Newbie 2004: Trash Panada Hour. Redux! GAME OVER

[Blair]

VOTE: Gibus

Much love.

[Blair]

Tuxedo also looks slightly townier for that post.

[Dunnstral]

I'm on page 2, Lillith (now Dunn) is scum for helping in 40

Feather (Nauci) is town for townslipping

gibus is town for being excited and unafraid

former was kind of being a douche

gibus is fucking hilarious

also, I looked up noob on the mafiawiki page of abbreviations and couldn't find it. would someone explain what it means, please.

how

lilith is for sure scum

I think copykat's switch from defending gibus ("scum wouldn't be trying to out masons in this thread") to attacking a "scumslip" feel contrived to me, like he is trying to get on the bandwagon as fast as possible and needs something to attack gibus for. Typically I think scum are more likely to attack something like that so suddenly and aggressively.

VOTE: copykat

I think this is L-2

disgusting vote

VOTE: Dunstral

Are we going to let this guy get away with this depth of reads?

[Blair]

Are you?

Press him on it. That post dubious #40 scumread might be a good place to start.

[Blair]

*dubious post #40

ugh

[gibus]

@Tuxedo
If I'm not wrong, you said I had a scummy start but pinged town as the game progressed.
Where is the scumread coming from?

[Nauci]

Aloratom has felt somewhat "off" since I subbed in, but I need consultation because I can't decide if it's Aloratom being scum or Aloratom being Aloratom.

So... you're not on board with my logic that there was no way votato would defend Freddie that way as scum? Why not?

[Nauci]

@Nauci, I think it's just a long game with pages and pages of pretty toxic fighting that isn't even solving related. Just a bit of a slog to read.

I'd rather everyone be allowed to answer for themselves and not get a blanket excuse

[Dunnstral]

VOTE: bbmolla

This is the osuka slot if you'd like.

[Nauci]

@Gibus:

You said "for pressure." Okay, nausi already pressure voted me. I posted only once in the thread after that, so it should be obvious the "pressure" wasn't going to achieve anything. Like my inactivity was clearly not the result of people not paying attention to me in this thread, so why did/do you think that paying attention to me would change my lack of activity after nausi's pressure vote was already shown to not have an effect?

UNVOTE: lilith2k13
Your response to Nauci's pressure vote looked unsatisfactory, and I confused your inactivity with lurking as scum. I agree, my vote was hasty.

Why are you scumreading Tuxedo and formerfish?

I'm scumreading Tuxedo's slot because of Copy.
I don't understand how FF found Copy

bleeding town

, and find it AI that he ignored my question.
His theory about how Fred was made to claim by his scum partner as a form of defence for not being the NK seems like a stretch because it is a really bad move by scum and I can see a newbtown make that kind of a mistake. But his insistence makes me wonder if he is the scum partner of Fred, and after successfully bussing and lynching Fred on D2, shift the focus on another townie for a mislynch to win the game. How is FF defending Copy different from votato defending Fred? Votato claims to know Fred IRL so that townread seems more plausible. I also find it weird that in the early stages of the game, FF says Copy's predecessor was statistically more probable to be scum, but still eliminates him in his PoE.

Retcon? Did you miss the post from Day 1 where Freddie super hammed it up that they were sheeping me on my meta-read of Brass?

Like, 1057 was so... extra? That I noted it as "is this scum absolving themselves of responsibility for voting for the lynch?" I commented on this in 1322 at start of day.

Listen, im stoned just about all the time, its the only thing that keeps the demons and voices at bay, so just be glad that i can string together a coherent thought in a single post for the most part without losing focus and making it a very different post.

So... does the fact that she made that post on Day 1 change your view of that follow up?

Im not sure i know exactly what you have an issue with or what you want answered.

I think that Freddie is using your read on Waves and sheeping there as a reason to not have to explain the vote. What are you saying and how does it fundamentally differ from what im saying to the degree that this is what you stick on with me for some reason?

Gibus gave 4 town reads and cases on them, but has yet to respond to being called out by either of us for the inconsistent logic with which they town read me but scum read you, and I want an answer there before we end the day.

