Mini Normal 2135 (Endgame)

[Red Panda]

That fact that you have to look at how the reads from the dead are to gain some traction on this game. Shows how dumb and possibly nearsided you can be. Why wouldn't she be killed for her town reads and only her scum reads? Or the fact that she's a good player.

[Tanner]

Okay. Please explain to em the hell does "killed for her townreads" actually mean.

[Red Panda]

You are telling me she was just killed because of her scum reads? That's what I need to know is we can have an actual conversation this game.

Do you really think 2-3 of the scum team are just lurking it thru and knowing they are going to be outted?

Persi and mavs are of the same alignment, they're de facto cleared Town

I don’t know if I’m tunneling too much onto Prana Devil but this is awkward. There’s no really reason to bring this up with the context of what he’s said in the rest of the post other than to slip this in there to play innocent “if I ask about day talk, it suggests I’m not scum or I’d know the answer.”

This doesn't equal that. You can not tell me in a good conscience that both are of the same side at this junction.
Hell even this post just doesn't say they are of the same alignment and not opposite ones.

It's not even the focus on me. It's you want to look at two people and ignore Prana and Mav...They could be on opposite sides.

[Tanner]

Ok, but what does that *mean*? "She was killed because of her townreads." Were her townreads correct? were they wrong? what does that mean that she was killed because of them?

I wrote Persi and mavs.

[Red Panda]

Simple question. Could she have been killed because her reads for town were right?

I know what you wrote. Im trying to think why she was killed honestly.

[Tanner]

And what is the so important distinction between "she was killed because her townread were correct" or "she was killed because her scumreads were correct"?

[Red Panda]

Do you think two scum are that bad where they have to lurk to get thru the game?

[Red Panda]

Knowing fully well they are going to get PoE'd for not having much content.

[Tanner]

They may be? How am I supposed to know. If you two are scum, then obviously yes.

[Red Panda]

Then who is the third?

Cause right now this tunnel is getting you no where. It's a good read but wrong place.

[Tanner]

Gun to head, one of Knightmare/Riabi/Prana, roughly in that order of confidence. I think a scumflip in either Panda/Luca would be ++town for both George and Una. But I'm not the one to confidently claim a full gamesolve on Day 2.

[Red Panda]

So using this Persi and Mavs are both town then and scum is me/luca/and one of Knightmare/Riabi/Prana
Asking so I understand.

And were giving Prana a pass as well as Mavs. Do you believe the Rolecop to be town sided then?

[Tanner]

Those are my current thoughts, yes. Also, I'm not giving Prana a "pass". I'm still trying to sort him. I currently believe you/Luca are more likely to be scum than him, though.

Yes. I was Townreading Persivul yesterday, I believe the claim. As I said before, (1) I don't see scum!Persi saving town!mavs like this, and (2) if mavs truly is Town, then Town

has

to have something that can confirm he's actually a Miller (like for example a Rolecop). Because of those two points, Persi and mavs have to be the same alignment. Most most likely Town. And again, if not Town, that will become obvious once other PRs start popping up elsewhere and both of those keep surviving the Night.

[Red Panda]

So put your vote where your mouth is.

[Tanner]

I'm voting Luca.

[PranaDevil]

And were giving Prana a pass as well as Mavs. Do you believe the Rolecop to be town sided then?

Tanner has brought this up before... but I am not the claimed rolecop, that would be Persivul.

Tanner never mentioned me, I'm not sure how you are confusing it.

[Red Panda]

And were giving Prana a pass as well as Mavs. Do you believe the Rolecop to be town sided then?

Tanner has brought this up before... but I am not the claimed rolecop, that would be Persivul.

Tanner never mentioned me, I'm not sure how you are confusing it.

It's late and what not so therefore I am a bit confused. Its been that kind of a morning none the less and I am sorry for mistaking the both of you but I believe isn't he giving you a pass non the less due to your perspective of what you asked on the last page?

