Team Mafia 2020: Normal Game (Endgame)

[RCEnigma]

vote me then?

idg why you're wasting time talking about it unless you want to make another case i can laugh at

What have you done that makes you not scum?

[Iconeum]

RCE, who's scum with RC?

[Iconeum]

@RCE, townreads please?

[RadiantCowbells]

oh boy

investment is a massive one, i have never posted even close to this rate as scum and all 4 members of cancel food are(were) aware of that fact
the fact that I chose to post as much as I did when I have been extremely reluctant to play scumgames for the past year and I had every excuse to tone it down
the general read progression is something that i cannot fake as scum and it's been the one thing i've constantly cited as something i can't fake as scum with 0 counterexamples.
the speed that my brain works when i'm trying to sort as town that TW called out as prewritten, that's how i hunt scum and there are again, 0 examples of me functioning that rapidly as scum

compare the coherence of me vs TW to me vs chesskid. chesskid i mostly just stuck to the same bullet points and just said them alot (which chesskid was doing as well at the time)
i was constantly bringing new stuff up, my reads on everyone else evolved in parallel, i was considering other voting options and the way that the gamestate around me affected my vote
did i miss the fact that TW was town? yes. and i was never going to see it because when i get in that kind of adrenalined up mode it really stops being possible for me to power down.
whereas TW mostly stopped giving reads on other people and just focused on me and seemed to just be taking whichever opinion on everyone else made the most allies
which, yeah, i get now that he was just super super tilted and wanted to take me out of the game moreso than scumread me but like

and i truly think that tw's push on me was disingenuous and obviously so and that even at my best i am going to struggle to see it when someone like TW pushes on me in a manner like that
also, like, there's still absolutely zero motivation to claim investigative on D1 and there's still a 0% chance that scum brings me to late game as a result of it.
i think i pointed out in a recent scumgame when someone pushed on me in a really stupid way early that they only helped scum!me because it's pretty difficult for me to justify mislynches as town except in situations where i have reason to be very out of sorts with the game. this is the kind of error and pretty much the only not-super-rare error that i systematically make as town.

i can't function when i don't feel like i have a stable foundation in the game because fear of being mislynched starts to outweigh everything and i can't relax and i can't sort if i can't relax.
that's why when i get in 1v1s like duckling i just all in and end them.

[RadiantCowbells]

a better argument than i literally cannot be scum here is that i was never given the chance to show that i was town.
but there's really a lot of reasons to townread me and not really reasons to scumread me outside of username.

[RadiantCowbells]

i don't think any player on ms would figure out to townread someone who told them they claimed investigative so that they had an excuse to be alive longer.

[RadiantCowbells]

i don't struggle in real time by general MS standards as scum. in fact quite the opposite i'm probably the best real time poster as scum. but i'm not this good as scum whereas town me who thinks they saw something with regards to TW voting Ari twice, never commenting on him, then unvoting and Ari putting TW as a townread with no commentary is absolutely going to jump it. And, uh, TW claims that I was supposed to anticipate his voting me to "prewrite it" when he had only expressed a townread on me to that point to discredit that argument, which really doesn't make sense and to me obviously reads like he knows that I'm town and is trying to preemptively shut down vectors for me to be tr

[implosion]

Spoiler: betwixt beyond beget besmirch

Vote Count 2.2

Aristophanes

(3): Iconeum, MathBlade, Flopz

RadiantCowbells

(2): skitter30, RadiantCowbells

Plum

(1): Aristophanes

Not voting (6): RCEnigma, tris, Plum, Bellaphant, Xtoxm, teacher

With 12 alive, it takes 7 votes to end the day.
Deadline is set to two weeks from day start, in (expired on 2020-01-29 20:00:00).

[Iconeum]

can everyone at least place a vote?

[RadiantCowbells]

like me just compulsively posting thoughts that don't really go anywhere at the time doesn't happen as scum. as scum i know what i want done. i don't have the same interest in just rereading and thinking about things

[RadiantCowbells]

man.

i really don't know why i was townreading skitter ever.

i feel like that was not a thing that i should have been doing.

i feel like her response to my play here has been disgustingly scummy.

