Mini Normal 2146: Cute Pets Game Over, Town wins

[notscience]

I’ll prob rejoin turkey once klicks done catching up agar.

[Hoopla]

VOTE: hoopla

@mod, is this allowed??

[Klick]

No, voting Hoopla is not allowed

[Hoopla]

Yes.
To gobble's credit, I've played with him twice and he was scum both times, and I don't remember him being quite like this.

how would you describe his behaviour as scum in those two games?

[notscience]

Klick are you townreading me yet

[Klick]

Spoiler: Catch-up - the rest

Espe is Scum based on a tell where they are recreating a systematic way to play as Scum. I'd dig for the game, but I don't feel like it right now... It was a LONG time ago.

This right after voting for Gypyx doesn't sit well with me.

everyone calling renaissance town might be the clear defining moment that these "town blocs" are absolute garbage - pass on whatever SR i have on hoopla -

renaissance is town?!?

the dude has been going along with the crowd with one-liners all game. how can you say that is definitively town??

Curious. I fail to see the town motivation in being ardently anti-townbloc - it doesn't accomplish anything to take apart townreads. I can see several angles where it's useful for scum to discredit it though.

Your vote is simply to "move to greener pastures" with absolutely no reason what so ever. It's like you vote, the wagon doesn't pick up, time to try and lead another wagon leveraging your town cred, let other people come up with reasons and then post facto agree with them and not offer your own explanation because you are "town hunting" this game. Reads as not want to commit to scum reads and pick easy popular town reads. My vote will stay here for a while....

Nahhh. Hoopla's town bloc was herself/renaissance/notscience/gobbles/Gypyx. You call that a list of 'popular' townreads? You're also picking at her lack of vote reasoning without engaging at all with the reasons she gives for these 'easy' townreads. I agreed pretty strongly with her line of thought on Gypyx in particular.

CooLDoG's 324 is a whole bunch of words to say 'I'm annoyed at everyone, but specifically Hoopla because I don't like her playstyle.'
And throughout the next two pages he goes on to post a lot of nonsense this contrasts a lot with his earlier play.

[~words about traitors~]

I can't recall what Una thinks about anything that isn't the Traitor Problem.

I agree with a lot of Hoopla's theory talk in 389 - not really relevant in a reads sense, but I do think towns should stop waiting until right before deadline before they're prepared to bring someone to claim.

Why does CooLDoG start making consistently terrible posts? He was doing so well earlier I'm trying to figure out what this means irt his alignment. I guess looking objectively at what he's doing, he goes full-on against Hoopla and proposes myself and Espe as her partners. It's a pretty awful scum list, and I think pushing for Hoopla specifically out of those three has some scum motivation if Hoopla is town (as Hoopla is a rather strong player from what I remember). The town motivation is a lot more... petty, and involves taking a lot of what he's saying at face value. I can see both. It's one of those things where I think I'd scumread CooLDoG more if he were a better town player than I think he is, which is annoying.

Emperor flippynips' check-in on Page 18 is decidedly uninspiring.

Plus I am not great early game. Never have been. I do better after a re-read and a lynch of two, where I can do some analysis. If you expect me to be coming out of the gates day one as some amazing super posting person.... you'll be disappointed.

Oh fucking hell, you are just Bellaphant. She's said this verbatim to me before.
This post though continues the trend of PranaDevil having some really surface-level reasons for scumreading people while spending a wall retelling the game in narrative fashion. 'flippyNips posted a bunch of small inconsequential posts in a row' isn't inspiring. I've played a couple of games with flippyNips and this is entirely to be expected from them.

That reads to me like a scum reaction. Una, you aren’t doing anything to get the person you’re voting lynched. Most of your posts are talking about Gypyx. Ergo talking a lot but not doing anything with your vote

Really good post. Sums up my thoughts on Una's slot as a whole well.

flippyNips looks bad on Page 19. He posted more substance almost as a direct response to getting heat for not doing good enough earlier. Every single post here seems to have

some

content, in total contrast with last page. Their vote-unvote of Gypyx in 456 and 458 feels like fake reconsideration.

well i don't really care for any of espeonage's post but nothing shouts scum in his iso to me, why are people sring him?

This is awfully noncommittal.

His night prep comment re me never happened and when questioned he first stalled answering then said he just roped me in there which shows he doesn’t care to divine my alignment which typically means he knows it

This is awfully convoluted.

So you're saying your strongest, most confident scumread is on me, but you decided to vote for 4 other players.

