TM2020 | Untrod Tripod Destroys Anime! | Endgame

[Alisae]

either way have a nice night ima go to bed as well

[mastina]

Fucking hell I can't keep my promises worth a fuck. My word is worse than worthless.
I may as well start out by saying Xtoxm did give further thoughts; jjh is near-locktown for him and he supports my/jjh's push on Kerset. He specifically points to 1440 from Mena being town, and actually posted a readslist:
{menalque, jjh, ali}
{chemist, shadoweh, hito, klick}--this one came with the caveat that he's never seen Chemist's scumgame but all of his townreads said that this is out of his scumrange so he's going with it.
{ofhrz, jingle}
{kerset, bitmap, reundo}

He did acknowledge that, yes--he's aware the reads are fairly conformy, and that there's a high chance of scum

somewhere

in the townreads, but has the mindset of "For D1, this is good enough".

I'll be posting my own thoughts on players + reading what I haven't + commenting on what I didn't, momentarily because I am a fucking shitty assed bitch who can't fucking keep her word and stay the fuck away from this game for so much as a day even when I have a free post to do so. I could've not posted today, I could've posted just Xtoxm's reads and not give my own but I am highly negligent to everything I am supposed to do because I'm a piece of shit, so yayyyyy this game gets the love and attention it needs!

[mastina]

I think if I were to make a readslist right now it would look ridiculous because I currently have a reasonably firm TR on everyone in the game who is not those 3 people

It is basically where I am at, yes, because.
Well.
Menalque is a very strong townread because his content oozes, radiates, a pure town vibe--I know his scumplay is good, but I really don't think that this is it and I have faith, trust, that his alignment will be more clear with time anyway.

jjh I know is a read I have tried to deliberately avoid getting but it should be painfully ridiculously obvious that it is a huge townread--jjh's thoughts lining up with my own, and his reasonable nature, his logic, just the resonance and sheer "that's damn good"ness of them, are things that make him very very strongly town. Now, he said it best; if this falls off later, then it would be a red flag to instantly reevaluate his slot. But failing that, if the type of things he is doing today, continue throughout the game...then I am still pretty confident that this is his towngame.

Those two are probably the locktown of locktowns--the reads which I go, "You know, it would take a bout of paranoia of them being hypercompetent scum players to make me so much as for a second consider them scum".

The tier below that is, "These players have about one thing which COULD make them scum...but which are very strongly resonating as not scum".
This tier of strong townread includes Jingle, Chemist, and hitogoroshi (hito might actually deserve to be the above since I don't even remember the thing which could make him scum).

And then comes the tier of "solidly town, but not locktown", which includes ofhrz (who might be in the tier above), Shadoweh, Alisae, and Klick. All of them are still very strongly looking town but have more respectable reasons to doubt them which keep them from being in the strong town pile. Because all of them just feel town that strongly.

When I originally intended to respond to jjh I feel like I was going to be far far far more explainy about all of these reads but right now I'm not feeling like spending that time on it, apologies. But suffice to say. That is townreads on nine players.
The obvious thought is, "Yeah I am probably wrong on one of these townreads and it could be almost any of them".

But while the three names of {Bitmap, Kerset, Reundo} are in the POE scum pile.
Even without the POE.
They're all doing scummy-as-fuck things that feel incredibly highly scum-indicative. All three slots are basically purely scumposting at every step of the way. It just really really strongly feels like those three contain all, or at the very least, most, of the scum. Like, even if one of my townreads IS scum. And thus only a maximum of two within would be scum. I feel very good about there being those two scum in there?

They work individually as scum. One of them as scum, two of them as scum.
They work as a team as scum. Any two-man combo in there is a viable scumteam; they are viable as a three-man scumteam.
Literally everything points to that being the solve.

POE.
Play.
Interactions.

I realize it's not that easy. It's never that easy. It's never so simple as to just be the obvious three as the obvious scumteam. It's always harder than that, there's always deepscum in places we don't look initially.

But for D1.

This is just.
Like.
A really damn good D1 solve?
I want all three names on there dead before anyone else dies to a lynch, because I feel like there's a chance to catch all three scum.
And even if it's only 2/3 of the scum, the last scum will be much easier to locate with two scum dead and a main mislynch removed.
The game does become significantly harder if only 1/3 is scum and not gonna lie we've probably just lost if SOMEHOW in some ungodly realm they all are by some bizzarro world town.
But if so much as 2/3 of them are scum, and I feel like that is just something incredibly likely. With two, or three, of them being scum.
Lynching in them is just...the best thing we can do in every way shape and form?

