Team Mafia 2020: Normal Game (Endgame)

Begins January 2nd, 2020
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Post Post #3800 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:53 am

Post by Aristophanes »

In post 3795, MathBlade wrote:
In post 3792, Aristophanes wrote:
In post 3787, MathBlade wrote:That means I am right on Ari more often that not.
And yet you are wrong...
And yet you spam
Yup, as I do as either alignment!

I can do that more if you like!

Because the odd post of mine is of this ilk atm but I can increase it in volume if you like!
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Post Post #3801 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:54 am

Post by Aristophanes »

Ooooo good pagetop!
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Post Post #3802 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:55 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

ok but here's the thing: if ari flips town then the people that i think are scum are going to win the game because the town will completely fall apart.
So the lazy outline is that access point needed x amount of scum to be approved to a mission by the rest of the town to win. RC came into the game assuming the town leader role over NSG by immediately excluding himself from being voted in. Setting himself up to be self resolvable. It earned a lot of towncred with all but like 1 person (insomnia). RC hard pushed the fact that Insomnias read was bad because he would resolve anyway and as you can guess it was a shouting match that he replaced out of.

Point is, RC setting his team up to carry out the rest of the game isn't outside of my expectation of his scum game. With that could be any number of factors like the Poe being outside of his teammates even if it's still on him. Or (the one I feel is likely) he has anti-associated to diffuse the pool of partners that make sense with him in the event he flips. I don't find any of that unreasonable.
ok but these are monumentally different scenarios. I never intended myself to be self resolvable. I was setting up for you to be submitted D2 and for me to take D3 when the person I pushed in on D2 got nightkilled (thus proving that I was pushing town and using it as an argument to clear me) then to use your terrible associatives with both my scumpartners to get you lynched.

You're talking about a game where I presented the illusion of something and comparing it to a game where I actually did something.
2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.
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Post Post #3803 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:56 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

like, you either didn't understand what the plan was or you're lying for points. i was always going to be in the access point pool. and you started making that comparison very early on in this game.
2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.
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Post Post #3804 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:57 am

Post by MathBlade »

In post 3799, RCEnigma wrote:
In post 3786, RadiantCowbells wrote:Same reason that I claimed investigative in the first place

I wanted to claim so that everyone could trust me and work with me without the shadow of my scum game hanging over the lobby safe in the knowledge that I was eventually going to self resolve as scum.

I don't buy your push on me at all. I don't buy your original scumread on me either. I think your team deliberately pulled that to set me off.
This was literally your access point approach. The one you waved off as not being relevant here. The one that holds even more similarities in play now that day 1 is over.

Math I'm speaking mostly to you here but for anyone that wants to read through Access Point to see what I'm talking about is welcome to and if you need the link I'll find it.

So the lazy outline is that access point needed x amount of scum to be approved to a mission by the rest of the town to win. RC came into the game assuming the town leader role over NSG by immediately excluding himself from being voted in. Setting himself up to be self resolvable. It earned a lot of towncred with all but like 1 person (insomnia). RC hard pushed the fact that Insomnias read was bad because he would resolve anyway and as you can guess it was a shouting match that he replaced out of.

Point is, RC setting his team up to carry out the rest of the game isn't outside of my expectation of his scum game. With that could be any number of factors like the Poe being outside of his teammates even if it's still on him. Or (the one I feel is likely) he has anti-associated to diffuse the pool of partners that make sense with him in the event he flips. I don't find any of that unreasonable.
Yes RC could be scum. I am familiar with a game where this was his scum meta.

There’s also some things he is doing that are town only.

The one thing I am certain of is that RC didn’t expect to last long. I find this true whatever alignment he is.

