TM2020 - Large Theme - Gay Mafia IV: TOWN WIN

[Vex Vience]

ep’s probably townie because of that statement though. i dont think scum forgets they have a factional chat.

[chennisden]

skitter references Open 768 and notes Volpe's play is similar to his here. She is like 80% confident he flips red here.

My team agrees

[chennisden]

Btw my scumdar is pinging and it is pointing to volxen

[EspressoPatronum]

outing hood powers are bad. outing neighbors is ok, ig? i mean, it could possibly help nail down reads from people, and it would get dialogue about them open, but like, what incentive does scum have to shoot the all-town hoods, knowing it’ll give them their last-man standing? wouldn’t scum want to shoot into their own hoods for it?

based on the night reveal, let’s assume the writers are all town. scum knows that group is all town and when there’s only one left, they become a vigi. that’s bad for scum. someone can easily shoot and kill them at that point. whereas, if the hood has scum in it, wouldnt they want to shoot the others in the hood—ignoring the all-town hoods—to get the extra nk?

I like this response + it deserves a proper answer. I have to go for most of the day, but I'll get to this once I'm back tonight.

Rq though - if scum won't shoot all-town, then outing neighbours won't change that.

Scum already know who's in all-town because scum won't be in a hood with any of them. Scum just doesn't know the distribution.

[Gammagooey]

For the record, I refuse to give a shit about lynching in neighborhoods/not lynching in neighborhoods when it's going to be really, really easy for scum to coast on trying to lynch the theoretical scum in a neighborhood that might not even exist AND gives scum an out to not talk about/push on scummy people that don't happen to be in the neighborhood everyone is focused on. If there's a good reason to think that X is scum and they happen to be in a neighborhood that's good for mechanical bullshit then sure let's lynch them but focusing on the neighborhood over the actual play of the individual players is a bad plan.

gonna do this for now
VOTE: dave

Things I would like from other people

reads on dave (and in particular if you're townreading him can you explain why for me?)
SPICY reads (do you think your read is different from most people's on a particular player? tell me why!)
More general thoughts from anyone who has around the same amount of posts that I do or less
Top scum read (preferably with like a 2 sentence summary of why you think they're TOPSCUM)

If you do 2+ of these things for me you can tell me to reread a section of the game (not all of day 1 for my mental health) or a player and I will do so for you and give you my thoughts.

[nomnomnom]

I made a bit of homework regarding Volpe. Funny thing first and foremost is that he has no town games on this account except if I missed it lol

Had to check Nibbui/Fumuki/Yurrei. My conclusion is that a lot of his town games are a lot more calm, like even when he loses it a bit it's still very much neutral in terms of accusations. I have the impression that Volpe this game just rides people's asses with a million things.

Checked a few scumgames also. I realized that paranoia is a thing he uses often when he posts. He seems to display paranoia right now as well. So what I'm saying here is that he's entirely within his scumrange and has displayed a few traits from his scumgame.

Maybe I was right originally. Maybe. I'm going to take a deeper look and re-read his ISO but so far I guess maybe the scumread on him is right.

[kuribo]

ep’s probably townie because of that statement though. i dont think scum forgets they have a factional chat.

That's such an easy slip to fake though and it's been done dozens of times over the years.


I don't like the whole "We should just out all the group stuff." Fun Fact, in two of the three previous Gay Mafia games, the scumteam had most of the town's claims by Day 2 because town just kept blurting them out like dummies.

[kuribo]

In fact, I actively refuse to believe that a player in a game of Mafia somehow "forgets" that Mafia has a scum PT. It's literally a core part of the game.

If you wanna argue, oh, hey, I didn't know that Reck and Tripod usually give the scum daytalk, fine, I'll allow that because everyone might not be as familiar with the mods

But if you're telling me that a guy who's been on this site almost a year at this point, has been in multiple games, and has been scum before, should theoretically have read the rules, AND who has three other players backing him up in Team Mafia, suddenly says OH GEE I WONDER IF SCUM HAS A PT

I'd buy Scentsy from my ex that faked all the pregnancies before I buy that one

[davesaz]

EP is partly right on hoods, maybe even mostly right.
Gammagooey is right that basing reads mostly on hoods is bad, and reading people on their posting is good.
Not using hoods at all is flat wrong though. I don't consider that to be major at this point because it isn't yet telling us to ignore something important.
I don't consider wrong to be scummy per se. It depends on what you do with the wrong.

[Gammagooey]

dave do you have any spicy reads for me?

from what I can tell your reads are: GIF scum and Flavor Leaf scum for neighborhood related stuff like GIF's commuting thoughts and FL outing his neighborhood (if you have opinions on their non-neighborhood related stuff too I'd like to hear that), A50 town at least partly based off of his playstyle, a weak anka town read based on tone...and I don't really see anything else?