[mastina]

mastina jingle how are y'all picking up on what jj is doing when even jj doesn't know what jj is doing.

Mostly, experience with him, playstyle synergy, and in part specifically because jjh doesn't know what jjh was doing. (If he did know what he was doing precisely, it wouldn't be as obviously town.)

[mastina]

okay, after conferring my team is sure enough that mastina is town that they want to lynch mastina voters. Although reundo's wagon is 100% town we're suspicious reundo is just posting newbie. (actually Idk what kind of mafia experience he has, ive just seen him play survivor) more inconclusive then leaning either direction. I'm refraining from posting any comments about clubbing seals tbh because I personally disagree with them. >.> Kerset is fine as a wagon if we must

I mean. You agree the wagon on me is suspicious as fuck, yes? (Not a wrong conclusion, by the way!) Welllll...

Votecount 1.19
mastina (4): Bitmap, Kerset, Chemist1422, Reundo Kerset (3): jjh927, Jingle, mastina Reundo (1): Menalque

...Looking at the names on the wagon.
Literally the towniest name there is Chemist and the entire rest of the wagoners sucks ass and even Chemist is pretty fully aware that his vote wasn't the best.

I think there's a good chance that scum is hard defending me because they know I'll flip green and am an easy lynch which gives them a vehicle to push jj and mastina to the wall and control game state.

But I really don't care anymore so... yeah.

At the risk of doing the very thing Bitmap accused me of doing in his narrative which in spite of his narrative to the contrary I wasn't actually doing.
At the risk of

actually

doing the thing I was accused of doing.
As in, this is my first post where I am going to just outright put this forward.
This sounds a lot like a RadiantCowbells post.
Especially since it seems to be a vastly different stance than Bitmap's previously-established stances.
Bitmap has stated he holds scumreads on me and jjh, of at least one of us being scum; here in this post, Bitmap is stating that scum are in his defenders who are going to push his mislynch as an avenue to push jjh/me with the obvious implication that jjh/me are town.
Which, again.
Is either Bitmap holding a contradictory stance.
Or Bitmap not announcing that this post was an RC post.
Either way it's a fairly strong scum-indicator in my opinion.

[mastina]

I didn't actually read much of ali V pine after I died but I recall hearing some people did a similarly bad lynch there

Yeah and if Alisae/Jingle are scum, they would be scum in large part specifically for this--of recognizing that my play here is my towngame, of recognizing that just like in that game there was really no fucking reason behind the suspicion on my slot, of me being wagoned for literally nothing, and choosing to in spite of that similarity, press me as a scumread anyway.

Both are currently townreads in part because tracking their thought processes (I think I read up to some page number in either the high-50s or low-60s so that's about where I am with this recollection), as far as I can tell, they haven't opted for this, more or less. They

have

done this recognition at least partially, even if not fully.

To put it another way and more simply; there was a time where I was entertaining that their pushes on me were them being scum and pushing me in spite of having every reason to know better than that, a la Pink Ball from AliVPine during the time PB pushed me--but both of them have played in a way where if they

were

actually scum, well...like Pink Ball, they realized that was a way that would put them on a fastrack to me catching their ass so they stopped doing it.

So basically the options are, either they are town who didn't do the opportunistic thing and have a real read progression on me...
...Or they are scum who were setting up to do the opportunistic thing on me, but faked a read progression on me when they realized it was an easy way for them to get caught.

I find the former at this time more likely than the latter overall.

[mastina]

imultiple people keep saying this is in her scum range and then mysteriously not following through.

(There's good reason for this. It's called "they are saying things they think are true but can't confirm as true because they actually aren't", more or less. )

mastina is like,
my team thinks she is definitely not town, I don't think she's town.