I have been scum with him numerous times. Direct aggression or pushing RC is not the way to figure out who RC’s partners are if you think he is scum. Wait. If you think RC is scum it will play out. It has to.
ScumBlade's eloquent performance left me utterly disoriented, debased, depraved and sent me spiraling into a horrific murky abyss with emotional turmoil and immense despair as my only companions until slowly I suffocate in my own gloom, surrounded by failure. I will never recover. -- Zachstralkita about Mini 1841
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Post Post #3805 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:57 am

Post by RCEnigma »

In post 3802, RadiantCowbells wrote:ok but here's the thing: if ari flips town then the people that i think are scum are going to win the game because the town will completely fall apart.
So the lazy outline is that access point needed x amount of scum to be approved to a mission by the rest of the town to win. RC came into the game assuming the town leader role over NSG by immediately excluding himself from being voted in. Setting himself up to be self resolvable. It earned a lot of towncred with all but like 1 person (insomnia). RC hard pushed the fact that Insomnias read was bad because he would resolve anyway and as you can guess it was a shouting match that he replaced out of.

Point is, RC setting his team up to carry out the rest of the game isn't outside of my expectation of his scum game. With that could be any number of factors like the Poe being outside of his teammates even if it's still on him. Or (the one I feel is likely) he has anti-associated to diffuse the pool of partners that make sense with him in the event he flips. I don't find any of that unreasonable.
ok but these are monumentally different scenarios. I never intended myself to be self resolvable. I was setting up for you to be submitted D2 and for me to take D3 when the person I pushed in on D2 got nightkilled (thus proving that I was pushing town and using it as an argument to clear me) then to use your terrible associatives with both my scumpartners to get you lynched.

You're talking about a game where I presented the illusion of something and comparing it to a game where I actually did something.
We aren't comparing 1 for 1. The principles match. Not the game specific game plan.
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Post Post #3806 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:58 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

like the goal was for DT and my other partner to keep pushing for you since you already had bad 1 way associatives with them, then I was going to super hard push the person I was on D2 until it got rejected because it came from me then I'd refuse the group submission and accept you as a compromise. We'd nightkill the person that I was trying to shove through. I'd use that against the town and make them add me in 9 way.

This is very much an apples and oranges situation versus me having to, once the scum pool gets whittled down, clear a slot every day I'm alive and somehow justify scum being okay with that.

I didn't claim roleblocked.
2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.
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Post Post #3807 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:59 am

Post by MathBlade »

In post 3802, RadiantCowbells wrote:ok but here's the thing: if ari flips town then the people that i think are scum are going to win the game because the town will completely fall apart.
So the lazy outline is that access point needed x amount of scum to be approved to a mission by the rest of the town to win. RC came into the game assuming the town leader role over NSG by immediately excluding himself from being voted in. Setting himself up to be self resolvable. It earned a lot of towncred with all but like 1 person (insomnia). RC hard pushed the fact that Insomnias read was bad because he would resolve anyway and as you can guess it was a shouting match that he replaced out of.

Point is, RC setting his team up to carry out the rest of the game isn't outside of my expectation of his scum game. With that could be any number of factors like the Poe being outside of his teammates even if it's still on him. Or (the one I feel is likely) he has anti-associated to diffuse the pool of partners that make sense with him in the event he flips. I don't find any of that unreasonable.
ok but these are monumentally different scenarios. I never intended myself to be self resolvable. I was setting up for you to be submitted D2 and for me to take D3 when the person I pushed in on D2 got nightkilled (thus proving that I was pushing town and using it as an argument to clear me) then to use your terrible associatives with both my scumpartners to get you lynched.

You're talking about a game where I presented the illusion of something and comparing it to a game where I actually did something.
Pure hyperbole

Even assuming Ari is town town won’t fall apart. We will have actionable data to follow. Compare d1 and d2.
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Post Post #3808 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:59 am

Post by RCEnigma »

In post 3803, RadiantCowbells wrote:like, you either didn't understand what the plan was or you're lying for points. i was always going to be in the access point pool. and you started making that comparison very early on in this game.
Because what is directly comparable was your statement that you are only taking the lead because no one else will do it. And that you wouldn't do so as scum. Which was directly untrue.
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Post Post #3809 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:59 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

In post 3805, RCEnigma wrote:We aren't comparing 1 for 1. The principles match. Not the game specific game plan.
No, they
don't
.
I always intended to be the scum carry in that game.
I cannot be the scum carry in this game.
2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.
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Post Post #3810 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:59 am