[Iconeum]

for a second I thought you were gonna say that everyone currently voting you is scum

[RadiantCowbells]

ari's posts on this page are all awful

Obv*

And so what he ended the day early? He also like, delayed that hammer to let the thread continue for a while which I don't think had any protown use to it.

I think you're reading way more into his motivations, Bella.
And I think you scumreading me is tainting your view on him.

also this is p bad ^

i kinda prefer to start with plum over ari tbh

the tris thing is more from plum than ari to clarify

i'm not really into full-team-solving at this stage, there isn't any confirmed datapoints and then we get a repeat of yesterday

Obv*

And so what he ended the day early? He also like, delayed that hammer to let the thread continue for a while which I don't think had any protown use to it.

I think you're reading way more into his motivations, Bella.
And I think you scumreading me is tainting your view on him.

also this is p bad ^

this was the worst part of ari's entrance today imo ^

i don't think we should be sorting rc by proxy anymore
if he's scummy we should just vote him

lynching ari to figure out rc's wagonomics feels very ~convoluted~ and we tried to do that yesterday even and now people aren't really taking into account the outcome of the experiement, so i'm a little dubious that using ari as a second proxy will be effective

plum's tw vote was scary and while there's (a few) things that i like about ari i can remember just ... like two (?) posts from plum that i liked and on balance i feel worse about her than ari

i think ari is independantly scummy but using him to sort rc is silly

i feel worse about plum so would rather there
if there isn't as much support for that i can switch to ari but i'd rather pressure plum rn

because i think her vote on tw was awful and i don't think she's done anything townie really at all and i think she's the best bet for scum on the wagon barring rc

also i'm not sure ari defends tw that strongly if he could just be like 'i sr tw vote: tw' upon catching up if he's scum

we can pressure ari too
but like i can think of reasons to tr ari
but i don't really have reasons to tr plum

also, again, i'm very wary of the whole team-reading/solve thing with no scum flips at this point

more that i was commiting to that then than anything else
i also think i may be reading too much into this particular interaction and that i have a tendency to get paranoid about this sort of thing

VOTE: plum

i've been sleeping poorly so i'm going to bounce and try to sleep but i'll be around tom at some point

pedit is that at me?

i sr plum more and would rather see her react to some pressure than push ari rn

i didn't sr ari for most of the mess yesterday, most of what i disliked from him came *after* he popped back in on sunday.
so i objected to that push because i didn't think he was scum at the time
i p much gave up protesting that after like round 500 of the rc / ari thing because i couldn't do it anymore, it was too draining

and i object to the characterization of my play as 'riling up rc' when i deliberately played to do my best to not do that
idk what you mean by 'sidestepping plum + tris + skitter' day1, i do believe i've made my opinions on both of them very clear

i don't object to ari i just want to pressure other people and i'm kinda confused why you're complaining to my wanting to start the day voting someone who was a non-entity for large parts of the day and who i don't think we've heard from enough.

like we have time
we can do ari today
rn i want to do other things

also me/ari/rc is ridiculous

We should 100% vote who RC did not want us to vote yesterday and the fact a majority of town scumreads Ari is a bonus.

Ari should eat rope. Then if Ari is scum RC. Then maaaybe Skitter or Plum.

I needs me some nukes

you realize rc almost got ari lynched yesterday, right?

like if rc is bussing ari then why does he hard back off there

it's a bit of a bizarre svs play

honestly i really need to go to sleep and i don't think i can process figuring it out if voting you is a good idea when you post things like that and i'm this tired

so i'm gonna bounce

pedit ari got up to l-1 and if i recall correctly there was at least one intent (mabye not explicit intent but iirc most people were ok with his lynch just then)
and then rc like hard-reversed and the thing dropped

and i think that between {ari/rc} ari flips usually before rc so he wouldn't tie himself that atrociously to a bizarre ari flip that could be revisited because he'd riled up so much fervor for it and then not carried it through

*bizarre ari push

like it's such a silly way to tie himself to someone who is probably going to flip before him that it seems just plain weird to not commit to the bus if rc was going to go that route
i'm not really sure i buy the svs {ari/rc} theory

Like I am pretty sure you’re trying to rile me up to lynch you so we don’t lynch Ari but maaan.

this doesn't even make sense ....
it's too convoluted to make sense ...