Her play is just super different then how she's normally like. You can call this a gut feeling ig.
Like maybe this is just how she normally is and I'm just stupid but I really don't think so.
The mastina I remember in AvP was desperate to survive and I recognized that, but had to push it against my own will because Katsuki is a shit player.
She just doesn't feel the same. I feel like I should have been consider the thought of "Yep yep, thats town!mastina" by now and I genuinely haven't had a single moment where I thought "yep, yep, thats town!mastina"

If this were still your stance, I would have

very

strong words to give you--words that would very potentially get me eating a warning for speaking them but which consequences be damned you bet your ass I would give you them. The only reason I am not giving said commentary is I happen to know that this stance of yours

has

changed, so.

You really think scum!Kerset would hard defend a scum slot and not just bus them for ez credit?

Honestly.
It wouldn't surprise me.

[mastina]

Yeah I think scum are going to be active in a gamestate they do not like.

Sorry to say mate but that is rats-ass backwards.

If the state of the game is one scum don't like, and posting only makes the state of the game go further in the direction scum don't want...what will the scum do? Continue to do the thing which pushes the game further and further in the direction the scum don't want the game to go...or do the thing which gives them a chance at getting a gamestate that

is

favorable to them?

If posting does nothing but make the gamestate worse for scum, then scum are inclined to not post in the sadly-very-often-effective strategy of lurking until the suspicion on them dies down, the town caves in to paranoia, and eats themselves alive.

It's only in a gamestate where the town is eating itself alive that scum want to be more active. Their higher activity in "town is eating itself alive" isn't meant to steer the game into a more favorable gamestate, per se, so much as it is, a luxury that they can afford which is a good way to snowball their lead by making their contributions look even better.

Basically--town is on the right track? Lurk until they aren't.
Town isn't on the right track? Post as much as is beneficial to you.

[mastina]

VOTE: Kerset

(For the record I'll be voting whichever of the three has the most votes--I think right now that's Reundo but I'll need to actually read the game to be sure of it past the point I've seen.)

[mastina]

I feel so demotivated to play this game. No one beside me put thoughts in to this. Everyone just make reads based on personal relations and sheep whoever they like. Relation between mastina and jjh is so obviously sinister. Still after 58 pages people are only looking at their personal targets and take no efforts to solve the background. I don't except players to solve this game by now or look away from me. I am rather sure penguin could post all players abilities right here and people would just scroll their eyes through it without reading. Then they would nod get back to their business, without any concern what those abilities were. This is the kind of commitment that people outside of scum agenda have.

Also does anyone need why this is a blatant scumpost described to them or does everyone pretty much know and recognize why it is one? Because I don't feel like spending the time to explain what is prettty damn painfully obviously transparent as day, if everyone gets it, but if SOMEHOW someone out there SOMEHOW doesn't get it I'd be happy to enlighten them.

[mastina]

RCE says bit discrediting is his scum move, FWIW.

I find it funny he says that since I've never played with him when I was scum. Actually the only game we've played together was magical girls afaik.

Can we take a moment to appreciate how in response to a statement of "Bitmap's discrediting is a scum move".
Bitmap counters by discrediting the person making that statement?

[mastina]

@ofrhz, klick, reundo, kerset, mastina I wanna talk to all of u when you’re around

Mate I am a failure at literally everything.

It is 4 am and I have

still

neglected most of my duties.
Not all of them; I've attended to a few things as I was able to.
But most of them I've not done.

Good luck finding a time when I am online and free.
(Especially since I naturally tend to deliberately avoid real-time interactions barring specific exceptions. Like, yes, I know I won a scummie for an 8-hour session of nothing but, but I usually hate doing them and the only reason I didn't avoid it then was basically just purely on a whim by happenstance. There was a significant chance that jam session wouldn't have happened with me in it, in 95% of the times that game was run; we just had the lucky 5% where for whatever reason in spite of me normally avoiding them, I decided by luck to not avoid it.)

she likes the ate
I think Kerset is blatantly lieing

I mean that should be pretty readily apparent yes.

Reundo has straight up scumclaimed

Won't find me disagreeing!

[mastina]

You can't talk to anyone in Europe, and you can't watch European soccer in real time without waking up at 8am on a Saturday. Life is rough.

Fun fact I actually end most of my nights listening to a German streamer before I go to bed and yet I live in Pacific time.

This might have something to do with him starting at a reasonably-early time usually (usually somewhere loosely around midnight? Sometimes much earlier, but not much later), half the time not streaming too late, and even when he does stream too late, half of the time me having no need to go to bed.

