Titus v. Alisae (endgame)

[OkaPoka]

let aaron towncase himself tbh

[Alisae]

I'm seriously concerned that you guys take town cases seriously

[Sherlock and Watson]

bitch you don't know a towncase until you've been krazy-cased

towncases > scumcases

-S

[Alisae]

ok let me rephrase
I am seriously concerned that you guys take towncases seriously when the user towncasing is towncasing themselves

[insomnia]

Weighing whether I pussied out of a scum read or if I have actual reasoning to town read AF now

Later

[Espeonage]

I just think AF will sort out in the wash given the hoods. I'm more arguing that I think he can be set aside regardless of anything. I have him as null bc the entire thing reads like he is out of his depth which I think is both accurate and NAI.

[Flavor Leaf]

Apparently they’re calling me a clairvoyant prodigy now, so I now have a duty once I make my return

[Espeonage]

I would say that somni is really good for gamestate unfortunately. Bc I am mostly riding Titus' coattails on that one.

Personally I like Chemist as scum outside of the claims. I think RR is getting too much lee way. I have unsubstantiated qualms with gobbles. And I dislike Hectic and FL on day 1.

[Sherlock and Watson]

My concern with RR is that based on Pine I kinda? think there's more than one ascetic in the game which suggests that the claimed ascetic is probably town

-S

[Flavor Leaf]

TSE why exactly do you think that the whole scum team is JOATs all with neighborizers?

Like all JOATs I could see, but each of them having a neighborizer seems unlikely to me.

If you've already explained this then quote it for me.

Alisae response to Neighborizors was BAD for a Treestump.
Also their so and so “Slip” is also telling.

I think the 'slip' was done to cause pandemonium, which it's apparently doing a good job of.

Like I agree that scum most likely has another neighborizer of some kind, but to say the entire scum team is neighborizing JOATs is a reach for how much info we have right now.

Maybe but think of it.
Don’t you think it’s very possible for Alisae to pick a setup like that.
Look at Alisae
Then look at all the Normal Roles.
Which ones you think Alisae is going to pick?
Which would cause the most chaos and make Titus lose?
That’s right! Neighborizing JOAT’s.

Chemist is a good choice for a scum mate for a few reasons.
1) He’s not a scummy player.
So he can’t really be PL’ed and you doesn’t really ever fool around to the point of being bad.
He’s a very relaxed and “chemist” Playstyle.
I don’t like it TBF but it has its pluses.
2) He’s good at Neighborizing.
In a game I played on Mafia 451 he Neighborized the Cop.
Told his mafia to frame the Cops target.
Got the target lynched who from reactions to the cop guilty alone spewed town.
But no one was willing to lynch Chemist for it.
3) Leverage
Chemist as the capability to get out of situations the “Chemist” Way.
Like to the point that no one feels directly comfortable on lynching chemist.
So Chemist can sound so genuine and make people uneasy on voting him.

And with all this I don’t know what else I have to do to explain to people that Chemist is Scum here.

Like thinking that SW or the great one can be scum is just laughable right now, tbh

[Sherlock and Watson]

Unless amrun is still ascetic and I'm just really fucking confused so maybe I should put spec aside there anyway

-S

[Flavor Leaf]

That quote wasn’t supposed to be there.

Also, disliking does not equal scum

[Flavor Leaf]

What would I have needed to do better yesterday then?

Not catch scum?

[OkaPoka]

vote aaronfrost rn

[Flavor Leaf]

Spoiler:

TrueSoulEnergy
Pine
Flavor Leaf
Hectic
OkaPoka
Espeonage
Bitmap
Maki and Kaito (hydra of Maki Harukawa & Kaito Momota)
Sherlock and Watson (hydra of PenguinPower & Krazy)
Frozen Angel
Chemist1422
AaronFrost
Spiffeh
gobbledygook
Ankamius
Reasonably Rational (hydra of Cerberus v666 and Drixx)
Amrun

Let’s look at this list? Who would you state are the scum heavies, picks by Alisae? By heavy, I mean the slot to be able to captain a scum team and maneuver their way around the majority of players, which is why I won’t have Bitmap or the RR hydra, even though I think they’re likely strong or capable scum players.

I would say:
Pine
FL
Maria/Dunn hydra (keep in mind, Alisae nomm’d Dunn for Rising Star)
Sherlock and Watson
Ankamius

There is absolutely zero chance that there isn’t scum within this list. I know I’m town, and you can deduct Alisae wouldn’t ever pick me here (you don’t have to believe it, but e knows it’s true)

So that leaves

Pine
Maria/Dunn hydra
Krazy/PP hydra
Ankamius.

Obviously you can’t just pick all heavies, that’s too many cooks in the kitchen, so it would be balanced out between strong supporting scum players, and a likely “no one would ever expect this!!!”

Does anybody disagree with this heavy list?

Secondary Scum List second in commands

Espeonage
Bitmap
Gobbledygook
Reasonably Rational

Under the radar coast be there scum picks
Hectic
Okapoka
AaronFrost
Frozen Angel
Spiffeh


Don’t really see Alisae picking unless having to choose between two of em specifically
TrueSoulEnergy
Chemist
Amrun

If this is the topic of conversation for the evening I'm tagging in Kaito and going to bed.

yeah the way he's doing it seems kinda passive-aggressive and uncool

I didn't realize boon was gonna neg half the player list when I poked the boon fire

-S

Combine that with the fact if I have to deal with people calling X town and Y scum for 'what ali would do' I'm going to actively ignore it because it's just stupid. Set up spec is stupid pick drafting is stupid. Let's just play mafia. Ugh.

