Team Mafia 2020: Open Setup - Game Over

[Eddie Cane]

we lynch by the numbers, no reason not to

sooo, lets do a list and then murderdeathkill down it.


my prefered list includes hec and bob. salt is on it too tho

I already gave my lynch list of 5. What do you think the order should be after you?

[Nancy Drew 39]

My pool is strictly in (pisskop, hectic, Bob) but subjected more heavy screening

hooo doodles. hang on to your horses.

who did you doc?

@DDL, do not answer this.

This question is antitown, since you know doc is indecisive.

Um scum also know this?

Oh right.

UNVOTE:

So they didn’t just give up then, town outsmarted them.

welllllllllll

in theory a nokill and a poor doc would fake conf a scum

Yes but I’m pretty sure DDL is never scum here. Now if it were someone possibly in my PoE, I’d obviously be a lot more worried, which is why I think both DDL and SS are town here.

And why couldn’t scum!DDL NK someone? It’s not like anyone would have confiscumed him for that anyway. No, I think Scum!DDL 100% kills NaCl here because only NaCl, DDL and SS knew NaCl had to be doc, so no NK, I think probably clears them both.

[Nancy Drew 39]

And if game doesn’t end and I’m in LYLO with either and anyone else I’m obvtowning, I’d probably be very suspicious of that

[Micc]

Votecount 3.02

pisskop (5) -

Nancy Drew 39, OkaPoka, Elsa Jay, Titus, Hectic

bob3141 (1) -

DrDolittle

Elsa Jay (1) -

Amrun

Not Voting (5) -

Eddie Cane, Something_Smart, pisskop, NaCl, bob3141

With 12 players alive it takes 7 votes to lynch.

The deadline for Day 3 is in (expired on 2020-02-05 00:15:00).

[Nancy Drew 39]

I don't know what indecisive means

Are you now seriously claiming not to have read the setup by D freaking 3?

[Elsa Jay]

Jeez. And I thought I was the one reading the game the least.

[Nancy Drew 39]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Indecisive

[Eddie Cane]

I'm ready to end the day if NaCl and Oka are btw.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Jeez. And I thought I was the one reading the game the least.

Even if Piss didn’t know this, it’s not a townslip because i’ve been in a game where one or two scums honestly didn’t know there was either a mod confirmed IC or an SK in the setup.

And for someone who’s been this actively involved in the game, why would he wait until now to ask this, when I asked about about it on D1?

[NaCl]

@NaCl (and @SS maybe?)

Spoiler: Not game solving related advice

I just want to post this because it could have been a pretty significant difference. Purely as advice for future games. Just the full explanation to what Hectic and I previously said.

Doing a gambit like that is fine. 1 scum alive, open setup, there is close to 0 risk. The worst case is you are nightkilled, DDL is confirmed not the doc, and that's that. Same thing that would have happened without the gambit. I'd say its a good play, props to you or SS (if he's town ) for thinking of it.

The problem is, the follow through. You are not supposed to put a save on DDL there unless you are close to 100% confident he is town (which I don't think you should be here, but in general). Landing a save does not earn town another kill. If nobody dies, it confirms that scum is SS or DDL. If you or I or Oka or somebody else dies, that would not have been preventable by saving DDL. If DDL dies, it removes a slot from the PoE, which is effectively another kill gifted to us by the mafia. It is a good thing for DDL to die there! We are at a PoE of 6 with him alive, and still only have 5 kills.

Now, assume you do think DDL is lock town and put a save on him, and nobody dies - what happened this game. You'll notice DDL did not start the day claiming not-doc. That's because outing there is bad. You are now in the world where you are aiming for a second save, most likely on SS but myself or Oka is also possible. The role cop is dead, so they cannot hunt the real doc. The second save buys us that 6th kill. Again, the worst case is you die, and we figure out what happened regardless of SS' alignment. The only time you out today is if you are close to being lynched. Both myself and Oka (the ICs) had said we think you are town / the last slot in the PoE, which is actually the sweet spot because you are not townie enough to get nightkilled randomly and you are not scummy enough to get lynched. DDL is obviously going to defend you as well. Nobody is going to strongman a lynch against the 3 ICs. You were not in danger of dying today. Outing does not actually have any benefit. We are actually worse off than I thought we were by a little bit, because I think independently you were townier than DDL is.

You've played a pretty good game dude, no beef. Just explaining what the mistake and follow up mistake was was so it doesn't happen in another game.