(I still don't often get to stay up through all of his stream and I often multitask and I can sometimes turn his volume down to near-zero if I need to listen to someone else more, but you get the idea.) Heck, he's who I'm listening to right now. (I'm lurking tho because he's playing a game that while it's REALLY good listening material, isn't good talking material for me personally tho.)

What I mean by this is, I very very easily can talk to people from those timezones easily, it's just that often they don't.
(Also I totally wake up at like 10 am to catch live broadcasts of the LEC, so.)

[mastina]

VOTE: reundo

Yeah pretty sure Reundo's the largest wagon of the three, so.
VOTE: Reundo.
May potentially be L-1, I've not checked the votes yet but I don't really think it that important to.

[mastina]

Btw to be brief:
I agree with Ali's defense of ofhrz more or less and could defend her in greater detail probably if need be.
I do not think hito's push there is in any way scum-motivated and quite the contrary I think it is a town thought that happens to just be off-base though I admit I'm a bit biased there.

[PenguinPower]

Votecount 1.24
Reundo (6): Menalque, Alisae, jjh927, Jingle, ofrhz, mastina hitogoroshi (2): Shadoweh, Bitmap mastina (2): Kerset, Reundo jjh927 (1): Klick ofrhz (1): hitogoroshi Not Voting (1): Chemist1422 With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline : (expired on 2020-01-16 20:30:00) Ann Notes : mastina v/la until 1/13

[Kerset]

Also @jjh what’s the long and short on why you TR mastina and scumread kerset and bitmap?

Do you have no support from your team? Like we are in TM and you act like null info guy. Do you actually don't know or are you trying to find place for yourself to fit.

[Kerset]

{Mena Hito Shadoweh mastina jjh Klick}
{Chemiboi, Jingle}
{ofhrz}
{Reundo}
{Kerset, Bitmap}

Wait I thought you were SRing mastina? Also why is klick up at top and chemboi isn’t?

I realized jjh is town and did a 180
Klick is townposting and chemboi is still like towny but not as strong to me anymore but its still towny

How is jjh and mastina connected? People implying that same reads means same alignment give me headache.

[Kerset]

Are you surprised by pops' not townreading you here?

Does she? I don't take alisae account as reliable. She didn't use pops read up until the point, where turning 180 was convenient for her.

[PenguinPower]

Prodding Reundo. This is his first prod.

[Kerset]

Did NSG read 1697 which I just posted

Because I think Kerset's votes with context absolutely scream scum

Your bad solving screams scum. You don't even know, why is it AI. You would grab knife's blade, if we would tell you that it is a solution.

[Kerset]

NSG wanted to know everyone's opinions on her reads.

First of all. There was multiple use of "we want to lynch scum". It is kind of red flag for me, because liars are the ones, who use those assurances.
For content itself. I don't see how could someone townlock ofrhz, there seems to be not enough hard stances made by her pre 1425 for a lock. Chemist is quite controversial scrumread. He seems to be meta-based townreaded, so too bad that nsg didn't elaborate where did this come from. I could see nsg think the way nsg thinks about jingle.

[Kerset]

Votecount 1.19
mastina (4): Bitmap, Kerset, Chemist1422, Reundo Kerset (3): jjh927, Jingle, mastina Reundo (1): Menalque

...Looking at the names on the wagon.
Literally the towniest name there is Chemist and the entire rest of the wagoners sucks ass and even Chemist is pretty fully aware that his vote wasn't the best.

Do you know what does it prove? That your reads are fully based on votes, not the opposite. Bitmap is the only one, who was scumreaded by you BEFORE you were voted by him. Nice coincidence, isn't it?

[Kerset]

jjh I know is a read I have tried to deliberately avoid getting but it should be painfully ridiculously obvious that it is a huge townread--jjh's thoughts lining up with my own, and his reasonable nature, his logic, just the resonance and sheer "that's damn good"ness of them, are things that make him very very strongly town. Now, he said it best; if this falls off later, then it would be a red flag to instantly reevaluate his slot. But failing that, if the type of things he is doing today, continue throughout the game...then I am still pretty confident that this is his towngame.

Mastina is so obviously pocketing jjh. Even newbie would notice this by now. Up from the beginning of this game she was building this up and it is still going on.

[ofrhz]

Is mastina scum or is jjh scum? Or are they both scum?