Micro 952 - The Coalition: ItGBSMoD [game over!]

[Datisi]

Vote count 2.04

with 7 votes in play, it takes 4 to make a decision. day 2 ends in (expired on 2020-07-16 13:15:00).

execution

PookyTheMagicalBear [2]:

Klick, DonCorleone

Klick [1]:

Dumb and Dumber

not voting [4]:

Alduskkel, PookyTheMagicalBear, Wug, Deimos27

flavour

mod notes

• Datisi is V/LA until Sunday.

[Klick]

scum on coalition: pooky > dd > klick
scum off coalition: ald > don > deimos

might change my mind about dd-klick order

How much sense does a Pooky/Aldus team make? I'd argue very little

[Klick]

Anyway if no one has done anything by the time Deimos is back can we just execute Pooky

[Klick]

Until DnD cares enough to get caught up, I don't really care enough to engage with them; Pooky gets executed today regardless, and either he's scum and I'm dead tomorrow, or he's town and I didn't engage with scum hooray

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

engaging with them is one way you win the 1v1 tommorrow though

it's going to look real shit if you rush-execute me while refusing to engage with DnD tomm - if you're town and he's scum - he only needs 1 town vote to be wrong and you get quicklynched.

[Dumb and Dumber]

Why is everyone unable to describe the case on Pooky?

[Dumb and Dumber]

Assuming scum!D&D this play makes a lot more sense as setting up Klick -> Pooky or Pooky -> Klick miseliminations.

So please spend some time achieving the correct sort here? Firing Pooky seems to be lazy play.

People are unable to come up with anything more substantial on Pooky than that he tunneled Clover... And apparently I would "obviously" see it if I caught up...

[Alduskkel]

okay here's your damn quote pile that should illustrate why pooky is scum

Spoiler:

I think Pooky's initial case held some weight but the way that he approached the argument reeks of bad faith + he's dodging explaining his coalition reads.

I'm bored of this already

you're using the 1000 questions defense in which you ignore the attack and just distract with a bunch of random questions until the thread of the argument is lost and the post count is too long for anyone else to follow.

I'm going to stop engaging with you as it's obviously pointless at this time.

Like this is basically a misrepresentation (the questions aren't random) and is setting up a situation where Koba even asking questions is "scummy." Then at the end Pooky frames his attempt to shut down the conversation as pro-town.

VOTE: Pooky

you SAID you explained it when you put it together and I just showed you didn't

deimos my number 1 townread right now

he's so clueless he has to be town

let's win this first day boys

get it done

I think we have a 85% chance of winning this game outright if townies act really townie



let's do it

DC pretty susp

a real townie would've said yes

what

why did you stop playing chess with me ??

I think there are 2 high-ev methods to play day 1.

1) we figure out 5 definite townies, throw em in the coalition - win the game.

2) we throw the 5 worst players in the coalition - if they're scum we will kick their asses in the real game cuz they're bad.

nah

oh that's nice

let's try to get the coalition right then

we also won't know how many scum are in the coalition yes? So that's a bad plan there pooky.

50% of my mafia play is making bad plans and seeing who figures out they are terrible.

Votato a real G here

oh snap I just realized we have exactly 5 lovers from the other game here together

it's like a reunion.

Let's do it guys

HEAL: SLEEPERSOUL

The Real G who almost got there

HEAL: BUGSPRAY

My Chess Playing Time Traveling Lover

HEAL: TUXEDO MASK

The fool blinded by love

HEAL: VOTATO

The Bad Man who killed us all

HEAL: POOKY

One Teddy Bear to Save the Day

I'm ready for DC's solve

Take me to Money Town

I'm reading you as town why would I fight you

HEAL: DEIMOS
HEAL: SLEEPERSOUL
HEAL: DC
HEAL: Pooky
HEAL: Votato

fixed tags

None of these explain your damn coalition. At best you can say you explained Deimos's place, but that was a read you made on the first page.

like seriously he's straight up lying at this point

vote Clover

get him tommorrow for me pls thx. look at his iso its basically contentless.

good luck i tried my best


go town.

