Mini Normal 2130: Mafia From Home [Game Over]

[NorwegianboyEE]

And even in a world where Battle Mage is scum with someone else and i am town. How does a fake guilty on Zantetsu benefit his team? I've already gone over why the probability of Battle Mage doing something like that is very low.
You know what is much more likely though? Zantetsu just being mafia.

[Looker]

wtf. You say you are a Simple Combined Neapolitan

doctor

, not a Simple Combined Neapolitan

cop

???????

Then why did Zantetsu crumb Una being a cop?

Zantetsu should claim. In fact i’m starting to wonder if a mass claim wouød be best at this point. Then we can do setup analyzis and find out who is the most believable.

Encourages a mass-claim, which is just scummy as fuck when someone has just claimed a guilty result. Only scum could benefit from a mass-claim at this point.

Agreed.

At what post did we pass this point? Because Luca asked me to claim.

I think Luca is probs town.

Same, which is why his vote on me is so irksome.

[Riabi]

UNVOTE: Looker
Still completely useless, IMO, but, without a doubt not the scummiest player today.

Currently, I'm flip flopping in my head about whether or not Norwe or Zan is the best lynch today. I think the case against Zan has been well stated, and doesn't need repeating here. Norwegian just seems too eager to move quickly today, and I wonder if that's not just scum finding a good (fake) case against a townie and trying to get a fast lynch going before it can be too closely examined. I look forward to hearing from Zan again, as well as the others who haven't posted today.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I think the case against Zan has been well stated, and doesn't need repeating here. Norwegian just seems too eager to move quickly today, and I wonder if that's not just scum finding a good (fake) case against a townie and trying to get a fast lynch going before it can be too closely examined.

The case has been well stated but i'm trying to move ahead too quickly? From my POV we've caught scum and had all the discussion in the world regarding it.

One curiousity regarding you, apparently if you believe Zantetsu is town then your natural next step is lynching me? Why? Battle Mage made the claim. Why would you lynch a suspected teammate over who would be from your POV, the actual scum?

[NorwegianboyEE]

Unless you're stating that Battle Mage/Zantetsu is TvT. Which makes no sense whatsoever.
It is completely illogical to consider Zantetsu/Norwegianboy the lynch choice.
The scum is in one of Zantetsu/Battle Mage.

[Looker]

UNVOTE: Looker
Still completely useless, IMO, but, without a doubt not the scummiest player today.

Currently, I'm flip flopping in my head about whether or not Norwe or Zan is the best lynch today. I think the case against Zan has been well stated, and doesn't need repeating here. Norwegian just seems too eager to move quickly today, and I wonder if that's not just scum finding a good (fake) case against a townie and trying to get a fast lynch going before it can be too closely examined. I look forward to hearing from Zan again, as well as the others who haven't posted today.

Why would you pit Norway vs Zantetsu as opposed to Zantetsu vs Battle Mage?

Yours truly,
Useless Player

[Riabi]

I think the case against Zan has been well stated, and doesn't need repeating here. Norwegian just seems too eager to move quickly today, and I wonder if that's not just scum finding a good (fake) case against a townie and trying to get a fast lynch going before it can be too closely examined.

The case has been well stated but i'm trying to move ahead too quickly? From my POV we've caught scum and had all the discussion in the world regarding it.

One curiousity regarding you, apparently if you believe Zantetsu is town then your natural next step is lynching me? Why? Battle Mage made the claim. Why would you lynch a suspected teammate over who would be from your POV, the actual scum?

I didn't say I believe Zan is town, at least, not in day 2. But, I'm also not certain he's scum, at least, not as certain as you seem to be.

And I guess that's what I'm getting at with my belief that you're going too fast. I'm not 100% certain he's scum, and we literally have not even heard from everyone in Day 2. Maybe there's something we're missing, maybe there's a counter claim from one of the slots that we've not heard from that could throw a wrench into everything. So, I don't understand why you're rushing so much under those circumstances. There's no need in my mind for town to not wait a few days and make sure we have all the info.

Currently, I'm flip flopping in my head about whether or not Norwe or Zan is the best lynch today. I think the case against Zan has been well stated, and doesn't need repeating here. Norwegian just seems too eager to move quickly today, and I wonder if that's not just scum finding a good (fake) case against a townie and trying to get a fast lynch going before it can be too closely examined. I look forward to hearing from Zan again, as well as the others who haven't posted today.

...
Why would you pit Norway vs Zantetsu as opposed to Zantetsu vs Battle Mage?

