Open 784 - Hard-Boiled (Town Wins!)


Forum rules
User avatar
superbowl9
superbowl9
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
superbowl9
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 3565
Joined: April 22, 2015

Post Post #1150 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 4:44 am

Post by superbowl9 »

Also I don’t think any more claims today would be beneficial - I believe we should elim out of PP/Nash. I’ll give you my case on why I think it should be Nash later today
User avatar
Battle Mage
Battle Mage
Jester
User avatar
User avatar
Battle Mage
Jester
Jester
Posts: 22231
Joined: January 10, 2007

Post Post #1151 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 4:46 am

Post by Battle Mage »

In post 1150, superbowl9 wrote:Also I don’t think any more claims today would be beneficial - I believe we should elim out of PP/Nash. I’ll give you my case on why I think it should be Nash later today
You stole the page top I was waiting for!

HIDER - tonight target the person directly above you in THIS list (alphabetical order, with slight alteration to avoid double-targetting):


Aristophanes
Battle Mage
Doctor Drew
Froppy
Looker
Nash
Gypyx
PenguinPower
superbowl9
Tuxedo Mask
word321

This will be the last day of doing this - it's possible scum can PoE the hider after tonight, so after that do not direct them! Hopefully they'll crumb or something.

Good if everyone not voting either PP or Nash can do so.
Show
2020 Stats - 31 completed games:

Survived to the end and won - 11
Nightkilled - 10
Survived to the end and lost - 6
Day-elimmed by majority - 4

winrate as scum: 78%
winrate as town: 55%
User avatar
superbowl9
superbowl9
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
superbowl9
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 3565
Joined: April 22, 2015

Post Post #1152 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 4:49 am

Post by superbowl9 »

Also pretty important,
can we get everyone to come out and say if you agree with this N2 hider plan or not?
It will make it a hell of a lot easier

I agree with the plan

Pedit: you sniped me too ToT
User avatar
Battle Mage
Battle Mage
Jester
User avatar
User avatar
Battle Mage
Jester
Jester
Posts: 22231
Joined: January 10, 2007

Post Post #1153 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 4:57 am

Post by Battle Mage »

we're seeking agreement? eh, i was just expecting people would go with it. i'm not in the mood for more debate after Froppy's thing earlier...

simpler approach is, if someone claims they diverted from the plan, policy daykill them for being stupid.
Show
2020 Stats - 31 completed games:

Survived to the end and won - 11
Nightkilled - 10
Survived to the end and lost - 6
Day-elimmed by majority - 4

winrate as scum: 78%
winrate as town: 55%
User avatar
Doctor Drew
Doctor Drew
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Doctor Drew
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 3048
Joined: June 10, 2019

Post Post #1154 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 6:21 am

Post by Doctor Drew »

I agree with the plan.
'This might be the first game where I'm townreading Doctor Drew. Not sure if that's a good or bad sign considering he was town the previous 2 times' - Hectic
'Like I am trying to not be a tunnelly asshole Drew but my patience is running thin' - Titus
'ok just make sure to fuck them, preferably not us pls (人>ω<)' - Morning Tweet
User avatar
Tuxedo Mask
Tuxedo Mask
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
Tuxedo Mask
Goon
Goon
Posts: 973
Joined: April 23, 2020

Post Post #1155 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 7:02 am

Post by Tuxedo Mask »

Hey, haven't read the last few pages. I'll hopefully be back with some substantial tonight. Did we really immediately run PP up for a claim, and then drop them? That feels sketchy as hell.
User avatar
Looker
Looker
Stenographer
User avatar
User avatar
Looker
Stenographer
Stenographer
Posts: 5161
Joined: February 20, 2009

Post Post #1156 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 7:08 am

Post by Looker »

In post 1084, Nash wrote:Tuxedo, where am I in your readlist?
Is Aristophanes your partner and you're waiting for him to get back before you vote? Did not having daytalk throw off your bussing of Marashu?
In post 1140, Nash wrote:
Spoiler:
In post 1139, Battle Mage wrote:that's L-2 as well, so you may as well claim. then we are 100% eliminating either you or PP today.


VT
But
Spoiler:
In post 1132, Nash wrote:I still think the VT claim was a bad move as scum.


