White Flag - TM2020

[Auro]

I wasnt killed because i was the only one who consistently voiced suspicion on dann and auro.

No, it's because you're scummy af. Cephrir was pretty obviously town and a universal townread.

[Donempire]

Keeping me alive seemed to keep Gobbles alive so far, yeah?

No, Gob's dying.

Dann, you'll vote Gob with me tomorrow then?

Hey Auro, can you reask the dozen questions I've asked people on the last few pages about their bad trajectories on me tomorrow instead of letting people ignore them thanks.

Cheeky I might take out of that pool on more reading. Fish I could easily see replacing them.

Will be on it, boss. I'm 90% going for Gob tomorrow, but I'll make sure I do this.

Nope, Gob dies because he's scum.

FF I'm coming for you.

No Cheeky. You go Gob with me.

You guys are letting Gob happily lurk out. He's made multiple promises to play the game, yet ignores this game completely while playing others...

Gob still scum! Apologies for making the Hopkirk lynch harder if this wins the game

I'd say gob would fare just as well without you alive.

[Donempire]

I wasnt killed because i was the only one who consistently voiced suspicion on dann and auro.

No, it's because you're scummy af. Cephrir was pretty obviously town and a universal townread.

Auro, how are you reading Dong

@Dann: Loony town.

No, Dong is town.
Agree, Hop's recent posting has been pretty bad - but please let's have Gobble after we lynch Hop.

Let me know when i have to say anything myself, right now im doing just fine with your own words.

[Auro]

I'd say gob would fare just as well without you alive.

Sure... implication being? That night killing me doesn't make a difference? So?

Let me know when i have to say anything myself, right now im doing just fine with your own words.

I honestly don't grok your thought processes; even as scum you must be imagining you have something concrete here.

[Auro]

Keeping me alive seemed to keep Gobbles alive so far, yeah?

If 2801 was a response to this, I meant keeping me alive caused no real harm to Gobbles so far. Not that it was the sole reason Gobbles is alive still.

[CheekyTeeky]

Dong are we reading the same game? IIRC I was pushing Auro/Dann theories while you were proposing a cheeky/gobbles team. You seemed all over the place D2, I mean it's towny but moonlogic to think you're alive over Cephrir in spite of your indecision.

I think it's pretty obvious Cephrir was the night kill if Dann/Auro are scum because otherwise they would have been killed instead, especially after Danns long winded lamist posts about being a busily incorrect towny...yet here we all are :evilgrin:

[Auro]

I think it's pretty obvious Cephrir was the night kill if Dann/Auro are scum because otherwise they would have been killed instead

Why not you?

[CheekyTeeky]

You mean after setting up my FF buddy for the quick hammer on Hop and wanting to lynch gobbles/FF? Lol. You need me and you know it.

[Auro]

Ceph would be unwilling to let us lead on FF?
Town wouldn't want to lynch FF after you called him scum and died?

Why would we need you over Ceph o.O

[Auro]

I wish Dunn was here.


Shouldn't have NK'd him, sigh

[CheekyTeeky]

Because Ceph would have worked out why he was at lylo, is harder to sway, and he looked like the towniest player in the game to you two because you're both scum parading too well as town that it looks super bad that neither of you are dead yet the sarcastic non-contributor who you both townread is dead.

I'm not answering another question about why wouldn't you do xyz as scum because this is beyond pointless. Tell me why gobbles is -still- scum.

[CheekyTeeky]

Your tunnel is unnatural. You have not hesitated on gobbles since day 2. You must have a scumclaim if some kind to ignore all information since.

[CheekyTeeky]

Oh and Ceph was never getting lynched while you're attempting to lead the town. Whereas theres a fantastic case for cheeky/FF or cheeky/gobbles you can both push now.

[CheekyTeeky]

Or even Cheeky/BB

[Auro]

Because Ceph would have worked out why he was at lylo, is harder to sway, and he looked like the towniest player in the game to you two because you're both scum parading too well as town that it looks super bad that neither of you are dead yet the sarcastic non-contributor who you both townread is dead.

I'm not answering another question about why wouldn't you do xyz as scum because this is beyond pointless. Tell me why gobbles is -still- scum.

It's pretty objectively clear you'd be harder to "sway". Ceph

literally

said Dann can win if he's scum. Meanwhile, you were

constantly

voicing an {Auro+Dann} paranoia.

Your tunnel is unnatural. You have not hesitated on gobbles since day 2. You must have a scumclaim if some kind to ignore all information since.

Okay, let's do your exercise. I was pushing {Molla+Gobbles} since D2. What new information have we gotten since then?

D2 Lynch, Espeonage Town

: Who I townread then anyway, and didn't have much legitimate input himself.

N2 Kill, Dunnstral Town

: Who I was townreading, with a little bit of paranoia; whose reads weren't inconsistent with my push.

D3 Lynch, Hopkirk Town

: Who I townread and tried to fight a lynch off of.

N3 Kill, Cephrir Town

: Who I townread, and who had Dong, FF, and Gobbles at the bottom of his reads list. (2431)

I have not been Night Killed

: Which seems like a perfectly valid strategy for scum!Gobbles to follow.