While I'm not saying this is the case, let's assume we're wrong about Zan for a moment. It's possible in that case that BM is still town and just making a bad read, and if that's what's going on, Norway's insistence that we lynch NOW is concerning to me.

[NorwegianboyEE]

While I'm not saying this is the case, let's assume we're wrong about Zan for a moment. It's possible in that case that BM is still town and just making a bad read, and if that's what's going on, Norway's insistence that we lynch NOW is concerning to me.

BM claimed PT cop. And a guilty on Zantetsu after investigating him on night 1.
How is that something you'd construct as: "could just be town making a bad read"?

[Zantetsu]

My gut-instinct was that scum might've been informed about a PT-cop?
Would explain why my then-assumed guilty on Luca was immediately responded to by a hood-claim and confirmation.

Exactly. The timing is just too cute. Neighbors revealed and BM immediately claims PT Cop and does so with a weak "now that this confusion with Una's situation has been cleared up" which is 100% false posturing.

I was hoping that maybe BM was just reaction testing but he's been given ample opportunity to come clean on that and has not. Another alternative is that he is town just claiming a fake role to get extra oomph behind his reads. He had me, profii, and Norwegian in his scum pool yesterday so that fits. Although why he would not be pulling this shit with Norwegian instead I can't say because I'm not inside his head. I have seen town players fake cop claims before. It never ends well, but they do it anyway. BM's attitude fits the bill on this - all the smileys which just shout to me "like me! pay attention to my posts! see my emotion!" which at first I read as some weak scum faking but could be genuine. Notice how his attitude has so drastically changed today. Players he was scum reading and whose intelligence he was quite frankly insulting (Norwegian) he's now all buddy buddy with and sending hearts to. He's shut up now and is just watching the game progress, probably with glee as he observes the confusion he's caused. I have definitely seen players whose ego directs their play like this before. And I explicitly stated that if he's not scum, he's dumb, and I can see that triggering a town player with such an ego to do something stupid.

This is the worst case scenario because it means that one of us will get lynched today, flip town, and the other very likely gets lynched tomorrow which sends the game to 4v3 LYLO with all or most town roles claimed which is very close to a scum win.

So BM if you're town who made a fake claim or who is still reaction testing you

have

to let us know

before

I get to L-1, preferably well before to avoid the chance that I get lynched and lead to the 4v3 I described.

If BM is scum then I can only say they must have a plan. Or alternately BM is just winging it, the ego I described above can go do stupid stuff as scum just as easily as it can as town. In this case my lynch today is not the worst thing because it is a 1 for 1 trade with scum which is fine for town. My biggest concern would be that knowing that this is not the most optimal play for scum means that they probably have a plan and sacrificing Battle Mage is in that plan. If the plan were to have BM claim tomorrow that he was town just making a fake claim then hopefully what I have said here cuts that avenue off.

[Zantetsu]

If Zantetsu and Luca Blight are scums then the most likely teammate is Egix96.

Why egix?

[Zantetsu]

Oh, I can come up with a LOT.
But I've made it a point here that whenever I'm a town-PR, I crumb early, make my claim later with the necessary quotes, and stick to it.
So no, I would never goof around with this as town, and scum!Una can play a lot better than you seem to think I could.

Do you mean, in this game, or on this site?

Are you saying you would never do that as scum? If not, why not? Why construct your meta to disadvantage your scum game?

[NorwegianboyEE]

If what Zantetsu is saying in post 983 is true then i don't know what to say. I'd be shocked by the poor play made by town here.

[Zantetsu]

I also hope that the rest can now see why I played around the profii-slot the way I did.
I had my gut-hunch, and a solid way of making SURE N1.

Yes I saw it. I read what you were doing exactly. That is why I posted what I posted. I was trying to get Norwegian to see it too but he was too dense. So I made up a fake theory about you being informed town and profii possibly being a role because:

- It was a way to give you town points without actually pointing a bulls eye at you any more than you already had - informed town is not a role with any power so it would not draw a scum kill to you like suggesting you had real power would
- It allowed approximately the same level of doubt or certainty about profii that you had already allowed with what you said about him. My theory put him at a power role but not necessarily scum or town.

And I crumbed that I actually thought you were "cop" (not actual cop specifically but some kind of investigative) because I thought it might be helpful later to be able to confirm that my theory was fake - how exactly, I do not know, but keeping the door open for it just seemed prudent - although to be honest probably more because of my own ego, I just like to be right and I like to be able to prove after the fact that I was right.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Battle Mage, is this true?