Ugh, yeah, I should have put more thought into it. I felt like DDL was pretty townie but now I feel kind of unsure. Thanks for the advice. Yeah, if I had to do it again, I should not be protecting anyone, that was a mistake.

My pool is strictly in (pisskop, hectic, Bob) but subjected more heavy screening

hooo doodles. hang on to your horses.

who did you doc?

@DDL, do not answer this.

This question is antitown, since you know doc is indecisive.

Um scum also know this?

Oh right.

UNVOTE:

So they didn’t just give up then, town outsmarted them.

welllllllllll

in theory a nokill and a poor doc would fake conf a scum

Yes but I’m pretty sure DDL is never scum here. Now if it were someone possibly in my PoE, I’d obviously be a lot more worried, which is why I think both DDL and SS are town here.

And why couldn’t scum!DDL NK someone? It’s not like anyone would have confiscumed him for that anyway. No, I think Scum!DDL 100% kills NaCl here because only NaCl, DDL and SS knew NaCl had to be doc, so no NK, I think probably clears them both.

No, because killing me would indicate that there is scum in S_S/DDL. While it is possible that there isn't due to unwnd investigating me, I don't consider myself to be a high priority target to investigate by unwnd (to be fair, if he didn't read the game he might do that, but he has his TM team and his other scumpartner so I doubt it). So if there was scum in there, they couldn't kill me because that would point right to them.

All in all though, it's pretty NAI because scum inside or outside the neighbourhood has the same chance of acting in that way (assuming they believe the DDL claim if they're out of it).

Anyways, I'm not too picky on the order. Of those 4 that everyone wants I'm least convinced on bob but all the others seem decent choices to me.
VOTE: Pisskop
L-1
I'm pretty good with ending the game (okay, maybe just the day).

[Nancy Drew 39]

An IC is outed by definition. I don’t know what you’re talking about

Ideally, doc should protect phone operator, so I’m assuming they would be IC then. I’ve never hear of an “indecisive” anything before? What does that even mean in this context?

I’ve never hear of an “indecisive” anything before? What does that even mean in this context?

Can't target the same player twice in a row.

Indecisive doctor is common in F2F.

[Eddie Cane]

VOTE: Pisskop

[Elsa Jay]

Putting in a request for a fast night? In Team Mafia?

Might not be possible.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Spoiler:

@NaCl (and @SS maybe?)
[Not game solving related advice]I just want to post this because it could have been a pretty significant difference. Purely as advice for future games. Just the full explanation to what Hectic and I previously said.

Doing a gambit like that is fine. 1 scum alive, open setup, there is close to 0 risk. The worst case is you are nightkilled, DDL is confirmed not the doc, and that's that. Same thing that would have happened without the gambit. I'd say its a good play, props to you or SS (if he's town ) for thinking of it.

The problem is, the follow through. You are not supposed to put a save on DDL there unless you are close to 100% confident he is town (which I don't think you should be here, but in general). Landing a save does not earn town another kill. If nobody dies, it confirms that scum is SS or DDL. If you or I or Oka or somebody else dies, that would not have been preventable by saving DDL. If DDL dies, it removes a slot from the PoE, which is effectively another kill gifted to us by the mafia. It is a good thing for DDL to die there! We are at a PoE of 6 with him alive, and still only have 5 kills.

Now, assume you do think DDL is lock town and put a save on him, and nobody dies - what happened this game. You'll notice DDL did not start the day claiming not-doc. That's because outing there is bad. You are now in the world where you are aiming for a second save, most likely on SS but myself or Oka is also possible. The role cop is dead, so they cannot hunt the real doc. The second save buys us that 6th kill. Again, the worst case is you die, and we figure out what happened regardless of SS' alignment. The only time you out today is if you are close to being lynched. Both myself and Oka (the ICs) had said we think you are town / the last slot in the PoE, which is actually the sweet spot because you are not townie enough to get nightkilled randomly and you are not scummy enough to get lynched. DDL is obviously going to defend you as well. Nobody is going to strongman a lynch against the 3 ICs. You were not in danger of dying today. Outing does not actually have any benefit. We are actually worse off than I thought we were by a little bit, because I think independently you were townier than DDL is.

You've played a pretty good game dude, no beef. Just explaining what the mistake and follow up mistake was was so it doesn't happen in another game.

Ugh, yeah, I should have put more thought into it. I felt like DDL was pretty townie but now I feel kind of unsure. Thanks for the advice. Yeah, if I had to do it again, I should not be protecting anyone, that was a mistake.

