Mini Normal 2135 (Endgame)

[Tanner]

Yeah, you're gonna need to give me more than "i slept on it". I reread half the game yesterday, I've brought up questions in 1441 and 1444 about Una's associates. IF you wanna talk about scum!Una, I expect some sorta discussion there?

[Persivul]

UNVOTE: prana Still wanna lynch this, just don't want phase to end yet and I'm not sure what the VC is.

[Persivul]

Prana puppy is my guess too

VOTE: PranaDevil

This was an L-1 and wasn't announced.

[UnaBombaH]

Prana puppy is my guess too

VOTE: PranaDevil

This was an L-1 and wasn't announced.

Just got back and noticed this too.
George just keeps on giving.

[UnaBombaH]

On the other hand, I mean, Prana should be the lynch today for all I care.

[Persivul]

I want a record of all the D3 votes.

772 - prana votes knight
773 - pers votes prana
780 - mavs votes riabi
781 - prana votes pers
782 - tanner votes popo
783 - popo votes pers
839 - mavs unvotes
848 - knight votes prana
853 - mavs votes popo
857 - george votes popo
866 - ruby votes george
876 - pers votes popo,

popo at L-1

892 - popo fake claims tracker
893 - george unvotes
900 - knight votes pers
901 - george votes pers,

pers at L-1

905 - knight unvotes pers
908 - mavs unvotes popo
935 - Tanner unvotes
986 - tanner votes popo
1002 - mavs votes pers

pers back to L-1

1031 - george unvotes pers
1033 - pers unvotes popo
1058 - george votes popo
1111 - pers votes popo
1127 - george unvotes popo
1201 - george votes popo
1211 - george unvotes popo
1222 - knight votes popo
1260 - Una votes pers

puts pers back to L-1

1279 - una unvotes pers

both wagons at L-2

1304 - george votes popo

popo at L-1

1307 - prana votes popo

lynch

[Persivul]

George looks better to me looking at that vote record.

[Not Known 15]

Vote Count 4.2

CantLynchAPuppy

Ruby Red

Riabi

(0)

GeorgeBailey (0)

UnaBombaH (0)

PranaDevil (2)Knightmare491;GeorgeBailey;

Knightmare491 (1)PranaDevil;

Persivul (0)

Tanner (0)

NoLynch(0)

Not Voting(5):UnaBombaH;CantLynchAPuppy;Tanner;Persivul;

With 7 alive it is 4 to lynch.

Day 4 ends in (expired on 2020-05-21 10:59:00) or when a lynch has been achieved.

[Tanner]

Persi can we talk about your thoughts on Una?

[UnaBombaH]

George looks better to me looking at that vote record.

Really? To me it looks exactly like a scum without a daytalk, considering whether to bus or not.
Also something to consider - when I put you at L-1, both George and Prana were already on you.
Meaning that even if scum would've wanted to hammer you there, they couldn't do it.
I guess they both realized that, and once George wandered onto popopo once, Prana took the leap.

[UnaBombaH]

Persi can we talk about your thoughts on Una?

Can we all just talk about what about me you'd consider scummy, or what are the scum-pairings you can see?
If you can see me as scum with anyone else than Prana, I'd suggest you lynch me today to remove the doubt.
If it's only WITH Prana, I'm advocating that lynch today anyway, and if we hit red there, yet again, to remove the doubt.
My solve is still Prana->George, and there's honestly very little sense in a solve with neither of them as scum.

[Persivul]

Persi can we talk about your thoughts on Una?

Sure. Like I said, I don't like having a hard null on someone at this stage of the game. Una posts a lot of words but manages to not accomplish much with them.

Your thoughts?

[Tanner]

Ok. I've already said that I think Una/Luca aren't S/S, but I would really appreciate if someone would actually discuss that with me.

I think Prana is today's lynch. I don't think George is scum, still. I already said why I think popo fakes a Track on a Townie rather than his scumbuddy.

Talking Prana/George scumteam, I don't think I see that team making 1209. As I said at the time, it felt to me like guilty tripping George into voting Persi while also setting him up as a popo buddy. It felt like Prana knew George was Town there.

I don't see George as scum regardless of that either.

I guess my "current solve" is Prana > Puppy > Knight but I wanna have some sorta certainty on Una but everyone keeps ignoring my attempts to talk about that lmao

pedit: Persi you said you've played with Una before?

