Mini Normal 2118: Boon Gets Pretentious - [Day 4]

[Hectic]

I will try and take some time today to devote to the game in the meantime.

Please do this at some point

[Hectic]

I think most games I've played with neighbourhoods have scum in them. I just believe Doro's townslip though. I mean, do you actually think that scum!Doro goes for the route where he pretends to think his neighbourhood was equivalent to a masonry? Maybe if insomnia coaches him to, but since they don't have daychat that's impossible.

Where was this "townslip"?

It's based on what Ame said where he thought both neighbours were town (equivalent to masons). If Doro is scum and was trying (and failing) to pocket Ame in the neighbourhood, maybe he employs this confusion strat where he says "oh, I just assumed neighbours were always town", but I think it's far more likely he was acutally just confused about how they worked based on his experience with mafia so far (no offence, Doro).

Hmm okay. Not sure I buy that as a true townslip, but I need to revisit dsj based on his play.

Which do you think is more likely setup-wise?

1) 2 town neighbors, 2 town masons, 1 scum PT cop
or
2) 2 town masons, 1 town neighbor and 1 scum neighbor

No idea; I'm not the one to ask for setup design/spec. They both seem kinda balanced to me.

[Hectic]

Oh, I forgot about this lul. AaronFF, can you address 1395 and 1396? I agree with Ame that I don't get why you bring something up which has no use to you if you're town, but only helps others consider you as scum. Feels like you're being too open and looking like you're trying to consider all scenarios.

Yeah you just kinda answered your own question HecticMFHectic. I was trying to consider every angle and find out what the most likely scenario is. I even mentioned that is wasn't likely and was upset when Ame got lynched while I was catching up.

I get considering every scenario, but why consider a scenario which only involves you being scum - which you should know to be false?

Could you answer this, AaronFF? THis is the biggest problem I have with you right now, I just want to understand your reasoning behind this from a town PoV

[Hectic]

Im thinking.

What if Aaron was not framed by insomnia ?

I'm overthinking too much about how voracious Insomnia defended him. But, definitely, he would seem extremely suspicious with the argument against Luca, so even if Luca was lynched, Insomnia would be linked to Aaron the next day, so it would be quicker to conclude that the two were partners. This scenario would not make sense, considering the motivation of the deathtunnel was to distort possible reads about Aaron from then on.

It may be strange, but I would say that the latest

scum

, considering all my current impressions, would no longer point to

Dsj

, but to

AaronFrost

.

My intuition says that Aaron is scum, considering that the 4 of us engaged here today and he just disappeared 5 or 6 pages ago.

Still .. Ame being

scum

still doesn't get into my head. Aaron being AFK in this game in the last pages would agree with my theory of him being

scum

.

What I feel for Aaron is a departure from this second stage of the game, so I intuitively put him as a scum, if Dsj is town.

So your reasoning for Aaron!scum is a mixture of him being inactive recently, him being off the wagon, and intuition? Could you try and elaborate on your intuition or point to specifics?

[Hectic]

I probably die tonight if we lynch incorrectly. My reads right now are still: Karnage>AaronFF>Clidd>Doro

[Karnage]

I can't see a scenario where scum is first to vote their partner then the partner self hammers. That makes me think clidd is likely town. Hectic feels like a solid town read so it leaves djstr and aaron.

[Karnage]

This + insomnia's tone in general is pretty townie

I think insomnia is town actually.

Still like my insomnia read.

\The close-mindedness of Insomnia’s Luca/Flips push is so lazy and terrible that he’s probably scum.

This is the kind of statement that I almost never expect to come from town!Luca nor was insomnia pushing a Luca/flippynips team. He said it was a TMI read which implies that you both can't be scum together.

I still think insomnia is town honestly.

I don't think scum gets that deathtunneled on a slot he knows to be town. I have my reservations about whether the mason claim could be faked, but that feels like a big risk to take even in a closed setup.

Lot strong town reads and some defense of scum!insomnia

And I gave my reasons for 'slapping a TR on him'.

This feels just like in the last game where I suspected you, and you tried to deflect from it by suspecting me in return.

Why didn't you mention any of this before I called you out?

I was catching up from like page 15 or so last night and the posts that I'm scumreading you for happened after that point. I was going to call you out for them, but you called me out before I got the chance.

And like, think about it, would scumme seriously try the same deflection tactic on the same person two games in a row? I think you and I are both smart enough at this game to know that I wouldn't do that.

I think Frost would try to improve as scum and don’t see anything in this game he couldn’t have faked so far. We could go in circles here.

Yeah of course I would try to improve, but you're molding your read on me under that assumption instead of actually evaluating my play here.