Scumfuck is a scumfuck is confirmed.

There's not a clear connection here between 'confusing behavior' and 'scum'. Dissonance isn't a scumtell.

Renaissance, Hoopla, CoolDog, Hiraki - what do you think of the fact that Una did:
...nothing to get notscience killed
...not vote anyone else on his shortlist after unvoting notscience

This is rather bad, I agree turkey.

Not really, no. I find it anti-town, for sure. But IME, lots of people are bad town players. So votes sit and rot because people don't wanna effort. Dominant personalities usually come in and direct shit and that's how things get done. Unless shit changed since I last played, I'm kinda just still hanging on to that notion.

See but this doesn't really add up with your perception of gobble being scum for what you see as bad play.

OMG! Me tooo! i look scummy af when im town. and touching on the people not going after their prefered lynch. i have no clue who i want to die, im trying to get townies first then i'll figure out who i want to kill.

i originally voted hoop for omgus lulz, but left it there cos it felt right & no one else has really given me bad vibes

Bad contrast between scumreading Hoopla and basically having the same game plan as her.

As for why I think they are s/s, partly my feeling that both are scum (let's be honest, this early in the game, there's less to go on regarding s/s interactions), but I do feel like Hoopla mentioned the lynching of the lurker slots, and then "pushed" Flippy who subsequently "fixes" their post counts, by spreading one post so thin that it became practically an entire page by itself...

This is better. It's also one of the things I observed irt flippyNips.

[Prana's] 10 posts have more content in them than the totality of Flippy's, which is why he's probably higher in my lynch list than you, and one of the reasons why i am promoting espeonage's wagon now.

I'm not actually sure this is a thing. Prana has posted a lot of

words

, but they've been largely descriptive - content is another story.

Hoopla is fun. I'm now wondering if Hoopla was one of the members of the Correspondence modding hydra that was around a year or so ago.

So preflip associations and scumreading others for actions you take yourself?

Interesting that you call gobble out for this, but not AGar.

that's right i did ask una why he's sring NS. i feel like im getting called out left & right for only memeing but i've asked plenty of questions that are just getting pushed aside as of rn by una since you've responded gobble

I guess I've missed that question then?
Sorry about that.

My initial scumread on notscience came about from their earliest interactions with/around Hoopla.
Hoopla was awkwardly(?) trying to build the first bridge, and I think notscience reacted in a suspicious manner.
My take on it was something a scum would likely do - not jumping at the thought and immediately hopping onboard the townbin, but trying to come across suspecting and hard to get.
Somehow I got the read that a scummie had to fake suspicions and paranoia towards Hoopla, because in reality they KNOW their alignment.

That feeling has somewhat passed, especially since I feel like there are better lynchoptions in the same "towngroup" from Hoopla now.
But whenever I reread those first interactions, I have a feeling notscience was putting on an act.

This is rather good, and still the biggest thing pinging me about notscience.
I don't really understand how/why Una has notscience as less scummy than the others in Hoopla's townbloc, though. Particularly my own slot.

Una's 519 goes back to giving me bad vibes. Una's scumreads line up

exactly

with Hoopla's townbloc, with everyone else going 'just below the null line' at worst. That's not natural town thought. He also has much more concrete reasons for suspecting all of notscience/Gypyx/gobble, but votes renaissance for elusive reasons.
I'm getting the vibe that if Una is scum, at least one of his partners is actually in Hoopla's townbloc. His vote has danced around enough in that group that there's something whack going on there.

Okay flip me then, ggs to scum

Plus scum doesn’t usually bounce around voting people or do stuff like that. They pick someone and hunker down for the most part. Doing what I did draws unwanted attention

This is scum.

VOTE: espe

Considering the mod posted that Espe was getting replaced very shortly before this vote, I find it odd. It's also a poor transition from voting gobble on the same page. Gobble didn't towntell particularly hard between the two votes, indicating the vote was weak in the first place. Notscience is blatantly coasting and it doesn't feel town-motivated.

VOTE: battle mage

pre-emptive OMGUS eh? I might hold fire on the rest of my read through until we can all agree I'm not being lynched today. Let's go team!

no, I just thought you were double backing on your vig claim from espe, meaning actually coming back and claiming it legitimately. THen i realized it makes sense to wait for d2 if that were the case.

I think I actually buy this, and it's a thought that comes from town.

Hoopla's Una vote is good. In general, I like what Hoopla is doing whenever she's doing it. She has flat-out claimed that she'd be going for optimal plays as town or scum, but I feel like the fact that we're seeing similar optimal plays to each other is a good sign.