  • I feel Froppy has an exaggerated sense of self.
  • I don't see how I'm "coasting" through the game when I clung tight to the Marashu wagon and didn't jump off when people kept trying to make it die.
  • I'm already starting to not like Froppy. As a player.
    • "I haven't seen Looker post since I've joined" - I posted an hour after she joined and even welcomed her.
    • "What's your opinion on the new stuff?" - What new stuff? Be specific.
    • "What's your opinion of my slot? Not whether I'm scum or town" - You [redacted], I don't even know who you are.
  • Nash has a unique way of saying "chainsaw defense".
Hider plan is cool, what did PP claim?
User avatar
Battle Mage
Battle Mage
Jester
User avatar
User avatar
Battle Mage
Jester
Jester
Posts: 22231
Joined: January 10, 2007

Post Post #1157 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 7:56 am

Post by Battle Mage »

PP claimed vanilla too. Agree with rest of your post Looker.

Tux - superficially sketchy but we had a good reason - wanted to pin him down to a vanilla claim when he had been crumbing a PR, to give some strength to the argument he is scum.
Show
2020 Stats - 31 completed games:

Survived to the end and won - 11
Nightkilled - 10
Survived to the end and lost - 6
Day-elimmed by majority - 4

winrate as scum: 78%
winrate as town: 55%
User avatar
superbowl9
superbowl9
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
superbowl9
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 3565
Joined: April 22, 2015

Post Post #1158 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 9:51 am

Post by superbowl9 »

In post 1153, Battle Mage wrote:we're seeking agreement? eh, i was just expecting people would go with it. i'm not in the mood for more debate after Froppy's thing earlier...

simpler approach is, if someone claims they diverted from the plan, policy daykill them for being stupid.
We don't need to debate it, just good to know for sure who is with the plan
User avatar
Battle Mage
Battle Mage
Jester
User avatar
User avatar
Battle Mage
Jester
Jester
Posts: 22231
Joined: January 10, 2007

Post Post #1159 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 9:55 am

Post by Battle Mage »

can we eliminate someone already? my patience has worn thin!
Show
2020 Stats - 31 completed games:

Survived to the end and won - 11
Nightkilled - 10
Survived to the end and lost - 6
Day-elimmed by majority - 4

winrate as scum: 78%
winrate as town: 55%
User avatar
superbowl9
superbowl9
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
superbowl9
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 3565
Joined: April 22, 2015

Post Post #1160 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 9:55 am

Post by superbowl9 »

Also looker by coast I didnt mean you haven't been doing pro-town things, I meant that your slot hasn't received any real pressure so far.
User avatar
Battle Mage
Battle Mage
Jester
User avatar
User avatar
Battle Mage
Jester
Jester
Posts: 22231
Joined: January 10, 2007

Post Post #1161 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 9:56 am

Post by Battle Mage »

me and looker lost this setup last time - give a brother a break :lol:
Show
2020 Stats - 31 completed games:

Survived to the end and won - 11
Nightkilled - 10
Survived to the end and lost - 6
Day-elimmed by majority - 4

winrate as scum: 78%
winrate as town: 55%
User avatar
superbowl9
superbowl9
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
superbowl9
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 3565
Joined: April 22, 2015

Post Post #1162 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 9:59 am

Post by superbowl9 »

Dw you and looker are the least of my worries right now :)
User avatar
Tuxedo Mask
Tuxedo Mask
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
Tuxedo Mask
Goon
Goon
Posts: 973
Joined: April 23, 2020

Post Post #1163 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 11:40 am

Post by Tuxedo Mask »

Who is the most of your worries?
User avatar
Froppy
Froppy
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
Froppy
Goon
Goon
Posts: 175
Joined: May 26, 2020

Post Post #1164 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 11:42 am

Post by Froppy »

I'm fine with the plan and looker the question I gave you is open ended. Any answer was fine.
User avatar
Battle Mage
Battle Mage
Jester
User avatar
User avatar
Battle Mage
Jester
Jester
Posts: 22231
Joined: January 10, 2007

Post Post #1165 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 11:53 am

Post by Battle Mage »

In post 1163, Tuxedo Mask wrote:Who is the most of your worries?
clearly Nash as he's voting for him.

Tux, please vote either Nash or PP, I don't care which.
Show
2020 Stats - 31 completed games:

Survived to the end and won - 11
Nightkilled - 10
Survived to the end and lost - 6
Day-elimmed by majority - 4

winrate as scum: 78%
winrate as town: 55%
User avatar
word321
word321
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
word321
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 1305
Joined: March 18, 2020

Post Post #1166 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 11:54 am

Post by word321 »

In post 1042, Aristophanes wrote:
In post 1039, PenguinPower wrote:Ari! Give me something before you disappear plskthx. I liked you yesterday...I’m iffy today.
Sure thing my friend!

