Newbie 2004: Trash Panada Hour. Redux! GAME OVER

[Tuxedo Mask]

Yes, I can, what's your point? You agreed to what Fish laid out. And still haven't said why Freddie flipping scum wouldn't STILL make Vota scum.

[Tuxedo Mask]

Fish why are you just coaching his play right now?

[Formerfish]

You said to Fish with your words, that "only scum Votato" would be that sure of a read on Freddie. Does that not make them scum regardless of Freddie's alignment? Why would Freddie being scum make Vota assuredness town?

do you know how to read?

These responses need to stop.

If one of us isn't getting your point it's either A. Not clear, or B. They are doing it on purpose.

You need to figure out which one and stop clapping back with personal insults. You say you aren't attacking the player, but the slot, but you aren't doing that, you're just saying that.

[Formerfish]

Fish why are you just coaching his play right now?

I'm not.

And if I were scum with him why would I be doing it here and not in the scum PT?

[Tuxedo Mask]

Fish why are you just coaching his play right now?

I'm not.

And if I were scum with him why would I be doing it here and not in the scum PT?

It really sounds like you are. You're carefully laying out how Osuka can conduct themselves in a better more productive way. I don't think you've talked to any of the new players like this, so it's really weird that you're doing it for an experienced one. Like, I'm not sure what you're trying to accomplish here? As for scum PT, I don't know, it's all Wifom.

[gibus]

if freddie flips town, however remote that possibility, votato should be powerlynched the following day barring only the literal apocalypse

Two more mislynches means scum victory.

1) You're still tunnelling Fred's slot. You should know that is bad if you're town.
2) If Fred does flip town, you are pushing another potential mislynch without proper reasoning, which is really bad for town.

[Formerfish]

Fish why are you just coaching his play right now?

I'm not.

And if I were scum with him why would I be doing it here and not in the scum PT?

It really sounds like you are. You're carefully laying out how Osuka can conduct themselves in a better more productive way. I don't think you've talked to any of the new players like this, so it's really weird that you're doing it for an experienced one. Like, I'm not sure what you're trying to accomplish here? As for scum PT, I don't know, it's all Wifom.

I dont have a scum read on that slot, and I'm trying to work with them since if they are town we are on the same side and this is a semi cooperative game.

I mean, it's almost like there is some reason I might be willing to work with that slot... Weird.

[Formerfish]

if freddie flips town, however remote that possibility, votato should be powerlynched the following day barring only the literal apocalypse

Two more mislynches means scum victory.

In a vacuum, yes.

If we lynch scum it's a whole new world.

[Nauci]

Well I understand the logic, I'd rather lynch Votato for being scummy and not to sort Freddie. If Votato flips town I really don't like where that would leave us.

Even if Freddie flips town I think it would leave us in a better game state, then if we lynch Votato and they flip town.

Okay, totally wild idea time:

Instead of frivolously speculating the implications of a Freddie/votato flip on Freddie/votato, how about this:

@votato: can you link some concrete examples of Freddie having similar behavior in her town game compared to this? What personal signals are telling you she's town? Why do you have Formerfish as potential scum when so many people believe otherwise? As of right now I feel like you've post "Freddie is town" like 8x and all that has done is affect people's reads of you.

@Formerfish: Do you still believe in your theory that Freddie was coached to claim VT? What did you think of Gibus's take on that? If you do still believe that, who do you think would have told Freddie to do that?

@osuka: what do you think of my theory (firm belief?) that tux cannot possibly be scum with Freddie because of their real time D1 interactions? Do you have an independent townread on that slot, ignoring this dynamic? Because CopyKat made extremely egregious posts that smelled extremely strongly of newbscum on Day 1 and I feel like you didn't comment on those while going ham on Freddie. Also, can you comment on Gibus?

Speaking of reads of votato changing ..

@Lilith how have the last several pages impacted your votato read?

P.S. if we're speculating on flips, I think Freddie gives us info on tuxedo, osuka, and votato if we flip there

I'll ISO Tux, Freddie, and Formerfish on Monday + Tuesday and give long winded analysis because my gut read on CopyKat was so strong on D1 that I'm still not willing to let go of it

[Formerfish]

@Formerfish: Do you still believe in your theory that Freddie was coached to claim VT? What did you think of Gibus's take on that? If you do still believe that, who do you think would have told Freddie to do that?