I actually highly disagree with the drafting being bad, because Alisae gets to post in this game, and thus is readable.

This is my starting ground, building my base for me to eventually solve, and I’m showing my work.

Atm, I don’t think Ankamius is the 1 to have been drafted out of the 4.

Kinda like Maki's tone here but not sure enough to undo the damage Dunn did to my read there earlier

I absolutely do not like Maki’s tone here. Explain please.

I almost impulsively voted Maki a bit back.

One of Krazy hydra/Ankamius, but exactly one of them.

You're kinda looking at this the wrong way though

Duck and SS get to pick

If Ali goes first and does a top priority heavy that isn't Ank, then Duck could very easily double on us for town

Which is precisely why you're basically just looking at the pick logic totally wrong, you're over-prioritizing what is actually an incredibly difficult puzzle to analyze. Focus on play, Boon, before you actually make me want to policy lynch you for real Like half of what you've said since you stopped actually solving is like pure cancer

-S

So? I post a lot. It’s not like I don’t analyze play whilst all this.

I also think my posting is fantastic for reactions.

We’ll see.

If I’m right, like I usually am when people push at me, at least 2/3 partially, you can ask PenguinPower on my solve capabilities at the expense of some minor casualties.

And this is a solid base of the puzzle. I found a good amount of puzzle pieces, and looking at em all before I start trying to piece it together.

I think one of the people who have posted against me tonight is scum, and almost exactly one of them.

I no longer town read OkaPoka either. Maki/Oka/Krazy slot have probably 1 maybe 2 scum within them, but more likely 1.

I’m not comfortable throwing Ank off the table yet, but yeah.


Aaron and Hectic were lean towns for me from my read through, I commented on my AF read, so that’s good that my gut was right with them.

Pine being a mason actually helps a lot, and lowers a heavy pick.

Maki/Krazy-PP/Ank is a semi POE.

Chemist/Amrun/TSE - are lean towns based on what I said earlier. TSE even moreso.

Gobbledygook/Bitmap are town reads of mine based on their play and posts, and position in the gamestate.

Spiffeh/Espeonage/Frozen Angel I think probably have scum in them based on their place in this game mixed with the drafting process and my other reads.

Okapoka’s probably just scum, especially if Krazy is town.

RR, idk, null.

OkaPoka/Maki/Espeonage is my way too early scum team, with probably like Spiffeh/FA.

Oo, baby, I had a good day 1. I didn’t even requote my analysis and thought small posts.

I will if people argue me

[OkaPoka]

ok lynch me rn

[OkaPoka]

actually

idea

lynch pine

and then deadline is tomorrow to basically resolve all important night actions and lay everything out and all vetos except masons are lifted sounds good?

[Sherlock and Watson]

VOTE: Pine

shall we sacrifice Pine to the gods of negative utility?

-S

[Sherlock and Watson]

Don't get me wrong I still think he flips town about 85% of the time

-S

[Sherlock and Watson]

wait
UNVOTE:

so long as pine is alive, isn't an unclaimed ascetic a soft guilty, so failed night actions are actually alignment indicative

so don't we WANT pine alive, because failed actions is our best way of catching a scum ascetic?

-S

[TrueSoulEnergy]

TSE I'm gonna say that Ali fucking with you is NAI for chemist sorry

-S

Good take!

:/.

[Sherlock and Watson]

like the ascetic in theory should help scum but in this situation doesn't the ascetic hurt scum, if we assume that the claimed ascetics are in fact town (I know big assumption cause everyone hates RR slot)?

or should we lynch Pine so that RR slot should be checked?

-S

[TrueSoulEnergy]

TSE why exactly do you think that the whole scum team is JOATs all with neighborizers?

Like all JOATs I could see, but each of them having a neighborizer seems unlikely to me.

If you've already explained this then quote it for me.

Alisae response to Neighborizors was BAD for a Treestump.
Also their so and so “Slip” is also telling.

I think the 'slip' was done to cause pandemonium, which it's apparently doing a good job of.

Like I agree that scum most likely has another neighborizer of some kind, but to say the entire scum team is neighborizing JOATs is a reach for how much info we have right now.

Maybe but think of it.
Don’t you think it’s very possible for Alisae to pick a setup like that.
Look at Alisae
Then look at all the Normal Roles.
Which ones you think Alisae is going to pick?
Which would cause the most chaos and make Titus lose?
That’s right! Neighborizing JOAT’s.

Chemist is a good choice for a scum mate for a few reasons.
1) He’s not a scummy player.
So he can’t really be PL’ed and you doesn’t really ever fool around to the point of being bad.
He’s a very relaxed and “chemist” Playstyle.
I don’t like it TBF but it has its pluses.
2) He’s good at Neighborizing.
In a game I played on Mafia 451 he Neighborized the Cop.
Told his mafia to frame the Cops target.
Got the target lynched who from reactions to the cop guilty alone spewed town.
But no one was willing to lynch Chemist for it.
3) Leverage
Chemist as the capability to get out of situations the “Chemist” Way.
Like to the point that no one feels directly comfortable on lynching chemist.
So Chemist can sound so genuine and make people uneasy on voting him.

And with all this I don’t know what else I have to do to explain to people that Chemist is Scum here.

Like thinking that SW or the great one can be scum is just laughable right now, tbh

Who’s “the great one”?

[Sherlock and Watson]

I don't wanna shut you down TSE but I just don't see how that exchange is even slightly scum indicative for chemist?

If you wanna case chemist off meta/play you can keep doing that but I think he's hard to read and the things I see make me lean town personally

-S

[Espeonage]

Look I'm fine with Pine.