White Flag - TM2020

[BBmolla]

well this one is awful so I assume the rest are

I didn't look tbh

Why is it awful? Should I be hard town reading you now? I find your aggression to be a little over the top, it doesn't read as genuine to me.

Dong is scummy sure but what are your other reads?

I think I'm pretty obviously town tbh

which aggression is over the top/ungenuine?

other reads will form as ya'll post Dong is scum and I'm following that, I already said most people are town

The Auro wagon is probably a bust just from the timing and makeup of it all but I'm still waiting for more Auro posts to decide

[Espeonage]

On that note Kitty. I am sorry. I was thinking about how best to go about fixing it yesterday. I was just going to forward an apology to the person as it has been too long for the video to make sense. I dropped the ball on that so I'm sorry abut that. I get how that can colour me for the game.

I have no evidence against you if it makes you feel better. If I had to take a guess on it, it would be that I agree with you the most which feels really damn weird in this oddball game. Which is why you are one of the only people who I feel is playing the game at the moment.

[Espeonage]

Off topic, my radio silence is mostly embarrassment at not sorting it out.

[BBmolla]

got anything for me Espy?

[Espeonage]

What I was discussing with Cheeky may help you sort out your issues with forming your own read on Auro.

I got next to nothing on dong in my head though atm if you want to flesh that out for me.

[BBmolla]

I've kind of already said, I hate their first two posts and that post on the last page

[Auro]

If you do something 300 times as scum and 1 time as town, should we not lynch you the 302 time you do something because one time out of the previous 301 times you did that you were town?

The argument that "I know that's scummy, but I do it as town too!" Doesn't mean you shouldn't get lynched here, it means that the players in the other games where you played scummy should have lynched you to change your behavior.

Are you guys discussing my posts in the scum PT or something? I'm constantly saying "ITS NOT SCUMMY, ITS TOWNY AND I DO IT AS TOWN" and all you guys keep changing it to "ik scummy lulz but I willingly did it in town games and I protect my meta and my buddies here townread me to protect meta hehehehe"

[Espeonage]

Can you pinpoint why?

[Espeonage]

The issue Auro is that it isn't townie.

[Auro]

The issue Auro is that it isn't townie.

Empty words if you can't explain why it isn't.
What I do is game advancing and helps me evaluate people. By definition, it's pro-town. A sole focus on defense while never pushing anyone can be scummy, yes, but I've also pushed people.

[T-Bone]

Vote Count

northsidegal - 3

(Cephrir, Hopkirk, Kittymo)

Auro - 2

(Espeonage, Formerfish)

Dongempire - 2

(gobbledygook, BBMolla)

wguerts - 1

(northsidegal)

BBMolla - 1

(CheekyTeeky)

gobbledygook - 1

(Dunnstral)

Espeonage - 1

(Dannflor)

Not Voting - 2

(Auro, Dongempire)

Activity Check - All Good!

Deadline: (expired on 2020-01-17 22:59:30)

[Auro]

I am uncharacteristically angry at this entire playerlist and setup which isn't helping.

My main quips with the setup were even confirmed like a page ago so whatever.

I feel like you're pissed your Auro push hasn't worked out as well as you thought it would?

[Auro]

Okay let's try something different. Probabilistically speaking, one of Dann, Dunn, and I must be town, right? And if none of them think my style is anti-town, there you go: a town perspective who thinks I'm not anti-town. So perhaps you could be wrong?

[Auro]

Somewhat independently of the associative read, it's ...funny to me that Dann keeps narrating that he just loves Auro and wants to figure out who's pushing Auro disingenuously without asking that many specific questions surrounding suspicion of Auro. Like I guess that comes off as higher % LAMIST concern w/r/t Dann than a concern for buddies.

Hm just putting it out, creating false associations in case I'm lynched is something I'd do as scum, though.

[CheekyTeeky]

which aggression is over the top/ungenuine?

I'd rather do that than get to LYLO and have NSG not fucking posted all game because "sorry guys other games required attention."

As well as overly aggressive (why you mad bro) why can't we see if she posts tomorrow? It's not like we have to lynch her today for how she could possibly play in the future, that seems unfair right?

Like you could continue to be lurky but it wouldn't make sense for us to lynch you based on what you could do.

[KittyMo]

Yes, and Dunn's reasoning is that for *her* it's more town indicative than scum indicative - if she were scum she'd drum up some opposition to the wagon, etc, wouldn't sheep and lurk away.