There were differences. I townread feathers (your predecessor) and then townread your open mindedness towards scumhunting. FF ignored the possibility that Copy could be scum even though his reads were inconsistent like brassherald's, and had a bad post history. I found FF's early game suspicious too. I can't townread him yet without some information which won't be revealed anytime soon.
He was the backbone for wave's lynch, I agree, but that does not imply that he is town in any way.

Fred is a confused newbie, and I'm not surprised to see bad play coming from them. I am a newbie and I had the urge to make very questionable moves in my last game (as VT). I do not feel like Fred claiming VT for towncred is scummy. It can come from newbtown who wanted towncred seeing no other way of defending themselves. If Fred flips scum, then I'm inclined towards the possibility that FF is the partner. If Fred flips town, it does not imply that votato is scum, because votato formed his opinion based on a meta-read (they know each other IRL too).

You said "for pressure." Okay, nausi already pressure voted me. I posted only once in the thread after that, so it should be obvious the "pressure" wasn't going to achieve anything. Like my inactivity was clearly not the result of people not paying attention to me in this thread, so why did/do you think that paying attention to me would change my lack of activity after nausi's pressure vote was already shown to not have an effect?

UNVOTE: lilith2k13
Your response to Nauci's pressure vote looked unsatisfactory, and I confused your inactivity with lurking as scum. I agree, my vote was hasty.

Why are you scumreading Tuxedo and formerfish?

I'm scumreading Tuxedo's slot because of Copy.
I don't understand how FF found Copy

bleeding town

, and find it AI that he ignored my question.
His theory about how Fred was made to claim by his scum partner as a form of defence for not being the NK seems like a stretch because it is a really bad move by scum and I can see a newbtown make that kind of a mistake. But his insistence makes me wonder if he is the scum partner of Fred, and after successfully bussing and lynching Fred on D2, shift the focus on another townie for a mislynch to win the game. How is FF defending Copy different from votato defending Fred? Votato claims to know Fred IRL so that townread seems more plausible. I also find it weird that in the early stages of the game, FF says Copy's predecessor was statistically more probable to be scum, but still eliminates him in his PoE.

Went back to this post because I managed to forget it when the game turned into The Purge

I have a few follow up question for you, Gibus:

1: Do you think that scum!Formerfish would be motivated to be

this

active and stir up this much activity? What, in your view, makes up the difference between FF's scum hunting and mine that cause you to scum read him but strongly town read me?

2: Once you check your math on the math of night kills and lynches for scum to win, do you still think it's plausible that FF would bus his teammate today? Do you believe his case on votato for why he switched there?

3: How has your read on Lilith evolved now that she has participated a lot more?

1) Formerfish is experienced and has a reputation for being good, so townreading him for stirring up activity doesn't make sense.
2) My math was off, but I still think it could be a bus attempt. Let me catch up on the votato case.
3) I feel good about her slot.

My point is that the theory assumes a scum partner to have coached Fred into making an unnecessary move, which is an unnecessary move as scum. Who does "the people" refer to?

My question is basically, do you think that Formerfish and Osuka genuinely believe their theory that Freddie was being coached? If you scumread either of them, do you think it was an act?

TI can't townread him yet without some information which won't be revealed anytime soon.

Huh?

If Fred flips scum, then I'm inclined towards the possibility that FF is the partner.

Woahhhhhhh. I was with you for most of that until this bit. This would mean that the entirety of FF's pushes on Freddie, from the end of day 1 during which Freddie was -1 up through The Purge, was theater?

FF laid out a theory which factored in a scum coach which I find oddly specific. It makes sense if he was the one giving out instructions. That's why I'm inclined towards that possibility.
I guess that answers 1683?

Gibus, your scumread on Formerfish seemed to depend a lot on the wild theory that him literally screaming for her head until the thread exploded was theater and was actually a bussing attempt. You're now saying that you town read Freddie and therefore have no interest in lynching Blair today even though you believe in my case... How does that compute for your read on Formerfish?!

[Nauci]

VOTE: bbmolla

This is the osuka slot if you'd like.

Why'd you hop off the Blair wagon

[Nauci]

VOTE: Gibus

Much love.