So IF I am scum trying to improve my play here, then WHY would I attempt the same deflection tactic that I did on you in Mini 2115 in this game with a similar playerlist AND knowing that it didn't work? That makes no fucking sense.

This meta defense (which I guess is what you would call it) leaves a bad taste in my mouth

[AaronFrost]

Could you answer this, AaronFF? THis is the biggest problem I have with you right now, I just want to understand your reasoning behind this from a town PoV

Because the scenario also involved a possibility of Ame!scum which is something I was considering for a while.

[AaronFrost]

This meta defense (which I guess is what you would call it) leaves a bad taste in my mouth

Okay but people were using my meta against me, so would you expect me to not use meta to defend myself in that case?

[Karnage]

Well it's obvious to me that he was trying to pocket me and he did a pretty good job of that honestly.

Scum don't have daytalk (

unless they have an encrypter that we don't know about

) so if that's the case then scum!Hectic wouldn't be able to say to his buddy "hey don't self-hammer"

If Hectic's most recent scumgame is anything to go off of, he likes to distance from his partners and avoid drawing associations.

Wouldn't your argument about your own meta apply here?

- insomnia pressured myself and Ame early on. I think in a setup with no daychat, it's possible that scum would fake pressure on their partner if they disapproved of their posting. This is something that should be discussed imo.
- He later turned the reads on both of us into townreads. Read into this how you will, but I'm trying to figure scum!somni's motivation for turning his reads around like that.

I think he was trying to pocket me

, but could his turn around on Ame indicate partnership?
-

If he was distancing, it might have been with Wimpy. His play around the Wimpy slot feels like he was trying to avoid tunneling him.

Could be that he disapproved of Ame's tunnel as well, but I think the way Wimpy played around him though doesn't indicate partnership.
-

clidd insistence that insomnia is town is suspicious

as well and he doesn't do much to support that read.
- dsj follow somni onto flippy. I could see scum!dsj voting with his buddy here/trying to protect him. Definitely looks buddyish.
- Hectic barely interacted with somni early in Day 1 which is weird, but the scum!Hectic I just witnessed in Micro 920 interacted with his buddies quite a bit so eh it's probably nothing.
- Gonna be upset is Ame was also trying to pocket me when I was getting pressured by Luca but I think her defense of me was genuine there.
- Luca/Ame/insomnia/me goes on for a literal eternity. Skimmed most of those pages on a reread.
- clidd voted insomnia even though he thought he was town what? I think Ame is town for the hop on in 1004, think she'd be a little more hesitant to vote him there is she was scum with him. Hectic's vote on Karnage after that was bleh as well.

Scumpool right now is {Hectic, dsj, clidd}, if this isn't right then throw Ame in there.

Karnage I don't think is scum simply because of Wimpy's play around somni

, and flippy is obviously conf town.

Shotgun reads from most likely town to least likely town

flippynips (conf town) > Ame > Karnage > Hectic> clidd > dsjstr

I have yet to read most of Day 2 I'll be doing that shortly.

little bit hypocritical to call out clidd for their "insistance" that insomnia is town. Also the town read on me doesn't jive with your thoughts about insomnia distancing from wimpy

Vanilla Townie. Popcorn Hectic

First to claim makes it harder for him to fakeclaim. Curious why you chose hectic to claim instead of clidd who was lower on your list.

Like how likely is it that we have two town masons and two town neighbors?

Scum would have to have like a PT cop or a traffic analyst to counter that

.

dsj are you just a town neighbor or are you something else on top of that?

theres a slot of speculation about scum roles. not sure if its indicative of anything but it stood out to me

[Karnage]

It could be clidd/Insomnnia Hectic/Insomnia, I think we just have to lynch Insomnia

One game, he knew the three mafia on page 7 out of 21.

That's a quick turn around from clidd could be scum to we should trust clidd's reads

@dsjstr

It could be clidd/Insomnnia Hectic/Insomnia, I think we just have to lynch Insomnia

(1) Can you explain how you came to the conclusion that it was Insomnia here? Why was Karnage and Aaron out of the running for you? You had previously stated suspicions on Aaron.
(2) Why didn't you vote Insomnia?
(3) Why would Luca not dying warrant neighbors claiming?
(4) Why do

you

think Somni self-hammered?

1. I put Hectic because of his voting pattern, at the time it made sense to have clidd as a partner don't remember exactly what I was thinking.

2. I was willing to place a vote on clidd at the time

3. Then it would be 4-3 conftown and

an unavoidable town win

.