[Persivul]

Ok. I've already said that I think Una/Luca aren't S/S, but I would really appreciate if someone would actually discuss that with me.

Just read their double ISO. I don't see that they can't be scum together. The interactions are weak and don't result in real pushes.

[GeorgeBailey]

when I put you at L-1, both George and Prana were already on you.
Meaning that even if scum would've wanted to hammer you there, they couldn't do it.

Or, the inactive slot didn't hammer? To suggest the entire scum team was on Persi without hammer seems too desperate.

[Knightmare491]

Day 1 VC

Spoiler:

Drew-Sta

(7)

Persivul;mavsfan41

;Knightmare491;Riabi;

farside22

;GeorgeBailey;UnaBombaH;

UnaBombaH (1)

Drew-Sta

;

PranaDevil (1)

Luca Blight

;

Knightmare491 (1) Tanner;

Persivul (1) PranaDevil;

Not Voting(2):

Red Panda;Wake88

;

[CantHateAPuppy]

Ok, i read about 10 pages of d1 and found enough things to talk about that i'll go back for the rest later

admit i looked at this with an eye to "we had two town millers so scum was probably coasting on the easy lynch". when easy / policy lynches happen i almmost always find at least one scum pushing the case hard as a way to look town by being genuiine about something

Stiill really liking Tanner, not going to walk through all of it but i think all these posts showed a progression that was trying to solve rather than just tunnel in on lynching millers:

Drew, you're claiming Miller?

I fully expect to be dead by day one. I do, however, intend to make sure my remaining time here is as profitable as possible.

So, if the lot of you would lay down your votes off me, we can hopefully gain additional insight on someone else, in the knowledge we have two definitive townies running around, which means there's only 11 left to scrutinise.

I would also encourage the town cop to investigate someone else, not me.

Isn't it a bit odd to say that you "fully expect to be dead by day one", but then ask for people to remove their votes as you're one of the "definitive townies"?

...how is a Miller claim a more obvious mafia kill than a literal mod-confirmed Innocent Child?

I like your analysis, however it assumes that scum!Drew had the Miller claim ready from the start. Which

could

be the case, but we can't know for certain. If he saw votes building up on him, it's possible he thought of the claim as a way to escape the votes or if a scummate told him to (provided scum has an Encryptor).

And of course, it all assumes Drew flips scum, and while it is my current bet, I wouldn't call it a 100% certainty.

I think at the moment I mostly agree with your list. Other than what I've already said about Knightmare (wasn't pushing Drew until the cc), I'm suspocious of him for somewhat unrelated reasons.

...am ...am I seriously the only person here that knows what a reaction test is? After it has been laid out as such?7

pedit: Knightmare, I'm not talking about your inactivity as a whole (you'll notice I haven't pushed Luca or Riabi who have been the most inactive so far - Riabi up to recently at least.) It's the fact your posts are empty air when you *do* post them.

VOTE: Drew

I mean it would have probably been better if had let him interact with more people and claim later in the day so that we can catch the other scums as well. But oh well

really don't like this, it's like knightmare was just happy to pounce on a miller claim, all while "complaining" about "we didn't let him interact enough"

especially don't like it in combination with this post:

OK, so what are all the claimed roles so far please?

Drew-sta claimed Miller

when he was under some pressure.

Mavs later CCed him.

keep seeing the d1 claim that drew was under some pressure and that's why his miller claim was so suspicious

but honestly it didn't look like that much pressure to me, i don't really get this characterization at all. is this just my hindsight speaking? the idea that drew was "under pressure" and that's why he claimed and that's why he had to be lynched -- the "under pressure" seems like an important part of why drew got lynched, i don't think it was true.

@Prana Devil: with a counter-claim, that means at least one is scum right? If I were scum and fake claiming Drew’s miller claim, that would effectively be trading one scum for the miller (drew flips miller and I’m lynched as a liar day 2). That’s such a horrible deal for scum and why would I fake claim a miller to force a mislynch of a miller? Drew fake claimed miller cause he thought he could get away with it. Or else he should just fake claim cop/nurse as a last resort. That way a counterclaim outs the cop/nurse. And he’s trading one scum for a townie power role. But to think scum!Mavs would fake counterclaim a miller to force a mislynch of miller!Drew is ludicrous.