Now,

which

piece of information must be enough basis for re-evaluation?

Oh and Ceph was never getting lynched while you're attempting to lead the town. Whereas theres a fantastic case for cheeky/FF or cheeky/gobbles you can both push now.

And we care why? With only two slots from {FF, Gobbles, Dong, Molla} to lynch from to win the game, the attainability of a lynch outside that pool is far less important than the chances of pocketing them.

[Auro]

Tell me why gobbles is -still- scum.

• Meta mismatch from town games. He asks legitimately gamesolving questions in his town games, and follows up on them; and a lot of empty questions as scum. And whatever questions he's asked here are empty.
  
• Activity. He's been inactive for a long while in this game specifically.
  
• Associatives with Molla. When Gob's lynch was actually going through in D2, Molla unnaturally hard defended his slot with heavy AtE, asking to be lynched himself instead. I've not seen Molla do this in D2 before after a scum flip.
  
• D1 play. His NSG vote, coupled with "Get the non-bussers first" afterwards is scummy. His EoD1 behavior was also scummy IIRC, and has been analysed before.
  
• D2 play. What did he do D2? Give his D2 ISO a skim; there's nothing meaningful.
  
• D3 play. A naked vote on Dong, "Please just listen to me", empty questions, and lurked his butt off. Unfulfilled promises of playing.

You tell me why he's town, assuming I'm town. (i.e. no "u scum so turkey town!!")

[Donempire]

Dong are we reading the same game? IIRC I was pushing Auro/Dann theories while you were proposing a cheeky/gobbles team. You seemed all over the place D2, I mean it's towny but moonlogic to think you're alive over Cephrir in spite of your indecision.

I think it's pretty obvious Cephrir was the night kill if Dann/Auro are scum because otherwise they would have been killed instead, especially after Danns long winded lamist posts about being a busily incorrect towny...yet here we all are :evilgrin:

Yeah, and you havent been reading the game since 2582. I have went on to push auro for the entire day but i guess some... other people have been making more noise than i have been.

I have been flipping on some of my older reads but i was certain on one thing during the later stages of the game: The fact that scum will want to control the narrative so afk players cant be scum, and auro + dann seemed to fit that to a tee. I dont remember being influenced by your read on them, but if i were, so what?

I'm not saying i would have made for a better nk than cephrir, i certainly didnt expect it and i said so in the post you are responding to.

I wasnt killed because i was the only one who consistently voiced suspicion on dann and auro. If i was killed, it would be the awkwardest shit ever, even more so than cephrir, and would definitely incriminate dann and auro.

So what did you understand from this post exactly?

[Auro]

The fact that scum will want to control the narrative so afk players cant be scum

Yes, the only logical conclusion is that the active players must be scum.
Scum never lurk off, because they want to take control. Therefore active players scum, case closed.

[Donempire]

I thought so. You havent presented a case to suggest otherwise

I'm not talking about in general, im talking this game specifically. Tell me why former or bb here are even plausibly scum.

[Auro]

"You're active"
"You're parading as town"
"You were right about all the flips so far"

Brilliant casework, Dong and Cheeky

Re: 2802 - you're scummy in the game, i.e. others wanted to lynch you, I read you as loony town. That's not a contradiction.

[Donempire]

It is quite clearly that you are trying to discredit me but you cant afford to take my words at face value so you have to strawman them.

Can you fully quote what i said back in 2709? I think it was something like uhhhh...

I wasnt killed because i was the only one who consistently voiced suspicion on dann and auro.

If i was killed, it would be the awkwardest shit ever, even more so than cephrir, and would definitely incriminate dann and auro.

Anyways, i dont know what you even tried to say with 2800. I wasnt killed, and i am not suggesting that i was.

[Donempire]

I do agree i misspoke in 2799 though. If i had to revise it to more accurately portray what i was thinking at the time it would be something like:

I wasnt killed despite making a fuss about dann and auro because im just simply not a good nk. Even if its an assurance that i will push them both tomorrow what they hope is i will not push hard enough or good enough because killing me to shut up their one loose thread would put an even bigger target on them, and after gobble auros lynch would follow suit.
Speaking of that... why wasnt dann killed?

[Auro]

IF you were killed it'd be the "awkwardest shit ever", okay, so how does that make me scum? You were obviously the inferior night kill compared to Cephrir on objective reasoning: you're way less townread than Cephrir was.

If killing you "incriminates Auro and Dann", but you haven't been killed, the inference fails.

Yes, you're not a good NK; but that isn't evidence that I'm scum. You're fabricating an explanation to fit your own reads.

Cephrir was more townread than Dann also. A lot of you are pushing pretty shit paranoia theories.

[Donempire]

The fuck are you going on about lol?
I said killing me would put a target on you, not incriminate you. You are already scum, you just dont want to be put under the glass after a suspicious nk.

Again, strawmans

[Auro]

Okay, great, you have an explanation for scum!Auro not killing town!Dong. Now, what about it? Is this your grand Auro case?