Would you want to lynch her, if not me?

Do you have any meta experience with her? Where exactly were you getting that as scum would she "drum up opposition" to the wagon? Prior to finding out she was going to be replaced, but after I corrected you on the context of the wagon, to what extent did that move the needle on your read there or willingness to lynch her?

Last bit might be harder to answer now that Cheeky's been here a bit which is unfortunate. But I remain bothered by the "drum up opposition" part in that I have no clue what the basis of that was.

[Auro]

I think Cheeky's town. A lot of points I had in mind or tried to make, she put in better words.

[KittyMo]

Oh wait Joan=molla not Cheeky.

Idk if you were trying to answer me yet but the quote above is about your read on Joan.

[CheekyTeeky]

Last bit might be harder to answer now that Cheeky's been here a bit which is unfortunate.

I thought 496 and 553 were talking about Joan of Arc? I replaced wgeurts.

Ninja'd

[Formerfish]

I wasn't so certain that I wasn't willing to listen to anything they had to say.

Thats fair, I also would have accepted "I wanted to see if they would give true or fake associations"

Lady 9

You minx! You had a shot to sway me in that pt if you talked more, hell I probably would have eaten it hook, line and sinker because I was more confused by the lack of knowing who was who than I thought I would be.

OK, but Joan does it as both alignments

Isn't this the same argument that Auro is trying to use about why no one should scum read him for his "NAI" actions?

Why does everybody have me as null? Are people afraid to try to read me or do they not bother to read what I'm saying?

You aren't null because I have no read, youre null because the read I have on you keeps going back and forth like a metronome and I cant figure out where to stop it yet.

[Formerfish]

I was going to wall again, but Im high and feel a little wordy and like things might not flow if i bunched everything together. Enjoy this next few hours postings.

despite what I've said I don't actually want to lynch nsg day 1, I was just hoping wagoning her would be effective in getting her to play and ehhhhhh

I've been thinking about this a little bit. If NSGs team is pulling her to other games where they need help do you think that they would do that with her as scum or as town? If she is scum then wouldn't her team make shes in here making noise so she doesnt take this heat? If she is town then they probably assume that they can borrow her for the time being with the idea that she can come in here and town it up when she needs to.

This is all kinda working under the idea that we are incapable of finding scum on our own and that we need her to come save us.

I think that we have a good deal of info going into this first lynch and that we will have a better understanding of the game state when we see a few flips.

[Formerfish]

It's more a question of trust.

I have no trust in the other players in this game, so I feel a bit man against the world bc I don't feel comfortable bouncing ideas off anyone here so I'm trying to brute force. Look I'm happy to be proven wrong but at the moment.

This sounds a lot like how I feel when I play most times. I think thats why I adopted the play style that I have. Like if you looked at newbie 1942 I was right the entire time but had to fight tooth and nail to get there and almost didnt. I had to kill myself to get scum to concede overnight.

I feel like at some point in games where you feel like this, and when i do, i find someone who i connect with and I agree to work with them until they prove to be a detriment to work with. At some point you just have to take a leap of faith on someone and pray you picked smartly.

[Formerfish]

Like it was reinforced early by Auro's complete stubbornness to see how he is not helping at all while other people defended it as a viable course of action. It doesn't even matter if Auro is town or scum, what matters is that it is frankly unacceptable to get repeated requests from multiple people to rethink what they are doing.

The fact that it is still not resolve drained any meagre optimism I might have had about the game.

To answer your question, wasted? no. Is this game feeling more and more like smashing my head against a wall that should have come down ages ago? god yes.

Auro isnt your in thread buddy, find another one you can work with and see if you can find some success that way. If they have good reads, stick with them, if their reads suck hang em later.

[Formerfish]

Idk I feel like no one else is frustrated and I don't get it

I am, but apparently thats just how people view me normally so it might not be showing as well as id think it would.

[Auro]

If she is scum then wouldn't her team make shes in here making noise so she doesnt take this heat? If she is town then they probably assume that they can borrow her for the time being with the idea that she can come in here and town it up when she needs to.

I've addressed this.
If she's scum she'd be held accountable for her pushes, she'd take heat for driving a mislynch.
If she's town she's a prime target for a N1 kill, meaning she'd want to have some impact on the game - making her refusal to play D1 strange.