Newbie 1996: GAME OVER

[Kirari Momobami]

I was making the point that from any POV, town or scum, it makes sense for 3b to unvote or to push his desired wagon, but if he does things that don't make sense but also put me at l1, then I am basically obligated to put him at l1 until he starts making sense again

[Kirari Momobami]

What if town wanting to win is the reason I am not lynched yet?

What if the main force demoralizing the town is your play?

[LuckyLuciano]

Why are you obligated to put 3b at L-1? You stated that players being at L-1 when a replacement is coming is bad for the town. Does another player not adhering to that suddenly make it good for the town for you to put them at L-1? I would think that if it's bad for the town either way, and you want the town to win, you would unvote independent of what 3b does.

[Elmo TeH AzN]

Votecount 2.09

Kirari Momobami (3)

- Yooh, 3bounty, LuckyLuciano

3bounty (3)

- humaneatingmonkey, Kirari Momobami, HoldenGolden

Not Voting (1)

- Clidd,

With 7 players alive it takes 4 votes to lynch.

Deadline is in (expired on 2020-04-26 09:10:00)

Correct The Day Timer is Stopped But the Game is not Stopped. If a lynch is achieved. A lynch will happen.

[3bounty]

I actually think we should hammer before the replacement, expecting someone to read 65 pages and form an accurate read is surely less than 50% reliable.

Clidd toss a coin and pick me or Kirari.

[LuckyLuciano]

Do we really think that scum is saying to 50/50 the lynch when they are one of the options?

[LuckyLuciano]

How somebody can argue that Kirari is TBTBAW and not apply that logic simultaneously to 3b is beyond my capacity to reason.

[Kirari Momobami]

I actually think we should hammer before the replacement, expecting someone to read 65 pages and form an accurate read is surely less than 50% reliable.

Clidd toss a coin and pick me or Kirari.

Some people do like replacing into games with content. I wouldn't make presumptions about how replacements will want to approach the game. Also hammering before replacement means an unusually long night which means pretty much everyone forgets what is going on in the game tbh

[Kirari Momobami]

Do we really think that scum is saying to 50/50 the lynch when they are one of the options?

I mean it's not a townie argument tbh, but I do still think both wagons here are usually on town so it's kinda dumb that he wants a hammer

[LuckyLuciano]

Tbh, this game is pretty dead. People stopped wanting to play days ago, that's why the game stalled. The best way to get players motivated is to just hammer and move on. The replacement having the ability to make reads knowing an additional flip

before

reading through the game is in itself valuable. Is it more valuable than them contributing today? I'm not sure. But it is certainly a unique benefit that shouldn't be completely ignored.

[Kirari Momobami]

I would say his play in the last 24 hours is the best argument for scum 3b, not town 3b, but I still don't get why he's playing into a really dumb gamestate

[Kirari Momobami]

Tbh, this game is pretty dead. People stopped wanting to play days ago, that's why the game stalled. The best way to get players motivated is to just hammer and move on. The replacement having the ability to make reads knowing an additional flip

before

reading through the game is in itself valuable. Is it more valuable than them contributing today? I'm not sure. But it is certainly a unique benefit that shouldn't be completely ignored.

I think the only player saying this rn is you, this could easily be the most dynamic and informative gamestate if people would start playing like it's a game again

[3bounty]

Wait wasnt it Clidd that argued that one of the wagons is definitely on a scum player? So why hasnt he hammered yet. He could just lynch the other the next day if he gets the 50/50 incorrect.

[LuckyLuciano]

You think the 3b wagon is on town, yet you want to put 3b at L-1. Honestly, I'm taking another break from this game. I may be replacing out as well. I just don't think I'm going to find enjoyment in this game again, and I'm pretty sure I'm going to be frustrated at endgame no matter what. Either you are town, claiming plays are bad for the town, and making them anyway, or you are mafia and town refuses to lynch you because you are

too obvious

. I'll probably decide in the morning if I want to keep playing, but tbh it feels like the game is dead and not many other players really want to play, and that's why the game has stalled.

pedit: Clidd is considering the ramifications of being wrong, and the chance that the alternative player is not lynched tomorrow.

[Kirari Momobami]

Yes, that's a great question to ask clidd when both wagons aren't still at l1

[Kirari Momobami]

Please do not speculate about whether you are or are not replacing as that is not something anyone else can comment on. If you're thinking about it you can discuss with the mod through pm

[clidd]

[Elmo TeH AzN]

Please As others said if you don't want to play don't put it in this thread. PM's exist for a reason.

[HoldenGolden]

Let me speak to you directly LL. I've tried to be civil about this, but quite frankly I'm tired of the shit show between both you and kirari. We are stopping this here and now.

People actually have been playing the game as me and cli2d have posted numerous content related discussions with HEM chirping in. Just because it is not all kirari doesnt me we "arent playing the game". Regardless of kiraris alignment, somebody else is scum.

You fail to realize time after time that our agurements for town kirari (at least mine) have nothing to do with being too bad to be scum and instead consist of analysis of the gamestate as different points of the day phase

So get off the high horse for a moment. You need to realize that your play so far is anti town in the sense you are constantly shrugging off the rest of the analysis in the game, downplaying others analysis, calling people bad, and talking shit about the gamestate while not actively trying to fix it. I've tried to cooperate somewhat with you, which you never responded to. Even if you are right and kirari is scum, you have successfully contributed to so much demotivating to the point where towns ability to sfum hunt is suffering. Guess what? I still want to play the game. Cli2d still wants to play the game. Monkey...well he is playing Dota but hey, he has at least posted some.

