Jigsaw's Revenge - Game Over

[SirCakez]

Design Topic: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=82561
Mod Topic: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=82770
Dead Chat: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=82771
Scum Chat: Will Be Released in 24 hours

Police Chat: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=82774
FBI Chat: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=82776
Jigsaw Survivors Chat: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=82775

Cyanide Box: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=82890
Table Trap: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=82892
Shotgun Collar: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=82891

Water Cube: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=82918
Ice Blocks: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=82917
Blade Box: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=82919

Cycle Trap: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=83060
Electric Bathtub: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=83061

[SirCakez]

As for my thoughts - there has been a good amount said over whether this setup was scumsided or not. Farside is convinced that it was, while some others think it was ok. I personally think that it was somewhat scumsided, but definitely incredibly swingy. I would have made a few changes in retrospect, like reducing number of scum traps earlier than day 6 and changing the Jigsaw role so that it couldn't be used to kill two people outright like it did in the Electric Bathtub. This could have gone to town had farside held her shot on pisskop night 2 or if guilties had been gotten. My main focus while designing was the traps mechanic and to make something that really fit the flavor of Saw while turning the nightkill mechanic upside down. In that regard, I think this game was a success, with feedback I have gotten. As a mafia game? There were definitely some kinks. Either way I hope you guys join me for more games in the future. I hope to create more setups like this and my The Thing game where mechanics are flavorful and turned upside down.

However, I also think town did not play particularly well here. I know some of you are very frustrated with certain players in this game, and that there is gonna be some discussion over how this game was played. While that is fine, please refrain from personal insults.

I'm sure I'll have more to say soon.

Thanks for playing everyone!

[Firebringer]

thanks for modding cakez,

really interesting setup.
i have to agree that this setup is scumsided.

i love the trap ideas u put in it though.

[pisskop]

The design was a lot of fun. Would be interested in something similar in the future.

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I have some thoughts that I'll put here later, but the replace out was for mental reasons

sorry

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I liked the scumteam I got rolled with though, I'd play with the same group again.

[Albert B. Rampage]

The real MVP of this game is SirCakez, it is an amazing setup and I was lucky to have signed up for this game. GG everyone!

That said, I had the lamest VT role in the game, I had the worst hood in the game, I participated in zero games and overall did not have fun.

Titus I enjoyed watching you insult me in the thread, you can take as many shots at me as you want when you replace me so I don't go crazy in-thread. Thank you for doing that, sincerely.

BM ruined the game for me and many town players in the dead thread from what I read.

It was interesting to see Titus v BM because Titus got a microdose of what she does to me every game we've played as TvT.

Scum did a good job with their night actions and we were powerless to counteract their strategies.

[pisskop]

ABR, you were the scariest player. Day 1 I was weighing out just how long I had before you turned on me.

[pisskop]

In fact, with each replacement I got more and more antsy, because each one brought more to the table.

[Morning Tweet]

This setup is awesome Cakes! I absolutely love the flavour and the mechanics.

[SirCakez]

I definitely wanted more different people to get put in the Games. It was a difficult design choice because I couldn't just say someone can't get put in a game twice, because then scum lose way too much control over killing power.

[Firebringer]

The real MVP of this game is SirCakez

real town mvp was morningtweet. She had us all dead to rights.

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I definitely wanted more different people to get put in the Games. It was a difficult design choice because I couldn't just say someone can't get put in a game twice, because then scum lose way too much control over killing power.

the problem with this is that the way the setup is designed, the scumteam need to get value out of the games due to the lack of a factional nightkill

and the inherent value you get from putting yourself into a game as scum is to get whatever power comes from not choosing to die, but that's not really very useful when the result is public anyways

[Alyssa The Lamb]

The real MVP of this game is SirCakez

real town mvp was morningtweet. She had us all dead to rights.

MT was town's best player, agreed

[Albert B. Rampage]

ABR, you were the scariest player. Day 1 I was weighing out just how long I had before you turned on me.

Thanks dude. My plan was to kill Blake d2.

And I think Titus made the best out of our slot given the circumstances. If I knew we were THAT close to the game ending I could've stuck it out a bit more, but the prospect of BM doing his thing for another week or two really turned me off. I had already been checked out mentally since BM led a lynch on xtoxm and fakeclaimed BP day 2 and killing the IC and all the other anti-town things he did before even starting his infernal death tunnel on me. It was not possible to enjoy the game given what he had done.

I treated him as conftown after Day 1 and he continually found new ways to baffle and disappoint. I wish to never play with that kind of player again.

[Albert B. Rampage]

The real MVP of this game is SirCakez

real town mvp was morningtweet. She had us all dead to rights.

MT was town's best player, agreed

MT was poised, patient, smart. My mafia wife <3

[Morning Tweet]

thanks guys..

MT was poised, patient, smart. My mafia wife <3

<3

[BBmolla]

Well modded, day 1 was fun, I’m sure this game was fun for Mafia

Sorry town

[SirCakez]

I also agree MT was the best town player, if not the best player in the game period! Good work MT, you have many bright things ahead!

I definitely wanted more different people to get put in the Games. It was a difficult design choice because I couldn't just say someone can't get put in a game twice, because then scum lose way too much control over killing power.

the problem with this is that the way the setup is designed, the scumteam need to get value out of the games due to the lack of a factional nightkill

and the inherent value you get from putting yourself into a game as scum is to get whatever power comes from not choosing to die, but that's not really very useful when the result is public anyways

If you read the mod topic it will explain why I decided to make the Games public. I did not want the game to turn into scum putting themselves into traps to get tons of buffs, I wanted the traps to get used on town.

[BBmolla]

Like we lost after three nights in a large

Whack

[davesaz]

So it turns out the effort I put into making that vote appear reasonable was unnecessary. Oh well, it was good practice in any case.
Great synergy on the scumteam. We wanted to change targets last night but the traps had to be submitted before the hammer.
Bad luck in iDany/Bingle investigations was a big part of the outcome. Though one guilty inside the police hood probably would have shielded the other scum there.
Hitting an additional trap immune / key / whatever would have dragged it out too.

I think a lot of town had good individual reads and instincts, and we had to play them against each other just enough to not end up on the bottom of the readlists of a majority.

[pisskop]

Subject: Jigsaw's Revenge - The Electric Bathtub

I could see bingle as scum.

Honestly, bm strikes me as completely overconfident. Lately its been this irritating willingness to lynch anything with two legs, but do you really think that level of commitment comes from scum?

I bet he'd be willing to put his own pride above the game's well being and give scum extra powers to have a chance at pushing his beliefs.

[SirCakez]

I also know some people were frustrated with their roles. I struggled with that because town already had a LOT of power as was. Some people had to get the less-useful Mailman/Reporter/Vanilla neighbor roles.
Also apparently Neighbor is not considered a Power Role in Role Madness? I had no idea. That's why I stepped in when I did.

[Firebringer]

Like we lost after three nights in a large

Whack

yeah the game wasn't very forgiving.

[SirCakez]

Up until day 4 scum were worried about getting decimated themselves. Like I said in my earlier post, all it would have taken was farside's shot to hit pisskop or a guilty and the game would have blown open for town. Unforgiving yes, but both ways.