]

If UT is scum then he's the Aasimar woman. We know Amrun was telling the truth about her lists, so fmpv I'm either wrong on the Aasimar woman flavour or UT is guilty.

I thought you thought UT was suspect of being the Cult Leader.

You're right. He's kind of both. Here's my thoughts on him below:

TL;DR - my read on him is a big question mark.

I really dislike the heavy use of flavor to determine alignment here. We saw an orc flip Town and others flip scum. Further, role name tells us exactly fuck-all with regard to the cult.

An aasimar aligned with a cult themed around Ascension? That’s not even contradictory.

This reeks of disliking something because you don't understand it. Flavour absolutely is helpful in this game, just like it was in MM1. If you don't believe me, go read chk's write-ups in the MM1 dead thread explaining his night flavour: https://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/UN89s2YayTD

But back to this game:

Nobody is saying all orcs are evil.
Nobody is saying all goblins are evil.

All I'm saying is the flavour suggests an Aasimar woman killed FF. If that is true, and it is also true that we haven't found the Aasimar woman yet, then FF's killer is still alive.

The kills are all heavily flavoured to suggest which faction carried out the kill, and FF's death does not imply a cult kill. Spelling it out -- this might be wrong, but we have reason to believe it's right.

If (1) the Aasimar woman is alive, (2) Amrun's list is accurate, (3) the Aasimar woman killed FF, and (4) FF wasn't killed by cult, then we can assume UT is scum and not cult.

Since I don't know if all of that is correct I'm left with, "I'm either wrong on the Aasimar woman flavour or UT is guilty," which is exactly what I said earlier.

All that being said, there's a possiblity of Korina being a shapeshifter who could xform into the Aasimar woman, which would mean the list isn't useful anymore and none of the above is useful.

Better to focus on A50 today imo.

[Cephrir]

0. Rauth can't be the CL. Rauth has an unCC'd jailed claim on N1. The night flavour supports this claim.

i wouldn't say can't. maybe recruiting is unblockable or some shit.

[Cephrir]

@ep what if you dayvigged elements

[Cephrir]

or, and this is my preference, elements could play to his win condition instead

but unless he's lying about what his win condition is, that seems vanishingly unlikely at this time

[KidAmn]

0. Rauth can't be the CL. Rauth has an unCC'd jailed claim on N1. The night flavour supports this claim.

i wouldn't say can't. maybe recruiting is unblockable or some shit.

Well, everyone seems to be unblockable according to claims so v0v

[Almost50]

There's also davesaz. Maybe.

Also, UT has a flavor cop result?

Gobble got a message from RC saying Dave was town.

Let me rephrase that: A cultist is telling us he received a note that the Cult Leader is town-aligned, and we're supposed to believe him.

Don't forget not even RCE knows what's in the note he sent. It could be anything. Literally.

P-edit: F me! I saw PB

asking

to b revealed, but missed the actual mod-confirmation.

And if you insist I could be the CL, please shoot me NOW. Save me the trouble of efforting only to end up shot on the same day. Then when I flip, use your head (the one above your neck) and bloody lynch dave/DEB and have Elements kill the other (if the one you lynch doesn't flip CL).

What I am proposing though is that you

shoot

in dave/DEB, and lynch the other, and Elements can kill me at night instead, as I lose if I die by day and win if I die at night. Thank you very much.

[EspressoPatronum]

Just a thought, overrelying on flavor is the surest way to lose ya?

Do us both a favour and do a quick skim (5mins tops) of some of chk's earliest posts here:
https://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/UN89s2YayTD

You're right that overreliance on flavour is bad, but the role madness Mainstream Mafia series definitely uses flavour as an investigative tool for those paying close attention.

[EspressoPatronum]

@ep what if you dayvigged elements

I was considering it tbh. If anything, it would free up KidAmn to maybe find the CL with the JK.

I'd rather focus on sorting the unknowns right now, but I'm open to suggestions.

[Almost50]

Are you gonna answer EP’s question or are you guys just going to all delve into paranoia that I am the cult leader when I quite literally cannot be mechanically.

You are not the CL. Nobody accused you of being the CL. I am saying you have been

culted

last night. But keep on doing you

[Almost50]

I'm the Cult Leader

I'm in the Cult

I'm in the Cult

Guys! I've found the cult!

Good catch. You should totally shoot all 3 of them, starting with their Leader.

