Newbie 1996: GAME OVER

[3bounty]

HEM is extremely scummy but I'd rather go with higher odds wagon. We have the D1 info I think we should use it.

Your Yoooh vote is useless imo, he was not on the wagon and not even scummy. There is little reason to lynch Yoooh at all.

[Kirari Momobami]

tbh I think odds of hitting scum are higher off wagon than odd. If scum did a conventional 1/1 split then we have a 50% chance to hit off wagon and only a 25% chance on wagon.

#scummy maths

anyway the bottom line is I don't see why you think it will be easier to hit on wagon since I see no reason to think the day 1 wagon had 2 scum on it. It was a stale wagon and tbh if it was only town off wagon it probably would have been hammered even faster, scum are more likely to sit on their thumbs. Actually Yooh insisting that he was going to wallpost about stuff that wouldn't have necessarily changed the lynch is one reason I think he might be scum.

[Kirari Momobami]

I could vote VOTE: 1041

Wait that's wrong

VOTE: HEM, HE who wrote 1041

[3bounty]

Assuming a 1 on 1 off we def should vote off wagon. But that assumption is a leap.

[clidd]

I'm back.

[Kirari Momobami]

Assuming a 1 on 1 off we def should vote off wagon. But that assumption is a leap.

I think it's a leap to assume 2 on wagon tbh, I actually think that argument is legitimately a great reason to lynch Yooh since I don't see why HEM is obvious town from his POV

[Kirari Momobami]

I think I have an easier time believing 2 off wagon than 2 on wagon actually, that would explain why the day dragged so much

[3bounty]

I'm back.

What do you think about the alignments of Alo's wagon?

[clidd]

I'm kind of distracted from this game, to be honest. I need to find a time to focus here (I'm in other parallel games).

[Kirari Momobami]

What do you think about the alignments of Alo's wagon?

I mean I hammered because I townread the majority of the wagon

The only slots I'm really entertaining doubts on are clidd and Holden and both could easily be town

[Kirari Momobami]

I'm back.

not sure what the point of this post was then

[clidd]

I designed an analysis mentally, but in practice I was unable to perform it. When something is bothering/distracting me, my cognitive ability is reduced, so I prefer not to make assumptions/inferences without being mentally good.

[Kirari Momobami]

Aww feel better then :3

[LuckyLuciano]

Spoiler:

As the bolded part, this is should be an enough reason to hold your hammer if you're town.
First point, it is questionable for scum-Alo doesn't want to vote Bounty. It means Alo had reason why town-Bounty better than him.
Second point, if Monkey's posts are scummy, why didn't you straighten this up in day 1?
Third point, I don't get this, but I think you said town-Aloratom should recognize there was something wrong with scum-Monkey's post? This doesn't make sense at all.

I'm not buying that reason you're trying to save Monkey.

You're turning down town progress rather than trying to see Aloratom's flip here.

OK. Consider it this way
-I don't actually know Alora's alignment
-I don't actually know Monkey's alignment

Monkey is starting *a whole new thing* post-claim. If Monkey wants to push me, fine, but expecting that whole dispute to get resolved in 24 hours is not likely to actually be productive for the game when I don't *know* Alora is town. Until I *know* Alora's alignment, I can't evaluate whether Monkey is white knighting, choking on a scum wagon, saving a buddy, farming towncred, or simply wrong town.

As it was, I still had 3B and LL as town, Who as likely town, and Who had also expressed intent to hammer. *none of that was going away* It had had the entire dayphase to go away. As it was I was also already trying to decide of I had given Alora a pass too easily; the tone of his posts was +townie but as many people pointed out, it wasn't helping him solve the game.

And then, post-intent, he sheeps his *scumread* to start pushing the person who had given intent who had been basically the only person who had any point in the dayphase had been willing to give him a townread. It made *no sense* and it would be very distracting day 2.

For gamestate, Alora was easily the next best thing after a redflip, and continuing to drag out the day would only risk *outing more town power*. This is why blaming me for FPSing is *super dumb* when allowing town to consolidate on a mislynch is *meant* to deny scum more info. I still think Who was killed for being townread and he simply happened to be a tpr. But allowing the day to end at that point was pro town since I was not *confident* Monkey was actually scum.

Finally, if my thought is right that Monkey is town with bad reads, then there's the chance he is nightkilled if he stops scumreading me before end of day. Allowing *a little* unfinished business at the end of day 1 can be very pro-town because it gives scum less information about where reads actually are.