4. Hide the other scum in the pack of people off the lynch or its Clidd

re: #1 but weren't you voting luca at the time?
re: #2 you said "we just have to lynch insomnia", what does being willing to vote clidd have to do with it?
re: #3 i don't like the phrasing "unavoidable town win"

If everyone thinks that clidd is cleared then this game is still an

unavoidable town win

.

there it is again

Well Hectic avoided going for Insomnia and opted to vote for clidd, with the little vocal support that had it could have been an attempt to get as many people off the insomnia wagon. I had said that clidd could have put his partner in the conftown if clidd was mafia, that was the whole argument for it. I felt insomnia had shown pockety behavior towards me, and based on the interaction between him and Luca he was caught red handed.

At the time I had no reason to think it was not another team.

If I did I would not have had a reason other than a gut feeling. Was not a reason, which is why I never placed that vote on clidd.

I was also not 100% sure it was insomnia

and if I had chosen to switch to insomnia that would have made me seem like I was being opportunistic.

If Luca/Flippy was alive then the game would have been solved. Do you think I would kill Luca because I told you this?

I can tell you I had no idea that heighbors could be mafia, let me check the VC so I don't accidentally hammer you.

so you did think it was another team? then why didn't you unvote luca and vote clidd/insomnia/or hectic? Feels like you are trying to create justification for a shoddy voting progression.

UNVOTE:

Thank you for showing me the truth

Generally I'm ok with the neighbor/mason mixup but this unvote doesn't sit well with me

[dsjstr]

The entire day I was either on flippy or Not voting, I never once placed a vote on Luca

You don't like that I unvoted off of a mason claim?

[Karnage]

The entire day I was either on flippy or Not voting, I never once placed a vote on Luca

gotcha, I guess when you said not voting a mason claim I was thinking luca

You don't like that I unvoted off of a mason claim?

I didn't like when you unvoted ame.

[dsjstr]

Could you explain why you think that?

[clidd]

Im thinking.

What if Aaron was not framed by insomnia ?

I'm overthinking too much about how voracious Insomnia defended him. But, definitely, he would seem extremely suspicious with the argument against Luca, so even if Luca was lynched, Insomnia would be linked to Aaron the next day, so it would be quicker to conclude that the two were partners. This scenario would not make sense, considering the motivation of the deathtunnel was to distort possible reads about Aaron from then on.

It may be strange, but I would say that the latest

scum

, considering all my current impressions, would no longer point to

Dsj

, but to

AaronFrost

.

My intuition says that Aaron is scum, considering that the 4 of us engaged here today and he just disappeared 5 or 6 pages ago.

Still .. Ame being

scum

still doesn't get into my head. Aaron being AFK in this game in the last pages would agree with my theory of him being

scum

.

What I feel for Aaron is a departure from this second stage of the game, so I intuitively put him as a scum, if Dsj is town.

So your reasoning for Aaron!scum is a mixture of him being inactive recently, him being off the wagon, and intuition? Could you try and elaborate on your intuition or point to specifics?

Give me 24 hours.

[Karnage]

Could you explain why you think that?

I went back and re-read it with ame's ISO included and I wasn't getting an accurate feel for it.

When I originally read I took the "thanks for showing me the truth" as being sarcastic which is why I thought the unvote was weird. Looking back I don't think that's the case

[Hectic]

V/LA until 29th

[dsjstr]

Could you explain why you think that?

I went back and re-read it with ame's ISO included and I wasn't getting an accurate feel for it.

When I originally read I took the "thanks for showing me the truth" as being sarcastic which is why I thought the unvote was weird. Looking back I don't think that's the case

So me immediately revoting them doesn't mean anything?

[clidd]

Actualy..Forget it.. I'll create a new way of playing.

[clidd]

I have been wrong more often. Going to sheep this.

VOTE: Karnage

[dsjstr]

Karnage do you have any response to 1,542

Before I hammer you

[Karnage]

Karnage do you have any response to 1,542

Before I hammer you

revoting doesn't make a difference, in fact it makes the unvote even stranger.

[dsjstr]

Sounds like a bunch of BS to me tbh

VOTE: Karnage

[Pretentious]

Vote Count 3.04

So I’ll be on set with Keanu the next couple days.

Karnage

(3): Hectic, Clidd, Dsjstr ———

EXECUTED

Not Voting

(2): AaronFrost, Karnage

With 5 alive, it takes 3 to lynch.

Deadline

: (expired on 2020-03-06 14:00:00)

Mod Notes:

Don’t be outta pocket.

[Pretentious]

Karnage has been lynched! He was a

Vanilla Townie.

(expired on 2020-03-01 14:00:00) Night ends. Send in actions.

If everyone wishes to fast night, I will.

UPDATE: I have another overnight on set, and I’ll be sleeping at this time, so expect like an hour or 2 delay.