Mara flipping scum really surprised me, so I need to rethink a few things and read their Iso before I commit to things.

I will say that there being no mention of Nash, like not a single one, in Mara's Iso until more than 700 posts into the game, and then 43 mentions in the following 200 (I mean, half of that is the broken quote but still) with a sudden scumread is a lot more interesting than I initially gave it credit for. I am going to have to do some wagonomics on it and see if the pivot looks like scum trying to save their ass, scum trying a light bus to pivot attention and break up their wagon while getting rid of associatives, or like scum flailing.

I'll have a readslist later, since the scumflip changes an awful lot for me.
Sorry Tux.

(I almost posted this in the wrong thread, as in, in Mish Mash. That would have been bad. Thank god for ninjas!)
I want a follow up of this before ending the day.
Played in
Newbie 1992
,
Newbie 1997
,
Newbie 1999
,
Large Normal 227
,
Newbie 2006
,
Open 784
,
Open 787
,
Newbie 2019
, Open 790, Newbie 2022.
Currently playing in Open 794, Newbie2028.
Currently UTC-3.
User avatar
Tuxedo Mask
Tuxedo Mask
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
Tuxedo Mask
Goon
Goon
Posts: 973
Joined: April 23, 2020

Post Post #1167 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 11:57 am

Post by Tuxedo Mask »

In post 1165, Battle Mage wrote:
In post 1163, Tuxedo Mask wrote:Who is the most of your worries?
clearly Nash as he's voting for him.

Tux, please vote either Nash or PP, I don't care which.
Still trying to see how I feel about the town bloc. Hard bussing Marashu day 1 is a fine strategy, and the way day two has shaken out has been weird. I'd pick PP over Nash. I at least understood where Nash was coming from end of Day 1. I don't PP has been trying to solve at all today, just arguing about theory stuff.
User avatar
word321
word321
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
word321
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 1305
Joined: March 18, 2020

Post Post #1168 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 12:01 pm

Post by word321 »

In post 1143, Battle Mage wrote:HIDER - tonight target the person directly above you in THIS list (alphabetical order, with slight alteration to avoid double-targetting):

Aristophanes
Battle Mage
Doctor Drew
Froppy
Looker
Nash
Gypyx
PenguinPower
superbowl9
Tuxedo Mask
word321
Can u switch {ari, Bm} or {ari, word}? Can u switch {Gypyx, pp} too? I want to "check" those slots.
Played in
Newbie 1992
,
Newbie 1997
,
Newbie 1999
,
Large Normal 227
,
Newbie 2006
,
Open 784
,
Open 787
,
Newbie 2019
, Open 790, Newbie 2022.
Currently playing in Open 794, Newbie2028.
Currently UTC-3.
User avatar
Battle Mage
Battle Mage
Jester
User avatar
User avatar
Battle Mage
Jester
Jester
Posts: 22231
Joined: January 10, 2007

Post Post #1169 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 12:03 pm

Post by Battle Mage »

In post 1168, word321 wrote:
In post 1143, Battle Mage wrote:HIDER - tonight target the person directly above you in THIS list (alphabetical order, with slight alteration to avoid double-targetting):

Aristophanes
Battle Mage
Doctor Drew
Froppy
Looker
Nash
Gypyx
PenguinPower
superbowl9
Tuxedo Mask
word321
Can u switch {ari, Bm} or {ari, word}? Can u switch {Gypyx, pp} too? I want to "check" those slots.
no. don't over-complicate it, I've done my homework.
Show
2020 Stats - 31 completed games:

Survived to the end and won - 11
Nightkilled - 10
Survived to the end and lost - 6
Day-elimmed by majority - 4

winrate as scum: 78%
winrate as town: 55%
User avatar
Battle Mage
Battle Mage
Jester
User avatar
User avatar
Battle Mage
Jester
Jester
Posts: 22231
Joined: January 10, 2007

Post Post #1170 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 12:05 pm

Post by Battle Mage »

In post 1167, Tuxedo Mask wrote:
In post 1165, Battle Mage wrote:
In post 1163, Tuxedo Mask wrote:Who is the most of your worries?
clearly Nash as he's voting for him.