This is also why I'm a little suspicious of your push here. If you actually spent two hours writing up a long post, you probably could just... summarize what you said, why you wanted the thread to wait, and where you were at. Was what you posted going to change the lynch? Or was it to garner towncred? Given that I don't know your alignment, why should I allow you to delay a hammer when there is ultimately a chance that Aloratom flips scum? I know there's an argument from 'niceness' perhaps but we'd already suffered through three pages of LL spamming stuff that produced almost no conversation or actual new content. The thread did not need more bloat, it needed a flip, and while I appreciate that you might have put some more thought into your post, my hammer is going to hammer when I no longer see any productive argument changing the day's lynch.

At this point you need to really convince me that you had two hours worth of thoughts because you attempting to guilt trip a player in the game for a mod locking the thread after a TWELVE HOUR overdue hammer is making me have very little desire to find you town at the moment. That was a long enough intent that somehow the people complaining about the wait are now obliged to complain about the hammer... because Alora omgus'd me? Please.

I apologize for my absence, I am a bit under the weather. Hopefully in the next day or two I feel better and can contribute more. In the meantime, I was thinking a lot about Kirari's defense and wanted to come back to the post that really has been on my mind. Without going into too many details, and because I am about to get some more rest and don't plan on spending too much time elaborating, I think this post only ever comes from town. I'd wager the game on it. When I'm feeling better I will help find a better lynch.

[Yooh]

One of them is arguing PoE and the other is arguing scum agenda, they're very different thought processes

Don't see it. Tell me more how it is "arguing scum agenda".

With that in mind emphasizing how upset you are about your one lost wallpost while pushing me is... like very much consistent with how *a lot* of scum play this game
1) generate AtE about off-topic nonsense
2) sit on a town wagon
3) avoid blowback when it flips green because of 1

Now your last post was a bit better but I still think if you're town you kinda oversold it by saying it was "2 hours" when it almost certainly wasn't. If you said you spent 15 minutes on a post, I'd believe that

Yeah, not like you that never seen someone PoV, I see each every posts PoV every person itself. Oh look, it's nonsense but you still pushing it for nothing since yesterday when I told you it is non alignment indicative.
Nope this is not even answering my question why me-scum doing stupid AtE when you're doing it whole game.

Again, you said I'm avoiding blowback" when I have no reason to vote Aloratom. You didn't even try to see town-Yooh PoV that I'm entirely sure 2 mafias in the wagon.
Oh, let me put it more here

btw Yooh not noticing that post was directed at Monkey, not at Yooh, is +1 point cognitive load

So I'm scum because I'm not let my scumread talking behind my back about me. +1 for you too. You're not even consider my PoV at all. More like, you backed off immediately after I called this out.

suddenly wall-posting in response to my push

You asked for it? Not for real? So I need to ignore it?

Actually Yooh insisting that he was going to wallpost about stuff that wouldn't have necessarily changed the lynch is one reason I think he might be scum.

Again, you said you didn't believe it. I proved it. Now you think I'm lying and insisting I was insisted. ResidentSleeper

Does anyone really this slot as town, for real?
She started to scum-read me and seeing every posts of mine as scum motivated rather than try to see my PoV(Post #985) because I have highest scum read in her.

[Yooh]

I have a concern emerging now with Floof is from the day 1 eod reads post. He admits that he finds the voting logic of the wagon sketchy (all four people not having valid reasons to vote) which is great analysis day 2 since we know that Alo was town. However, he does not develop nor seems interested in pursing the others while pushing it to lynch Kirari. This is problematic to me as the singular focus of Floof's post seems designed to ensure the lynch on Kirari while leaving doors open to push the rest of the Alo wagon day 3 with what seems to be a focus on me somewhat more given how he cited mine earlier.

This may just be my expectations for town, but I would expect a town!floof to be questioning the rest of players and me about their reasons to vote day 1. He clearly is presenting it as something that irked him enough to try and create a WoT (wall of text) during day 1, yet now seems more content with sitting on the information instead of proactively inquiring about it. It makes sense why he voted Kirari eariler today, but doesn't explain why he isn't actively questioning the rest of the players about it while securing the lynch on her.

@Floof/Yooh: Who do you think is scum here alongside Kirari given your opinion on the alo wagon? Why did you only focus towards the end of the day rather than everyone's progression day 1?

As I said before about my post, the whole thing is better when Aloratom was with us. That is fair point but I believed when Aloratom with us, it will provide us better reasoning. It's not like I'm abandoning my read on Lucky in day 1. In my opinion, it is futile to seek out it in day 2 because you guys can answer with anything without clarify from Aloratom about why he did this and that.