[Zantetsu]

Might be yea.
Would be interesting to see whether Zantetsu thinks Luca is a viable lynch, right?

In the crazy land where the mod did not make a mistake with your investigation result, and I had to choose a vote between Luca and you, I would vote for you. But I don't think it gets there because I think the explanation is mod error. I swear there's at least one mod error in every game I play, especially when super strange roles and combined roles are involved.

[Zantetsu]

Hence, I'm going to claim my target because the way things are, I'm going to be able to protect Norwegian tonight AND get us one more conf.town for the next days.

Yes, this is the reason you declare your target.

However I think it's unlikely that you survive to give us a result.

If town have a rolestopper of some kind, it should be obvious who to target at this point.

[Zantetsu]

But then it doesn't seem possible that town!Una actually is simple neopolitan who got a

+

Whoops ignore the last sentence of my last post, it was some garbage that I accidentally left in when writing my post.

Seems like a potential PT-slip from scum.

What's the slip? I don't get it.

There's no slip. Focusing on stupid trivia like someone accidentally leaving text in when editing a post is the kind of thing players who know they are advancing a false position and are looking for any justification they can find do.

[Zantetsu]

Although the level of cluelessness that Looker is cultivating in this game borders on the unbelievable.

[NorwegianboyEE]

@Zantetsu
What you're saying now sounds a whole lot better than what you've said initially. So i think it's time to take a step back and find out just what in the heck is going on in this game.
UNVOTE:

[Zantetsu]

And if you notice, Zant had shaded me a fair bit while making that conclusion, and he ‘defended’ Una more than he defended me.

I don't really feel like I did that, but OK. When you have to try to explain what seems like an impossible situation, it's hard not to say things that because they don't make sense, look like shading.

Una is clearly an experienced player. As is Luca. It is as impossible to believe that scum!Una would so oddly screw up a fake claim as it is to believe that scum!Luca would risk himself and another player on his team by claiming neighbors with him. When choosing between these two possibilities and mod error, I have to go with mod error. Especially given this mod, who never prods players despite that being in the rules (or if he does, doesn't announce it like I've seen every other mod do), who doesn't post vote counts with even the barest of frequency or regularity, and who doesn't answer questions in game to clarify game rules. It's not much of a stretch to conclude that this mod also wouldn't get night actions correct.

[Zantetsu]

You could say ‘why would Zant go through all that effort to protect Una D1’ - again, to look Town.

And it worked as I was Tr’ing him.

Norwegian, look back at Zant’s D1 protection of Una, and how much effort he put into it.

Why would he do that if Una is Town and he’s scum?

Why would he make a rational wall post about Una’s result?

To look Town.

Of course that's possible, but I have to say, if I'm scum and I think Una is a cop or investigative of any kind really, I keep my mouth shut and just kill him.

[NorwegianboyEE]

- Unclaimed -
Looker
Riabi
Churros
Zantetsu
Anotora

- Claimed -
NorwegianboyEE (Claims Vanilla Townie)
Luca Blight (Claims neighbor with 72offsuit)
72offsuit (Claims neighbor with Luca Blight)
Battle Mage (Claims quote: "PT cop" with N1 guilty on Zantetsu)
UnaBombaH (Claims "Simple Combined Neopolitan Doctor" with a "not Vanilla Townie" result on Luca Blight)
Egix96 (Claims Friendly Neighbor. Crumbed in first post.)

- Dead -
Profii

Vanilla Townie

Saudade

2-shot Jailkeeper

[Battle Mage]

I'm not quite sure what to say Zant...are you alleging I'm town fake-claiming to get you lynched?

Quite obviously not true, and no idea why Norweg bought it in 993...

[Battle Mage]

You could say ‘why would Zant go through all that effort to protect Una D1’ - again, to look Town.

And it worked as I was Tr’ing him.

Norwegian, look back at Zant’s D1 protection of Una, and how much effort he put into it.

Why would he do that if Una is Town and he’s scum?

Why would he make a rational wall post about Una’s result?

To look Town.

Of course that's possible, but I have to say, if I'm scum and I think Una is a cop or investigative of any kind really, I keep my mouth shut and just kill him.

This does raise a valid question, which is why did Zant-scum not kill Una last night if he actually believed he was a cop? It could be WIFOM for today of course, but not sure Zant would have expected to be on the chopping block today.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I'm not quite sure what to say Zant...are you alleging I'm town fake-claiming to get you lynched?

Quite obviously not true, and no idea why Norweg bought it in 993...

So what Zantetsu has been saying right now is all a fabrication to get off the hook?