[Almost50]

Also we have to consider that Leading Actors are still standing up despite Elements having been killed so the chance that the 2 people remaining in that hood are town or both scum are higher.

Or they don't want to risk confscumming one of them

Heh sure. WIFOM though.

It's a but WIFOMY, yes.. but think about it: Elements gets modkilled on D1 and on N1 FL dies. Knowing that they were in the same hood and knowing their third is EP, who would you be moist suspicious of? Who would you want to claim both abilities? (The hood ability and the last standing player's)

Also, it could very well be that the latter isn't as important to Scum as the one from the Composers hood, so -at least- be a bit conservative handing out confident TRs based on that alone.

[Almost50]

Do you have other reasons to make you lean Town on EP/FL?

[Almost50]

Oh god NKA
someone shoot me.

You know I would have if I rolled Scum, SK or Vig.

[Almost50]

NKA ranks right down there with tea leaves

Did you mean FLAVOR leaves?

[Almost50]

or who they're really scared of.

Now THAT was my point. Farkran is

good

apparently, but does not have that resume someone like FL or kuribo gave, nor does his team has that reputation of being dangerous town players either. I mean, don't get me wrong.. it's like Leo DiCap before he made Titanic. Lots of promise but not yet actually proven. Now WHO would be afraid of him? So I guess there has to be some other motive for that specific kill.

[Almost50]

This concerns me

Tell me what doesn't and I'll post accordingly. I aim to please

precisely DV and company

[kuribo]

or who they're really scared of.

Now THAT was my point. Farkran is

good

apparently, but does not have that resume someone like FL or kuribo gave, nor does his team has that reputation of being dangerous town players either. I mean, don't get me wrong.. it's like Leo DiCap before he made Titanic. Lots of promise but not yet actually proven. Now WHO would be afraid of him? So I guess there has to be some other motive for that specific kill.

i spent all of day one half-asleep and high on cough syrup while seriously considering asking my team to replace me

i'd have been really really surprised if I'd been NK'd


and usually that would be a pleasant surprise but like, i'd have been furious if I'd spent all night phase reading the game only to die N1

[Almost50]

My townlist btw is pretty much as follows.

Pretty confident:

Davesaz
chennisden
Volpe14
Vex Vience
MariaR
kuribo

Not as confident:

Flavor Leaf
Gammagooey
Ankamius
GuyInFreezer
Volxen

(nomnomnom) - this one requires more thought before I can commit to a townread but it could end up getting there.

And then there's everyone else. None of whom I feel especially passionate about.

I want to scumread Almost50 but there's an element of oddness to his posting that gives me second thoughts. I want to scumready Espresso, but that just feels... insubstantial...

Not to be an arse, but this is literally the whole players list (still alive) minus you and DEB. Are you saying you have no SRs at all? Don't you think you

must

be doing something wrong? Should I be concerned??

[Almost50]

@a50 ill explain my reads in a bit if you want. my notes were written primarily for me to be able to make sense of the game and explain my thought process, with everyone else being able to discern something closely behind.

Still waiting for this, btw. I need to know

if you're the Cult Leader

where you're coming from

[Almost50]

In a lot of ways I do feel like A50 is an active linesman.

Great! Now take my word for it: You are on the OFFside.

[Almost50]

^This means you need to reposition yourself soon, if you are Town.

[Almost50]

what incentive does scum have to shoot the all-town hoods, knowing it’ll give them their last-man standing? wouldn’t scum want to shoot into their own hoods for it?

BINGO! Now THAT is what I'm saying about the Farkran kill. (Yes, I am nitpicking to highlight my line of thought is in there buried at the back of your minds, so I need to bring it forward for all to see it's there)

[Almost50]

i dont think scum forgets they have a factional chat.

When was the last game you played where Scum did NOT have a factional chat?? Do you think a designer would go and make a game where Scum only know their partners but can't talk to them AT ALL???

I think this whole proposition is Scum-driven because, EVEN if Scum know of -say- a list of 6 townies divided into 2 all-town hoods, they still don't know which distribution, so they still could be shooting twice in the same hood giving the last standing townie in it their standing utility.

Like, the ONLY reason I see for Scum to be shooting in an all-town hood is precisely to out the hood's utilities, and letting Scum know the distribution keeps them from shooting in that same hood tonight.

On the other hand, if I'm right about there being a Scum player in the Composers then we probably need them to out still, because that doesn't give Scum any additional info.

Now WHO is to say whether the two living composers are both Town or not? I guess THEY should be the judges on that, and they take full responsibility for it post-game (credit or disgrace).

[Almost50]

Btw my scumdar is pinging and it is pointing to volxen

Are yuou reading MY team's PT???

[Almost50]

Scum just doesn't know the distribution.

Exactly. Now let's keep it this way, I say.