Yes. I have no reason to believe his beliefs over my own without evidence to say otherwise. Anyone. Literally anyone would have told him to claim in that time. It's the only thing that makes sense in the way that it happened.

Freddie for sure would have seen the numerous posts expounding on the multiple reasons not to claim, most of which was SOMEONE WAS ALREADY LYNCHED.

I refuse to believe a townie who very much wants to do good as a newbie is going to miss events that huge to create a situation that baffles the mind.

Additional shout out to Vota for trying to say I was role fishing in that whole thing and attempting to give Freddie a reasonable out by blaming me for their shit play. Koudos for that one. Must be your crazy previously unmentioned past and possible irl relationship with Freddie, that is an odd thing to hide, especially when we've talked about meta a butt load in this thread so far.

[Formerfish]

so nauci, what happened? you had me convinced his slot was scum. i was really surprised by the result; bass' game/behavior may have been an anomaly.

This quote kinda takes on a different light when you look at how Vota was trying to deflect blame from Freddie to me. Freddie is doing that himself here by throwing it back to Nauci and blamed her for his sheep vote being on a townie.

I mean, that's not even how the wagons went between them. It wasn't like Freddie had a sr on waves, they were the major wagons with a few vanity votes on vota and Freddie isnt going to vote for himself, so this weird retcon where it's all Naucis fault seems very opportunistic by attempting to absolve himself of a vote to mislynch.

[Formerfish]

I feel like there are 2 camps right now. One camp is pushing some variation of Vota or Freddie being today's lynch, and the other is just nay saying that lynch while not providing a viable alternative.

If you don't want to lynch in Vota/Freddie where do you want to lunch and why?

Have we had everyone post yet since we started the day, or do we still have people unaccounted for?

[Formerfish]

Lilith hasn't posted yet.

[Formerfish]

That being said, I don't think those votes on her are well placed at all, and if anything are suspect as fuck.

Gibus your vote is on her because of her push on Vota. I'm pushing both Vota and Freddie but I don't even warrant a mention in your reads list.

Nauci, I'm going to need you to explain your vote to me in detail. It would be cool if you could do a tldr version in a new post for me. I'd give reasons but you know can't.

This is pretty important so I'd appreciate the least amount of push back possible. Kthankbi

[gibus]

How is pressure voting sus? We need content from everyone before we lynch.

I'm curious about her thoughts on Fred after he claimed, people other than votato and FF, wave's flip, no NK.
I don't like #1308 because it looks like confbias at that point (he was scumreading FF & osuka for a while).

[lilith2013]

Pinky swear I am getting to this game today.

[Elmo TeH AzN]

Votecount 2.01

Freddiethelady (1)

- Osuka

lilith2013 (2)

- Nauci, gibus

Osuka (1)

- Tuxedo Mask

Not Voting (5) -

Votato, Freddiethelady, Formerfish, Lilith2013

With 8 players alive it takes 5 votes to lynch.

The deadline for Day 1 is in (expired on 2020-05-30 08:15:00)

[osuka]

if freddie flips town, however remote that possibility, votato should be powerlynched the following day

Is there a typo in this or are you saying that only scum Vota would be able to have that sure of a read on town Freddie?

thats exactly what im saying

That's not really a thing though. I've powerlynched before in situations where someone gave a 100% tr on someone else in a newbie and they both flipped vts.

There is literally 1 situation where I step off this train and hop on to another one, and neither Vota nor Freddie have given any indication that we are in that situation.

So, forgive me if "trust me, I know them" doesn't exactly get me moist in all the right places. The fact that you're keeping up with the shtick means you are most likely scum, or town who doesn't know when to drop the act and let us in on the secret.

what i mean to say is that only scum votato is THAT sure of freddie's town alignment (assuming votato scum and freddie town). If freddie flips red, then it could go either way - but if freddie is in fact VT, then votato is confscum

[osuka]

You said to Fish with your words, that "only scum Votato" would be that sure of a read on Freddie. Does that not make them scum regardless of Freddie's alignment? Why would Freddie being scum make Vota assuredness town?

do you know how to read?

These responses need to stop.

If one of us isn't getting your point it's either A. Not clear, or B. They are doing it on purpose.