[Untrod Tripod]

so you guys are aware that BBmolla has already flavor copped me, right?

because it feels like some of you either are not aware of it or are deliberately ignoring it

[Bingle]

01. Pine - Motivator (Confirmed to exist)
09. BBmolla - Flavor Cop (Confirmed to Exist)
19. Pink Ball -- INNOCENT CHILD (Confirmed to exist)
23. RCEnigma - Messenger (Confirmed to Exist)
32. gobbledygook - Friendly Neighbor (Confirmed to Exist)
26. Elements - SK (Confirmed via night result and ML claim)

02. Untrod Tripod - PI
08. Rautherdir - Lie Detector
15. Bingle - FBI Agent
17. xofelf - Knows number of cult
25. Miss Lynch - Backup SK, makes SK viable to win with town.
34. chennisden - Faith Healer
28. pisskop - Random JoaT, flavor meshes
38. KidAmn - JK

18. Gamma Emerald (Not Cult N1)
33. Cephrir (Not Cult N2)

21. Dr Easy Bake
24. davesaz
36. Almost50
40. EspressoPatronum

I'm not sure if I missed any claims. If I did, please share. I think EP was confirmed via something, but I'm not sure what. Of category 2, KA can be confirmed to exist via targeting someone who has a tangible night result. (Myself, perhaps?) Xof, ML, Chen, and pk have minor equity as cult leader/scum. DEB, Dave, A50, EP similar.

[Untrod Tripod]

xof is NOT CULT

[Almost50]

Claiming intent to shoot A50 unless I see a full claim (role + flavour) or some significant strides in helping us find the CL.

You have approximately 24 hours, A50.

I take back my claim, and I blatantly refuse to cooperate under the circumstances. I a not one to submit to threats. Go ahead and shoot me. End of.

[EspressoPatronum]

There's also davesaz. Maybe.

Also, UT has a flavor cop result?

Gobble got a message from RC saying Dave was town.

Let me rephrase that: A cultist is telling us he received a note that the Cult Leader is town-aligned, and we're supposed to believe him.

Don't forget not even RCE knows what's in the note he sent. It could be anything. Literally.

Yeah, I believe gobble. I don't think he was recruited. I also have small reason to believe that IF davesaz is evil, he's more likely groupscum.

P-edit: F me! I saw PB

asking

to b revealed, but missed the actual mod-confirmation.

RIP. It happens.

And if you insist I could be the CL, please shoot me NOW. Save me the trouble of efforting only to end up shot on the same day. Then when I flip, use your head (the one above your neck) and bloody lynch dave/DEB and have Elements kill the other (if the one you lynch doesn't flip CL).

As frustrating as this probably is for you, I'd like to think I'm putting a fair amount of thought into it. I'm also giving you the due process of defending yourself instead of just spite shooting you once you scoffed at my dayvig threat.

I won't shoot you if you give me reason not to.

What I am proposing though is that you

shoot

in dave/DEB, and lynch the other, and Elements can kill me at night instead,

as I lose if I die by day and win if I die at night. Thank you very much

.

Interesting. What role is this? The more information you give me, the more likely it will be that I can find it in the flavour + clear you of being the CL.

[Bingle]

my first two recruits are always Bingle

This, btw, is a lie, but one I believe to be noncultindicative.

A50 absolutely would not have culted me because he would have been too concerned I was scum to risk it, (although he probably would have since I was confed), but town/scum A50 probably wouldn't have thought about that where cult A50 would be imminently aware that I wasn't a likely cult target early.

[EspressoPatronum]

Claiming intent to shoot A50 unless I see a full claim (role + flavour) or some significant strides in helping us find the CL.

You have approximately 24 hours, A50.

I take back my claim, and I blatantly refuse to cooperate under the circumstances. I a not one to submit to threats. Go ahead and shoot me. End of.

We're working together now. I posted that under the assumption that you weren't willing to work with me.

[KidAmn]

Since it seems prudent to restate it as one of the people Rauth hasn't claimed to have investigated:

I am Cobble-aligned. I am not aligned with the cult or any anti-Cobble faction. I share the Cobble wincon. My targets were as follows:
N1: Rautherdir, who has claimed not to be blocked this night.
N2: Flavor Leaf, now dead.
N3: Zoraster, now dead.
N4: Elements, claimed Nexus SK aligned with Miss Lynch.
N5: Elements

If Rauth uses any post other than this to lie detect me tonight, if he does so, it is tantamount to a scum/cultclaim. There is no reason to use any other post.

PEdit: If A50 refuses to claim just get it over with.