Y'all hopping off of each others' wagons immediately as they become at all viable is making it real hard for me to town read you, yo

[gibus]

@Gibus:

Gibus, your scumread on Formerfish seemed to depend a lot on the wild theory

No, I SR FF regardless of Fred's alignment. The theory I laid out was speculation if Fred flipped scum, not a part of my SR on him.

[gibus]

I don't understand Blair's intention in forming a

power wagon

on me. I really expected her to form better reads, but since she's insisting on lynching me without a good case, I retract what I said in #1899.

[gibus]

That's VOTE: Blair

[gibus]

ebwop

I don't understand Blair's intention in forming a

power wagon

on me. I really expected her to form better reads, but since she's insisting on lynching me without a good case, I retract what I said in #1889.

[Blair]

VOTE: Gibus

Much love.

Y'all hopping off of each others' wagons immediately as they become at all viable is making it real hard for me to town read you, yo

"Hopping off" "as they become viable"?

What happened between when I joined the Dunn wagon and when I left it that made it more viable?

(Hint: Literally nothing, because the only thing that happened to the Dunn wagon during that time period

was

my vote)

This was disingenuous.

[Blair]

Aloratom has felt somewhat "off" since I subbed in, but I need consultation because I can't decide if it's Aloratom being scum or Aloratom being Aloratom.

So... you're not on board with my logic that there was no way votato would defend Freddie that way as scum? Why not?

What part of what I said above indicates what you said below?

[gibus]

I'm null on Dunnstral right now

VOTE: Dunnstral

What happened to FF, your other scumread?

[Nauci]

VOTE: Gibus

Much love.

Y'all hopping off of each others' wagons immediately as they become at all viable is making it real hard for me to town read you, yo

"Hopping off" "as they become viable"?

What happened between when I joined the Dunn wagon and when I left it that made it more viable?

(Hint: Literally nothing, because the only thing that happened to the Dunn wagon during that time period

was

my vote)

This was disingenuous.

You made it L-2. You knew that Dunn was my other scum read, and you knew Gibus was willing to lynch there, so it was risky to leave him at -2

[Blair]

I'm null on Dunnstral right now

VOTE: Dunnstral

What happened to FF, your other scumread?

This is one of the grossest quote cherry picks I have ever seen.

It's abundantly clear from that post (all the important parts you cut out of it without indicating that you had done so) that I am consolidating wagons due to the impending deadline. No one was, or is, voting for FormerFish/Battle Mage. So unless you are indicating you are suddenly interested in cobbling a Battle Mage together in the next 24 hours (this would be a stunning development on your part), it is not at all clear why you even made this post.

VOTE: bbmolla

This is the osuka slot if you'd like.

What a strange post.

[Nauci]

Aloratom has felt somewhat "off" since I subbed in, but I need consultation because I can't decide if it's Aloratom being scum or Aloratom being Aloratom.

So... you're not on board with my logic that there was no way votato would defend Freddie that way as scum? Why not?

What part of what I said above indicates what you said below?

Why speculate on votato's rep if you agree votato is definitely town?

[Blair]

You made it L-2. You knew that Dunn was my other scum read, and you knew Gibus was willing to lynch there, so it was risky to leave him at -2

Check the time stamps on those posts you're referring to.

Are you suggesting it was my dastardly scum plan to place Dunnstral at L-2 for five nanoseconds, then freak out and unvote?

[Blair]

Aloratom has felt somewhat "off" since I subbed in, but I need consultation because I can't decide if it's Aloratom being scum or Aloratom being Aloratom.

So... you're not on board with my logic that there was no way votato would defend Freddie that way as scum? Why not?

What part of what I said above indicates what you said below?

Why speculate on votato's rep if you agree votato is definitely town?

I don't make up my mind 100% about a slot based on a single interaction and then never assess that slot again.

Do you?

[Nauci]

ebwop

I don't understand Blair's intention in forming a

power wagon

on me. I really expected her to form better reads, but since she's insisting on lynching me without a good case, I retract what I said in #1889.

I'm sorry can you tl;dr me the other reasons for your read on Fish because I ISOed you and I see tons of your posts scumreading FF, sheeping him and I to vote for Brass, then mostly talk about him speculating about Freddie on Day 2. When and why did you go from scumreading him to willing to sheep him then back to scumreading?