Post by MathBlade »

I gotta go lunch break is over. Please don’t TvT again people.
ScumBlade's eloquent performance left me utterly disoriented, debased, depraved and sent me spiraling into a horrific murky abyss with emotional turmoil and immense despair as my only companions until slowly I suffocate in my own gloom, surrounded by failure. I will never recover. -- Zachstralkita about Mini 1841
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Post Post #3811 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:00 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

In post 3808, RCEnigma wrote:Because what is directly comparable was your statement that you are only taking the lead because no one else will do it. And that you wouldn't do so as scum. Which was directly untrue.
This is literally level 0 reasoning. I wanted to take lead in this game. I shied away because of the playerlist and eventually just decided fuck it I want to spread my wings and fly.
2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.
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Post Post #3812 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:01 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

It's also entirely inaccurate: I immediately went into that game positioning myself as town leader. This game I was reluctant to play town lead because I didn't know how the PList would react much more similar to Perfect Masquerade and I think my early game in both match. The things you're saying do not make sense.
2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.
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Post Post #3813 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:03 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

Like my entrance in that game was basically me wallposting a bunch of mechanical stuff, taking lead on telling the vigs to out, and just generally cementing that position.
This game my entrance was much more subdued. This game I went strongman in response to TW pushing a lynch on me for incorrect reasons. That game I was strongman from very early on.
2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.
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Post Post #3814 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:03 am

Post by RCEnigma »

I'm not going to compare this game with a game I wasn't in and didn't know existed.
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Post Post #3815 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:05 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

But your comparison doesn't make sense.
Even in that game I only backed out from the access point pool to justify not getting nightkilled when NSG replaced in, I was fully intent on strongarming myself as the AP and having my teammates rig associatives with the other two until then.
There is no similar circumstance in this game, and using "yeah but I can't compare this game to that game" as a defense instead of actually reading the game is a bad look.
2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.
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Post Post #3816 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:05 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

Like either your memory of that game is totally, stupendously wrong or you're making up something that you think that people will eat up to try to justify why you're incorrectly scumreading me.
2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.
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Post Post #3817 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:09 am

Post by RCEnigma »

VOTE: RC
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Post Post #3818 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:09 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

My approach to that game was convoluted as hell as a result of that replace in. The original gameplan was really simple. After that, I had no excuse for not supporting her for AP or for scum not killing me under normal circumstances if I was town because there was really no other viable nightkills in that lobby. That's where the "ok I will aim not to enter the pool" and the excessively complex web of spewing associatives and counting on people not voting my reads came from. That's not a realistic starting point for a game because of all the variables and I find it a struggle to believe that you totally forgot that NSG replaced into the game and upended things.
2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.
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Post Post #3819 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:10 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

VOTE: RCE

Avoiding engaging with arguments against his scumread on me because it's a tactical read that he has to hold.
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Post Post #3820 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:10 am

Post by RCEnigma »

Flopz whenever you come around I'd like to chat I think. Bella too if you guys are reading along.
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Post Post #3821 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:12 am

Post by RCEnigma »

I'm not doing this with you. If you want a 1v1 with me I'm fine with that. You'll get 1 post from me about it and no responses.
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Post Post #3822 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:13 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

I enjoy seeing RC rain down with fists of terror in this lobby. I wish there was a TM team with only 4 RCs playing 5 mafia games at the same time because that's the thing that Team Mafia needs.


Bitmap is holding me hostage to post this so I'm posting it.

RCE's comparison to Access Point really doesn't make sense at all and he's not at all interested in allowing it to be held to scrutiny so he just voted me for calling him out for it.
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Post Post #3823 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:14 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=79133

here's access point by the way, if you're interested in reading the game it's being compared ot.
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Post Post #3824 (ISO) » Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:20 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

Also just contrast the way I push Insomnia in that game with the way I push TW in this game. It basically proves my point regarding the way I push people as scum V town.
2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.
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