Because I believe when it is near deadline, the stronger we can read people of the pressure the need to lynch. Most people's progression in day 1 is kinda null / town when the thread was very nicely and calm, I'm not sure about my read at all after that lynch. It is fair point that I was not active enough so she ignored my request to prolong the hammer. Oh well

To be honest, I don't want day 2 to end early also. But, after what happen to day 1, it is most likely we're not going to hammer early also. So, I have no regret on pushing early.

I rather to see more interactions, but based on interaction in D1 :
Bounty / Clidd is the most probable as her partner, Lucky on 2nd, Holden last. I don't like D2 interaction already when it is become fast wagon, because everyone seems scum-read her now.

Since you asked it? Care to explain your vote in Aloratom? Because i'm sure this one is... not going to provide anything this day. I mean, I know he suddenly jumped to Monkey, but then he didn't read Monkey as scum also. Even Monkey clarified that Aloratom was confused.

[Yooh]

I mean I hammered because I townread the majority of the wagon

I'm more inclined she hammered because she didn't want her wagon provide more info right now.

[Elmo TeH AzN]

Votecount 2.03

Kirari Momobami (2)

- Yooh, humaneatingmonkey,

Humaneatingmonkey (1)

- Kirari Momobami,

Not Voting (4)

- , 3Bounty, HoldenGolden, Clidd, LuckyLuciano

With 7 players alive it takes 4 votes to lynch.

Deadline is in (expired on 2020-04-26 09:10:00)

[3bounty]

I mean I hammered because I townread the majority of the wagon

I'm more inclined she hammered because she didn't want her wagon provide more info right now.

Would you have hammered Alo D1?

[Kirari Momobami]

Why are you "entirely sure"? Why would anyone assume you are seeing monkey as locktown from your pov?

[Kirari Momobami]

Odds of yooh being obvious naked scum vs. Yooh being totally off deep end here?

I'm leaning naked scum pretty heavily atm but I kinda would have expected other people to notice how scummy his progression is

[Yooh]

I'm leaning naked scum pretty heavily atm but I kinda would have expected other people to notice how scummy his progression is

PepeLaugh

This is basically you rewrite my thought of process in you with your own words.

Hey, I have proposal. See, I'm tired and exhausted with all of this. I like gambit and you said you like gambit. So let's gambling here cuz i'm sure you're mafia
Here I claim

I'm VT.

Next, you need to claim your role. So the scenario is
1. If you claim Tracker and no one counter-claim, lynch me today, you're next lynch tomorrow.
2. If you claim Town Friendly Neighbor, address who was your target yesterday, we lynch him today. If he is town, you lynch me tomorrow. If he is mafia, you're next lynch. If you fail to send, you're today lynch, me next lynch.
3. If you claim VT, we lynch you today, if you flip town, I'm next lynch tomorrow.

Why do I ask this? Cuz u like to baiting our town PRs and admitting want to fakeclaim cop today. This is no way VT play.
Why I suggest this? I'm tired. You're basically already lock-scum to me and you said I'm scum, but I have a feeling you're going to claim PRs because mafias know our setup, but town doesn't know the setup except the last PR.

Choose now. The rest player can debate this if want to this or not or how this work, I have no problem with self-voting.

[Yooh]

I mean I hammered because I townread the majority of the wagon

I'm more inclined she hammered because she didn't want her wagon provide more info right now.

Would you have hammered Alo D1?

No, I wouldn't.

I don't know what is your point here but I already said my problem is not the hammer's reason, but how the hammer is done.

[Yooh]

FOR EVERYONE PLEASE READ POST #1071 THANKS!

[HoldenGolden]

Floof consider the ramifications of your gambit for a second from the presepctive that kirari is actually scum here. Keep in mind mafia knows set up now.

1) kirari fake claims tracker and either knows their is no tracker, or baits the real tracker out getting good value out of the claim.
2) kirari can name anybody and you auto lynch them (which doesnt make sense) if they claim? How does their alignment matter at all? The friendly neighbor doesnt know the alignment of who receives the message. Basically, scumkirari gets a mislynch and possibly two if you follow your gambit and are town.
3) literally wont happen because scum!kirari gains more out of the other two options.

In the situation where you are both town, mafia gains even more set up knowledge and can narrow down the pool of the remaining prs depending on the set up we are in.

Your "gambit" is all risk as town with no actual payoff. Scum profit more since every situation leads to them gaining addtional mislynches then they otherwise would of gain. If you feel that certain about your read on kirari, then you dont have to convince them they are scum. You convince everyone else.