The narrative surrounding Gypyx and the Traitor spec picks back up around Page 25. Gypyx feels like lynchbait supreme. Everyone wants to shoot token suspicion at Gypyx for it, but only Battle Mage is prepared to put his money where his mouth is this early. For how weak notscience's scumreads seem, I'd think he would push on Gypyx harder instead of keeping shade there while throwing his vote around without weight.

I have always been taught to respect my elders, but an early join date in itself clearly brings no wisdom.
Hoopla voting me based on intuition at this point is silly, and mind you - my take on his "towngroup" so far has been that Hoopla is just misguided town, and the scumsters are the ones enjoying the free buffet.

So you've reasserted this a few times now. Why do you believe it? Hoopla herself has said she plays very similarly to this as either alignment. Yet you've fairly consistently held her as 'misguided town'. Why do you townread Hoopla?
Actually looking back now, you don't list your read on Hoopla at all in 519...

Yeah... motivation right now isn't high.

I'm still happy with Flippy, Hoopla or the Turkey at this stage.

Welcome to our replacements too.

Sigh.

literally nothing happened in the last 5 pages

This is literally false. You wanna play a bit?

AGar feels the need to point this out, but not PranaDevil expressing the same sentiment.
(further down the page he does in fact push PD to join the gobble wagon.)

You're scum... but also some good points about needing to make some game forwarding votes.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: gobbledygook

Time for a roast dinner.

I can kinda see this from Prana!town's perspective. The gobble wagon is the sensible conclusion, as PD already suspects him and Hoopla is townreading him.

I think your fos is a good way to take a safe stance without using your vote

Relatable

See ya nerds. This is probably a town loss with how bad the town is

I’m not claiming.

Please don't do this.


I'm running out of steam, and skimming the last few pages they don't tell me all that much that doesn't fit into what I've already established in the rest of my read-through.

[notscience]

Fine, I look forward to your vote d2.

[Klick]

Yes.
To gobble's credit, I've played with him twice and he was scum both times, and I don't remember him being quite like this.

how would you describe his behaviour as scum in those two games?

In the first one he pretty explicitly played to not be listened to. He came in and posted a lot of activity stat-based thoughts that looked like content, but tbqh it seemed crazy to me. I passed it off as VI-town who was annoyed they weren't being taken seriously. He let town eat themselves alive while posting the token thought.
The other game was a bit of an odd one setup-wise, so in hindsight it probably doesn't mean much.

The main difference I see is that here it's a lot more question-based without a show of producing content. I don't get the sense that turkey cares whether I think he's doing something useful.

Klick are you townreading me yet

No

[notscience]

I’m not saying it to be petty I’m saying it out of anticipation

[Hoopla]

wow, great catch-up klick!

my critics weren't happy with my bold decision to list the renaissance slot in the town bloc, but i've townread each player who has occupied it so far.

i'm also warming to klick's observations re: notscience;

I really didn't think Hoopla's interest in working with you early was that suspicious. I find it much more odd that you're being so weird about it, almost like Hoopla has you in an uncomfortable spot.

So many of notscience's reads are suuuuper flip-floppy. There's room for most of them to change on a dime. Just look at this post:

Spoiler:

Agar town for the similarities in train of thought like I’ve mentioned before

Hoopla still leads town but that weird post hiraki mentioned still irks me a bit

I liked Renaissance’s entrance into the game but still want those reads explained

I’m tempted to townread hiraki but can’t really place what it is that makes me think that way?

I liked my interactions with una so far so leantown there

I still want an explanation from Espeonage about the damn night prep because he’s been ignoring that question multiple times which is sketchy as shit

LicketyQuickety is still in this game and I don’t think he’s even posted

Turkey I’ve resolved to give him a few more days and see what he does with the space he asked for earlier

I want to iso warmcat because I frankly struggle to remember what he’s done

I didn’t feel either way re prana

Nippy flips I don’t think has done anything either but I’m pretty sure someone said that’s par for the course for him

Gyp I still don’t have good feelings about the traitor thing for the reasons in my iso

The only read here that I feel couldn't change on a whim is AGar-town.

of my current townbloc, notscience has drifted away to my least confident read, and i will be reassessing his membership overnight. he was my first townread i developed, and i sorta stopped thinking about him while i focused on the rest of the game. he is overdue for some close scrutiny.