Tux, please vote either Nash or PP, I don't care which.
Still trying to see how I feel about the town bloc. Hard bussing Marashu day 1 is a fine strategy, and the way day two has shaken out has been weird. I'd pick PP over Nash. I at least understood where Nash was coming from end of Day 1. I don't PP has been trying to solve at all today, just arguing about theory stuff.
i wouldnt have bussed marashu, he seemed like a nice dude.

it feels a bit like scum have given up.

im fine with you voting PP for that valid reason.
Show
2020 Stats - 31 completed games:

Survived to the end and won - 11
Nightkilled - 10
Survived to the end and lost - 6
Day-elimmed by majority - 4

winrate as scum: 78%
winrate as town: 55%
User avatar
word321
word321
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
word321
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 1305
Joined: March 18, 2020

Post Post #1171 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 12:22 pm

Post by word321 »

then Im ok with ending the game with either nash or Pp. both r 0% in the hider/hidee mechanic. So im voting whoever has more votes when ari follows up his post.
Played in
Newbie 1992
,
Newbie 1997
,
Newbie 1999
,
Large Normal 227
,
Newbie 2006
,
Open 784
,
Open 787
,
Newbie 2019
, Open 790, Newbie 2022.
Currently playing in Open 794, Newbie2028.
Currently UTC-3.
User avatar
Doctor Drew
Doctor Drew
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Doctor Drew
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 3048
Joined: June 10, 2019

Post Post #1172 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 3:34 pm

Post by Doctor Drew »

I won't be super active the next day or so, a hammer would be perfect.
'This might be the first game where I'm townreading Doctor Drew. Not sure if that's a good or bad sign considering he was town the previous 2 times' - Hectic
'Like I am trying to not be a tunnelly asshole Drew but my patience is running thin' - Titus
'ok just make sure to fuck them, preferably not us pls (人>ω<)' - Morning Tweet
User avatar
superbowl9
superbowl9
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
superbowl9
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 3565
Joined: April 22, 2015

Post Post #1173 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 5:16 pm

Post by superbowl9 »

In post 1167, Tuxedo Mask wrote:I at least understood where Nash was coming from end of Day 1.
What???? Nash's play at the end of D1 is policy elimable. Now's a great time to put out more detail about why I prefer them to PP.

PPThe midari case has been done to death, and looking back at the ISO after Mara's flip, nothing does too much to distance the two. There's valid points to be made here on Midari, but PP has been quite inoffensive in his content. It seems to me like they replaced into too many pages and simply is not really putting in much effort to keep up with the game. I can see why it's good to get this slot gone, but Nash has, in my opinion, been objectively bad for a while.


NashThe no elim vote here is really revealing to me. Yes, bad play is not necessarily AI, but after Nash sees the flawed logic and Mara is flipped, it seems as if their D2 play has become less active (this is partly tonal, but also virtually all content today has been responding to prompts from others/self defense: I saw more individual initiative taken yesterday). I think this is likely a result of scum realizing they messed up with a big anti-town play at a critical moment yesterday and becoming more reserved/defensive (it could also be a result of being shaken by an incorrect TR on Mara, but I don't see a lot of re-evaluation taking place so I think this is unlikely).

The more I look at it, the more Nash's Mara rhetoric gets worse. and read very fence-sitty to me: Nash is willing to bus since their partner has been scummy, but is still keeping the option of pulling out a townread open, which ends up happening. Then at the end of D1, putting huge weight on a VT claim from scum - enough to invalidate everything from ?

The other issue I have is that Nash has been targeting seemingly "easier" players to ML the whole game. I'll tell you up front that this point isn't the strongest one, as (especially for newer players), easy MLs are usually the ones doing scummy things, so it makes sense that a player's scumreads line up with that to a certain extent. But I do think Nash's foses are quite interesting in this game: votato, worchestire, brassherald, TM, and CJ. Just feels weak to me and like Nash is looking for an easy ML in a bunch of places. Ironically this line of reasoning might also implicate PP, since Nash has townread them for a while, but this is all way too early and way too shaky to really put much solace into. Just something to note.
User avatar
superbowl9
superbowl9
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
superbowl9
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 3565
Joined: April 22, 2015

Post Post #1174 (ISO) » Sat Jul 11, 2020 5:19 pm

Post by superbowl9 »

Also TM I am still really confused why you voted Marashu 3 posts in a row (also then unvote next post lol). And can you confirm that you are following the hider plan?
Locked