That's pretty much what I said.

Drew is saying there's two millers, and trying to suggest that means there is "3 townies" but... that only works if we assume double miller is a good setup, and I'm not so sure I buy that. It weakens town massively.

I will say though, if we have any millers at all, that means we must have a cop of some description, which means we should try not to announce to many "confirmed" town... mainly because on the off chance we did have two millers, well... scum have 3 town players they can avoid shooting if they're wanting to hit a cop.

That being said... and this may be a ludicrous idea, but it's in my head and I'd rather post it for others to chime in on. What if we don't have ANY millers? What if it's a double bluff from scum? We lynch one of them, the other coasts to victory under a "confirmed town" heading.

This is another post leaning me toward prana being town. i don't think scum would be throwing the breaks on a miller mislynch, i think scum would have had a much easier time believing two miller claims than prana does here

VOTE: Tanner <---- this right is far more likely to yield a scumflip.

Una, again you just keep picking fights with people who are on your side. i just don't get this, u want to lynch miller and lynch tanner? tanner was the one poster who actually had some decent pump breaks on just speed lynching the miller cc's

i know this is the exact opposite reason i just sussed knight for, not being aggressive enough on the miller lynch, but i just genuinely don't see what's town about picking all these different fights

Honestly I almost think George is Town for his spectacularly shitty defense of Drew if Drew ends up flipping red. Bussing as fast as possible is more in line of what I'd expect of his partners.

Prana, are you intentionally pushing the """contradiction"""?

Though I'll concede I'm also curious why Una finds me suspicious.

tanner what do you think of this early take now that drew flipped town? i like most of ur takes, but early it seems like you're saying george is town if drew is scum, and now that drew is town u still seem to be thinking george is town. i don't understand ur progression here

[CantHateAPuppy]

I guess my "current solve" is Prana > Puppy > Knight but I wanna have some sorta certainty on Una but everyone keeps ignoring my attempts to talk about that lmao

Let's talk about una! I have been trying to talk about una all day! (!!!)

[UnaBombaH]

when I put you at L-1, both George and Prana were already on you.
Meaning that even if scum would've wanted to hammer you there, they couldn't do it.

Or, the inactive slot didn't hammer? To suggest the entire scum team was on Persi without hammer seems too desperate.

No idea how you manage to mix any desperation there.
Also my point here was to simply show that George+Prana voting patterns and the last minute switch all make sense if the scumteam doesn't have a daytalk.

[GeorgeBailey]

VOTE: Prana

Devil be gone!

It was an RVS vote he never changed.

[Knightmare491]

Day 2 VC

Spoiler:

Knightmare491 (2) GeorgeBailey;PranaDevil;

Red Panda

(6)Tanner;

Persivul

;

popopopopopopo

;

Eve

;

mavsfan41

;Knightmare491;

Tanner (1)

Red Panda

;

Not Voting (2): Riabi;UnaBombaH;

[Persivul]

George looks better to me looking at that vote record.

Really? To me it looks exactly like a scum without a daytalk, considering whether to bus or not.

Doesn't look like that to me. mavs joining my wagon at 1002 was a probably unexpected boon to scum. No one was going to take much blame for lynching me, because to be fair popo did set it up well. I don't see scum!george unvoting there in 1031.

Also something to consider -

when I put you at L-1, both George and Prana were already on you

.
Meaning that even if scum would've wanted to hammer you there, they couldn't do it.
I guess they both realized that, and once George wandered onto popopo once, Prana took the leap.

No. George unvoted in 1211. He had no vote up when you put me at L-1 in 1260. You knew that, and even called george out to vote me:

VOTE: Persivul -

I hope George does the right thing for town and makes sure we at least get a lynch.

[GeorgeBailey]

No idea how you manage to mix any desperation there.

Desperate for the scum team. Usually the entire team doesn't pile down on a mislynch. It outs a lot of people, epecially when it's a 1-shot PR.

[Persivul]

when I put you at L-1, both George and Prana were already on you.
Meaning that even if scum would've wanted to hammer you there, they couldn't do it.

Or, the inactive slot didn't hammer? To suggest the entire scum team was on Persi without hammer seems too desperate.

Seer above. You weren't on me when una voted me.

[CantHateAPuppy]

Hi Persi!

Since u're on -- what do u make of una holding his vote on d3?