math, can you explain what exactly scum!rc was thinking yesterday when he nearly brought scum!ari to a lynch and then suddenly backed off,
and then why he'd today be trying to rile you up to lynch him over ari when we all know that rc is a better scum player who is acutely aware of bussing and is more likely to endgame in vaccuum ... ?

i kinda just hate like everything he's saying but scum!him doesn't make sense with scum!rc here imo @math

Does this still stand, skitter? You think RC is confscum now or?

i think so, ya
i don't think he's scum with ari tho
and i think voting ari to sort rc is ridiculous

but before we like ~do that~ i wanna sort other people because he's being kinda quiescent rn
he needs to be resolved by tomorrow's lynch at the latest tho

=

What prompted this sudden change of your game-long scumread on me?

positioning wrt tw, i think it's easier to pop in when u did and push him for a lynch than defend him

math i don't understand why you're pushing ari rn

i don't think ur thing with tw was tvt
and i don't think that you can be in lylo at this point

the defeatism / repeated references to wanting to be lynched is ... very uncharismatic and making me paranoid and i think are lowkey townie and i find them confusing
like i think you're like fl in that you care about your scumgame more than your towngame and you being this defeated as scum is just like ????? and hard to process

i don't think i'm making incorrect reads based on associatives with you tho? the only team-read i'm sold on rn is that you/ari are not svs so i'm kinda confused what you're even referring too

she called Ari scummy a whole bunch when he made some mediocre posts at the start of the day
then she started to go after Plum for reasons that she was relatively vague on
then when Math is repeatedly prompting her to go after Ari, her excuse is that he's not TvS with me and i'm confscum
then calls me lowkey townie in her next post for doing something that aligns exactly with a maneuver i previously made as scum

[Iconeum]

skitter + Ari scumteam pretty much clears Plum tho

[RadiantCowbells]

man, like, even when i was voting plum half of me wanted to say she couldn't make me ~feel~ the way she made me feel if she was scum.

[Iconeum]

Ari is the better lynch if it's between skitter/Ari tho

It will help town focus/move on a lot better

[RadiantCowbells]

iconeum do you agree with my assessment that skitter, like, really didn't seem like she was actually interested in voting me today

[RadiantCowbells]

i've felt the entire game that skitter was kinda like... handling me with kid gloves if that makes sense? and i thought she was just trying to be nice but i'm no longer feeling that way.

[Iconeum]

iconeum do you agree with my assessment that skitter, like, really didn't seem like she was actually interested in voting me today

she wasn't, but you basicly made her vote you. Like, you made it really easy for her to do that.

The fact she doesn't wanna push Ari is a lot more interesting point to talk about, I can't understand how she can be calling Ari scum so much, but in the same breath is defending him and definitely not voting there.

[Iconeum]

On top of that I feel like her scumread on me wasn't honest, and that she tried pretty hard to keep that scumread on me until the duckling went all quack about it and forced her to townread me IIRC

[Iconeum]

One thing I'm worried about with Ari lynch is that it's off wagon.

[RadiantCowbells]

skitter kept insisting we should be voting on wagon. TW who clearly had some janky ass reads thought his wagon was scummy.

i honestly think that having no vote is worse than being on a mislynch in a general case.

[RadiantCowbells]

skitter kept insisting we should be voting on wagon. TW who clearly had some janky ass reads thought his wagon was scummy.

i honestly think that having no vote is worse than being on a mislynch in a general case.

[Iconeum]

@implo, I'm VLA weekend. Back on Monday

still available for a couple hours from now

[RadiantCowbells]

iconeum do you agree with my assessment that skitter, like, really didn't seem like she was actually interested in voting me today

she wasn't, but you basicly made her vote you. Like, you made it really easy for her to do that.

The fact she doesn't wanna push Ari is a lot more interesting point to talk about, I can't understand how she can be calling Ari scum so much, but in the same breath is defending him and definitely not voting there.

On top of that I feel like her scumread on me wasn't honest, and that she tried pretty hard to keep that scumread on me until the duckling went all quack about it and forced her to townread me IIRC

yeah but that's my point. she called me confscum like a few pages ago to justify pulling Math off of Ari, now i have to literally scream at her to vote me to get her to begrudgingly do so
like she talks about her team telling her to vote me... but she's not doing it for reasons... also isn't Amrun like one of the people in the extended game most likely to correctly read me? eh.