Mafia isnt a game about solving who scum is. It's working together so scum can actually be lynched. Your one sided view today is preventing that to such a degree that the one person who has agreed with most of your logic is also your town read (3b, and don't tell me that's not why hes up there since I can quote your ISO to prove it). Work with us, and we will work with you. Piss us off or demotivate us, and then we will just ignore you. That's how social games work. We are open to hearing your points, but we have our own ideas we want to propose as well.


Really consider this. I understand kiraris approach this game has been quite anti townie as well, but this whole bickering is only promating a gamestate for scum. Pull back. You dont have to change your read, stance, or nothing. Just work with people like me and everyone else. That's all I'm asking.

Kirari, this goes for you too. I know you are providing analysis on other players and conversing with us. For that, regardless of your alignment, I thank you. But you are the other party in this. If LL doesnt change, then dont humor him. I'm serious. Respond whatever you want content wise, but engaging with him tonally isnt helping matters either.

I've had a really shitty day today for reasons I'll spare the thread so idk what the hell I'm gonna to do now. I may sleep. I may read the game and finish my monkey analysis and take advantage of the time we have from the replacement. What I wont do is read more of you two fighting.

[HoldenGolden]

I think one is definitely Holden. With HEM/Kirari/Clidd as partner.

What happen with your scum read on Yooh?

I town read him. His one gambit post is scum, but the rest of his play is town. In his gambit post he bets the entire game on Kirari being red. So he must know for sure that she is red. I commented that only scum or town PR can know that.

So I guess my comment pointing out the obvious means I should push a Yoooh lynch right Holden? Lol.

No, who you are voting for makes sense and is of no concern right now.

My issue is with what you have said and backed up and still do back up here.

1071 comes from a scum POV unless he 100% knows Kirari is scum. Read it multiple times and in no way does it benefit town if he is VT with uncertainty. So either he is some sort of PR with info on Kirari or he is scum.

Holden also has a perfect scum spot on the Alo wagon.

Are you going to answer my question of who is my partner or are you going to keep throwing shade at me to discredit my case?

Because countermeasure: off wagon for scum is just as good as on wagon.

Will have to take look a bit later. But you def seem more than capable of bussing or distancing so not sure "who is my partner" really means anything to what I am reading of your alignment right now.

I saw this after I post. I will take that praise even if it is wrong this game.

HEM was the person I was looking for you to say since eariler you said kirari and me didnt make sense and you had the scum read on him eariler. When you feel like it, feel free to read my ISO and do that case if you see it still.

What is your stance on cli2d and floof? I ask the later given you said 1071 (I think) never comes from town POV.

Do you think kirari can be town here despite you thinking scum was fishing for pr roles day 2?

Yes I think Kirari can be town and the PR stuff were memes. But if she turns out to be scum I won't be surprised. Clidd I can't really get a read on him he seems distant and not focused which makes it NAI to me. Yoooh's gambit only comes from scum unless he is ONE HUNDRED PERCENT sure of Kirari's alignment which I don't see how that can be. But his other posts give townie vibes.

You know that Yooh cannot be a PR since you believe LL's claim due to your read on me. Therefore, by your own admission, yooh should be left as scum. We agree on this. I guess my question is can you provide those posts that spark him being town in your eyes despite 1071? I had bits and pieces of your read on Yooh in the past, but that hasn't come up much post 1071.

I do know that I would like my question answer 3b.

[clidd]

I appreciate your speech, Holden. I agree that the game has not been very pleasant since this discussion between the two started, but I believe that one step at a time, calmly, we will be able to resume the pace of D1.

[clidd]

If I notice that the game will actually become healthier to play with Kirari's lynch, I will not hesitate. But at the moment, I would also like to wait to at least see who will take over Yooh's slot.

[Kirari Momobami]

You're town irl holden, want you to know that

I kinda planned to just take a break from the game after the wagons went to l2 until the replacement came in and 3b saying no to that kinda just blows me away

Like his defense of L-1ing me is 'potato play sheep the town lynch something' but with the replacement on my wagon and not his all keeping us both at l1 is increase the likelihood he gets lynched... Why does he play into his own mislynch as town?

[HoldenGolden]

I appreciate your speech, Holden. I agree that the game has not been very pleasant since this discussion between the two started, but I believe that one step at a time, calmly, we will be able to resume the pace of D1.

I agree, and think we have started moving towards a better space. However, it requires a direct statement for that to happen. I've been trying to calmly cool it for awhile passively, but feel now is the time for a more active disfussion

To both LL and Hirari, I hold no ill regards about what has happen. I understand mafia can be stressful, especially when people do not see your PoV. I simply want to let begones be begones and move on.

[HoldenGolden]

You're town irl holden, want you to know that

I kinda planned to just take a break from the game after the wagons went to l2 until the replacement came in and 3b saying no to that kinda just blows me away

Like his defense of L-1ing me is 'potato play sheep the town lynch something' but with the replacement on my wagon and not his all keeping us both at l1 is increase the likelihood he gets lynched... Why does he play into his own mislynch as town?

I have thought about that since skimming in the thread that his rush for cli2d to hammer is because yooh vote is on your wagon.

My issue is just how readily though he is willing to move his wagon. I'm on my phone, so quoting a bunch of posts is hard, but I've noticed and have called out how wide is scum pool is yet how unfocused he is at narrowing down that pool by analyzing. It's fine he has a big pool, but I would think town!3b would try to iron out who exactly is the last scum. He hasn't really done this, or if he has, not provided the analysis for it.

It fits the narrative that you are town and 3b is scum trying to set up for a day 3 ml by leaving his pool wide enough to go onto who is needed to win the game (hem or me). Do you see that as well? Or is it just me?