You need to figure out which one and stop clapping back with personal insults. You say you aren't attacking the player, but the slot, but you aren't doing that, you're just saying that.

people need to start reading is what needs to happen

as you said, they either aren't reading or they're misrepping, and they deserve to be called out either way

[osuka]

Well I understand the logic, I'd rather lynch Votato for being scummy and not to sort Freddie. If Votato flips town I really don't like where that would leave us.

Even if Freddie flips town I think it would leave us in a better game state, then if we lynch Votato and they flip town.

Okay, totally wild idea time:

Instead of frivolously speculating the implications of a Freddie/votato flip on Freddie/votato, how about this:

@votato: can you link some concrete examples of Freddie having similar behavior in her town game compared to this? What personal signals are telling you she's town? Why do you have Formerfish as potential scum when so many people believe otherwise? As of right now I feel like you've post "Freddie is town" like 8x and all that has done is affect people's reads of you.

@Formerfish: Do you still believe in your theory that Freddie was coached to claim VT? What did you think of Gibus's take on that? If you do still believe that, who do you think would have told Freddie to do that?

@osuka: what do you think of my theory (firm belief?) that tux cannot possibly be scum with Freddie because of their real time D1 interactions? Do you have an independent townread on that slot, ignoring this dynamic? Because CopyKat made extremely egregious posts that smelled extremely strongly of newbscum on Day 1 and I feel like you didn't comment on those while going ham on Freddie. Also, can you comment on Gibus?

Speaking of reads of votato changing ..

@Lilith how have the last several pages impacted your votato read?

P.S. if we're speculating on flips, I think Freddie gives us info on tuxedo, osuka, and votato if we flip there

I'll ISO Tux, Freddie, and Formerfish on Monday + Tuesday and give long winded analysis because my gut read on CopyKat was so strong on D1 that I'm still not willing to let go of it

ill have to reread their d1 interaction to really say. if you had a link to about where it started id appreciate it, because i have no idea what the post count was there

i dont have much of a read on gibus because there's not a lot of content from that slot at the moment

[osuka]

I feel like there are 2 camps right now. One camp is pushing some variation of Vota or Freddie being today's lynch, and the other is just nay saying that lynch while not providing a viable alternative.

If you don't want to lynch in Vota/Freddie where do you want to lunch and why?

Have we had everyone post yet since we started the day, or do we still have people unaccounted for?

good post 10/10

[osuka]

1395 might have come across as sarcastic but i was actually being serious

[votato]

Fish why are you just coaching his play right now?

I'm not.

And if I were scum with him why would I be doing it here and not in the scum PT?

because youre distancing because you are seeing the writing on the wall for osuka. which is also why you pointed that out looking for towncred

[votato]

@Formerfish: Do you still believe in your theory that Freddie was coached to claim VT? What did you think of Gibus's take on that? If you do still believe that, who do you think would have told Freddie to do that?

Yes. I have no reason to believe his beliefs over my own without evidence to say otherwise. Anyone. Literally anyone would have told him to claim in that time. It's the only thing that makes sense in the way that it happened.

Freddie for sure would have seen the numerous posts expounding on the multiple reasons not to claim, most of which was SOMEONE WAS ALREADY LYNCHED.

I refuse to believe a townie who very much wants to do good as a newbie is going to miss events that huge to create a situation that baffles the mind.

Additional shout out to Vota for trying to say I was role fishing in that whole thing and attempting to give Freddie a reasonable out by blaming me for their shit play. Koudos for that one. Must be your crazy previously unmentioned past and possible irl relationship with Freddie, that is an odd thing to hide, especially when we've talked about meta a butt load in this thread so far.

i prefer to separate my real life from the internet for the most part. thats why i was heavily implying a read that was stronger than just from our limited interactions on here. but you wouldnt drop it, so here we are. this is going to sound a bit harsh, so let me preface by saying freddie is intelligent. she just isnt cunning or strategic in the way that being scum in mafia requires. shes a terrible liar. she also doesnt really reside on the internet, preferring to live in the meatbag world, so a lot of subtlety the rest of us can pick up on from years of shitposting and being trolled by each other, she just cant grasp. her posts come from a place of being totally lost in this game. i guess some of that really isnt very harsh - it makes her a good person irl, but perhaps mafia isnt the place for innocent souls like hers

[votato]

effort incoming. please stand by