[UnaBombaH]

I don't know maybe I'm going with my guy here. But I still feel this is scum
VOTE: UnabombaH

Something about them and their iso in day1 just didn't rub me the right way I can have more later.

I have seen worse scumclaims than this, but it has been a while.

[UnaBombaH]

Persi and mavs are of the same alignment, they're de facto cleared Town, and if (and that's a really really big if) they're scum, it will be obvious later once actual Town PRs start coming to light.

I just want to make this ABSOLUTELY CLEAR - this is not 100% true 100% of the time!!

Persivul could be a scum going for the towncred when mavs flips.
Them "clearing" mavs isn't as heavy a commitment for scum as some might imply.

When there are only Vanillas left, RoleCops do nothing, so if Persivul makes it through a 1-2 days more, we are put to that exact same WIFOM situation I've been hinting at.

[Tanner]

Persivul could be a scum going for the towncred when mavs flips.

Town having two Millers with no ways to confirm either one of them (i.e. - without something like a Rolecop) cannot be Normal as it basically gives scum 2 free mislynches.

Also, are you serious in saying Panda is scum, or...?

[PranaDevil]

Persivul could be a scum going for the towncred when mavs flips.

Town having two Millers with no ways to confirm either one of them (i.e. - without something like a Rolecop) cannot be Normal as it basically gives scum 2 free mislynches.

Also, are you serious in saying Panda is scum, or...?

This is very much true.

It's both one alignment or the other.

Either it's some weird day talk plan and mavs/Persivul agreed to work it like that together, and they're both scum, or they are both town.

I'm not convinced 100% either way. I see both sides, and I do worry I believe they're scum because of mavs tunnelling on me via blatantly twisting what I was saying even after it was clearly explained. I want to believe they are both town, as I don't feel scum would throw all of their eggs in one basket quite so early, but then I wonder why mavs is twisting my words so much, and so deliberately...

[Riabi]

Question to everyone... do we know if the scum have day talk?

Its not said but I would say they do. At least for now they do.

What do you base this on? Like, after it's established that the mod never said one way or another, you're either speculating based on nothing, or you have info that makes you suspicious....

I think a scumflip in either Panda/Luca would be ++town for both George and Una.

Can you walk me through this logic? I'm not following it.

Persivul could be a scum going for the towncred when mavs flips.

Town having two Millers with no ways to confirm either one of them (i.e. - without something like a Rolecop) cannot be Normal as it basically gives scum 2 free mislynches.

This still doesn't 100% clear Persivul. There could be a scum role cop and a town one, or some other kind of PR that can confirm them.
Look, I'm not saying that Persivul IS scum, but, let's not all talk like he's confirmed either.

[Tanner]

I think a scumflip in either Panda/Luca would be ++town for both George and Una.

Can you walk me through this logic? I'm not following it.

The way Salad has singled out Una/George, Panda keeps pushing Una, and the way Luca's been acting around those two slots too. Make me think s/s is unlikely there.

What do your reads look like right now? Or just thoughts on the game?

[UnaBombaH]

Town having two Millers with no ways to confirm either one of them (i.e. - without something like a Rolecop) cannot be Normal as it basically gives scum 2 free mislynches.

Well this is already quite a controversial situation to consider, if consulting the wiki...

The foremost use of Millers is to weaken the power of a Cop.

+

Less commonly, a Miller may be put into a game without a Cop, as a red herring.

+

Self-aware Millers may also be considered Named Townies, as there is usually not more than one in a setup.

So, considering two Millers and no cop would sort of be a double-bummer for town anyway.

[UnaBombaH]

This is very much true.

It's both one alignment or the other.

No. NO, NO NO.
Do not lock this as a fact for everyone.
If mavs is killed and flips Miller, Persivul is not town for that alone.
We have to focus on reading plays alone when it comes to these two slots.
And if they are unable to do a convincing enough towntell, we really need to defuse the situation sooner rather than too late.