My pool is strictly in (pisskop, hectic, Bob) but subjected more heavy screening

hooo doodles. hang on to your horses.

who did you doc?

@DDL, do not answer this.

This question is antitown, since you know doc is indecisive.

Um scum also know this?

Oh right.

UNVOTE:

So they didn’t just give up then, town outsmarted them.

welllllllllll

in theory a nokill and a poor doc would fake conf a scum

Yes but I’m pretty sure DDL is never scum here. Now if it were someone possibly in my PoE, I’d obviously be a lot more worried, which is why I think both DDL and SS are town here.

And why couldn’t scum!DDL NK someone? It’s not like anyone would have confiscumed him for that anyway. No, I think Scum!DDL 100% kills NaCl here because only NaCl, DDL and SS knew NaCl had to be doc, so no NK, I think probably clears them both.

No, because killing me would indicate that there is scum in S_S/DDL. While it is possible that there isn't due to unwnd investigating me, I don't consider myself to be a high priority target to investigate by unwnd (to be fair, if he didn't read the game he might do that, but he has his TM team and his other scumpartner so I doubt it). So if there was scum in there, they couldn't kill me because that would point right to them.

All in all though, it's pretty NAI because scum inside or outside the neighbourhood has the same chance of acting in that way (assuming they believe the DDL claim if they're out of it).

Anyways, I'm not too picky on the order. Of those 4 that everyone wants I'm least convinced on bob but all the others seem decent choices to me.
VOTE: Pisskop
L-1
I'm pretty good with ending the game (okay, maybe just the day).

True, fair point but either scum!DDL or scum!SS could have killed either Eddie or Oka in that case, right?

[Micc]

Votecount 3.03

pisskop (7) -

Nancy Drew 39, OkaPoka, Elsa Jay, Titus, Hectic, NaCl, Eddie Cane

bob3141 (1) -

DrDolittle

Elsa Jay (1) -

Amrun

Not Voting (3) -

Something_Smart, pisskop, bob3141

With 12 players alive it takes 7 votes to lynch.

A lynch has been achieved.

[Micc]

pisskop has been lynched Day 3. They were a

Town Neighbor

.

It is now Night 3. The deadline for Night 3 is in (expired on 2020-01-24 23:30:00).

[Micc]

OkaPoka has been killed Night 3. He was a

Town Neighbor

.

It is now Day 4.

Votecount 4.00

Not Voting (10) -

Eddie Cane, Titus, Something_Smart, Elsa Jay, Nancy Drew 39, DrDolittle, Hectic, Amrun, NaCl, bob3141

With 10 players alive it takes 6 votes to lynch.

The deadline for Day 4 is in (expired on 2020-02-07 23:30:00).

Amrun is V/LA.

[Elsa Jay]

Someone really doesn't think you can solve this game, Doctor.

[Eddie Cane]

Nah, killing in me and Oka is probably correct.

[Eddie Cane]

So NaCl!conftown
DDL!prob town
Nancy!town
Titus!town
Amrun!prob town
SS!wouldntlynchtillyloprobably

Bob elsa hectic should probably be chain lynched?

[Eddie Cane]

I think a nk that bad points towards a few players specifically, lol

[Nancy Drew 39]

OkaPoka has been killed Night 3. He was a

Town Neighbor

.

It is now Day 4.

Votecount 4.00

Not Voting (10) -

Eddie Cane, Titus, Something_Smart, Elsa Jay, Nancy Drew 39, DrDolittle, Hectic, Amrun, NaCl, bob3141

With 10 players alive it takes 6 votes to lynch.

The deadline for Day 4 is in (expired on 2020-02-07 23:30:00).

Amrun is V/LA.

Really weird.

[Nancy Drew 39]

I think NaCl, bob, Elsa are my preferred preferred pool today

Piss/Hectic are my ehh sure whatever lynch

S_S is my i mean i guess but im a little spooked why we are doing this now lynch

Titus is my yo this isn't cool lynch

Nancy is my omg stop it stop stop it lynch

VOTE: bob

[Nancy Drew 39]

So NaCl!conftown
DDL!prob town
Nancy!town
Titus!town
Amrun!prob town
SS!wouldntlynchtillyloprobably

Bob elsa hectic should probably be chain lynched?

Scum should probably concede anyway, since unless my strongest tr are all wrong, it’s pretty much an autowin for town atp.

[DrDolittle]

Let's lynch right this time round and slow it down. These two days of waiting was horrible