[notscience]

Klick well talk about part of my thought process re that first quote on a later date- I promise

[Klick]

To summarize my thoughts on each player:

Gypyx: My top townread. Lynchbait supreme. The traitor stuff is legit, and he's trying to scumhunt and getting frustrated that it's not working.
CooLDoG: Probably town. I buy that he believes what he believes at key moments. Questionable at times in quick succession, but I suspect that's just CooLDoG.
gobbledygook: He feels town to me. Occasionally I sync up with where he's at pretty well. He doesn't feel like scum!gobble. Turkey is also prime lynchbait.
Hoopla: Doing good things for this game. Shouldn't be lynched today and is >rand town.
Battle Mage: Espe was towny. I reeeally liked 99. Battle Mage himself is... fine? Looking forward to developing this more.

PranaDevil: I'm not getting enough content, and what's there is surface-level. If I can catch you online at the same time as me sometime soon, I'd love to chat about the game.
AGar: Like a more aggressive, active, detailed version of Prana. Your stances feel safe even though they're stated strongly. I want to find you suspicious but I suspect a lot of what I'm seeing is personality.
bob3141: who???

Hiraki: Meh. Getting mostly nothings from him. I find myself opposed to his stances and not really understanding where he's coming from. I'm hoping to see this change soon. I'd be fine with getting some pressure here.
UnaBombaH: Feels fake. His read on Gypyx felt safe. His read on my slot felt odd in comparison to the other slots he had more solid reason to suspect. Could easily be scum.
notscience: I haven't seen a single reason to townread you, and I feel like I should have. You've been remarkably noncommittal while technically being a presence in the game. I'd lynch here happily.
Emperor flippyNips: Why isn't this dead yet? He started posting content specifically in response to being called out for not posting content. Political reads, really poor defense, all around just scum.

VOTE: Emperor flippyNips

Going to sleep for now, talk to you all tomorrow.

[Emperor flippyNips]

Whoa whoa whoa I’m a 1 shot combined fruit vendor gunsmith

[Emperor flippyNips]

Oh.... I wasn’t L-1..

[brassherald]

VOTE: hoopla

@mod, is this allowed??

I don't see why not. There's nothing in the rules about large text, just not tiny text

[Emperor flippyNips]

And I started posting content cos I felt like it, not for any other reason so chill

[Hoopla]

Whoa whoa whoa I’m a 1 shot combined fruit vendor gunsmith

Oh.... I wasn’t L-1..

hmmm curious. mods these days and their abstract role mashups.

first thoughts: due to its provability, fruit vendor part is almost certainly true. whether he has tacked on a gunsmith investigation to boost his apparent usefulness is another story.

still thinking.

[Hoopla]

I don't see why not. There's nothing in the rules about large text, just not tiny text

but it hurt my feelings.

[Hoopla]

flippy, is your role like a JOAT, where you use one ability at a time? or do you investigate someone for guns while simultaneously sending them fruit.

[Emperor flippyNips]

No, it’s combined they both get used at once, I send a fruit and also get my gunsmith results

[Hoopla]

Whoa whoa whoa I’m a 1 shot combined fruit vendor gunsmith

Oh.... I wasn’t L-1..

reareading this sequence of posts, there's only a 2 minute time-stamp between these two posts. is that enough time to read the last three pages to scan for votes then post again?

he'd have to have posted, then gone back

immediately

and scanned the last three pages and counted his votes - that's if he knew

exactly

where the last mod VC was, and wasn't spending time looking for that. also, judging by the capitalisation of these two posts compared to his iso, it looks like he's phone posting (autocorrect often capitalises for you), and his other non-capitalised posts are desktop posts. if he's on his phone, that's generally harder to navigate and scan for votes on yourself than a desktop. well, at least for me, i find it harder navigating the game on a phone...

could this be scum overreager to get a claim out, and wanting to fake lucidity of "not knowing he wasn't on L-1". is 2 minutes enough to reread the last three pages, then make that post? this may just be a situation of me being old, but it seems like a very short window of time. whipper snappers please chime in!

[Emperor flippyNips]

I counted the most recent then ISO’d the mod then counted up to most recent again it wasn’t that hard

[Emperor flippyNips]

I even did it mobile! :Lol:

[Emperor flippyNips]

Oh you talked about me doing it mobile already. I didn’t finish reading what you said

[Hoopla]

I counted the most recent then ISO’d the mod then counted up to most recent again it wasn’t that hard

why did you claim before knowing how many votes you were sitting on?