Oh okay

Then 1627 just seems like a LAMIST sort of post then.

Pooky's posts a couple pages back where he's making a case against Clover reads more like he just came up with that stuff recently. If he had all those points in his head for a while he would have mentioned it earlier, he's only doing it now because he needs Clover to be lynched instead of him.

Pooky took a bad faith approach to arguing with Koba.
Pooky literally lied about explaining his coalition.
Pooky moved goalposts to try to win his argument with Koba and me.
Pooky supposedly scumread Clover for a while but only recently brought up a lot of points against him. Points that he could have mentioned much earlier, but didn't because the truth is that he came up with a scumread on Clover out of convenience and then tacked on the reasons later to make it look good.

VOTE POOKY.

Pooky doesn't like what DK is doing, but I'm not convinced he actually scumreads DK.
'they didn't respond to my case so they're scum' is not moving. Either Pooky himself is being stubborn in demanding a proper response, or he's scum because he doesn't particularly care about being right.

This game is a LOOONG read and I took breaks to sort my thoughts along the way.

Your assumption is that I am scum because i oppose the current leading coalition hard. Assuming automatically i am scum without any analysis. I already explain i dont feel comfortable with multiple slots on the Coalition. If you feel so confident about it then you should have a good argment for it instead of this circular logic.

that's not what I said

ok then explain it simply. Because that is what I interpreted from your main point about me being scum to you.

ok then explain it simply. Because that is what I interpreted from your main point about me being scum to you.

I did explain it, you should read my posts

There were a lot more posts from pooky that pinged me as scummy as I was rereading, but I think these are some of the most illustrative. I don't believe pooky actually explained it that well, I don't buy that town!pooky can't see koba's points on their approach to the game. I think pooky is too smart for that even though he's very good at playing dumb.

you called my case full of holes like swiss cheese and you already exposed a gaping one. I'm still waiting for it.

Acknowledging here that his case has "one gaping hole" in it, but then ignoring it? That seems scummy. "You said 'swiss cheese', therefor you must give me multiple holes, one GAPING one is not enough"

Your assumption is that I am scum because i oppose the current leading coalition hard. Assuming automatically i am scum without any analysis. I already explain i dont feel comfortable with multiple slots on the Coalition. If you feel so confident about it then you should have a good argment for it instead of this circular logic.

that's not what I said

Okay if it's not what you said, then make corrections instead of just stating this. It sure seems like that's what you said. Because it sounds like that's what you said here.

I'd put Koba at 50% scum

he's either trying desperately to fight his way onto the coalition because he knows we are about to win easily.

or

he's a misguided townie who wants to make a splash but fell flat on his face

Shortly after this ^^^ he posts the following:

You don't want to have an honest discussion, you are scum trying to obfuscate by spamming a crapload of random things and making me re-state myself over and over so that anyone reading this thread loses focus and doesn't even know what we're talking about at the end of this if they even read to the end of this.

as this is a total waste of time I will no longer be engaging with your spot in the game. I consider you scum, I will not vote for you to be on my coalition. If you somehow seize control and get yourself coalition'ed and we get to the lynch phase my vote will automatically be on you.

Good day

Pooky seems too adamant that koba is scum without backing it up all that much (koba's behaviour can be explained by being stubborn town IMO, pooky should see this?), and he's unwilling to adequately defend his coalition. Seems scummy to me.

Aldus summaries my thoughts on the argument better than I could

-cut-

But instead of answering my case - he obfuscates by angrily spamming the thread with question after question on my behavior instead - this is a very typical whataboutism/1000 question defense.

-cut-

Now if you guys believe that behavior is protown- then by all means put kona in your coalition and leave me out - it's fine. Just a game and I'm not going to waste my time trying to convince you all that something obviously scummy is scummy.

Why aren't you willing to consider that koba's anti-town play could be coming from a townie? Isn't that how people are saying their previous games went?

I'm honestly not even bothered to interact with pooky anymore because they ARE tunneling and I already sorted their slot so there's 0 point in it since i have nothing to gain but wasted words they can think I'm scum all they want because in case they haven't noticed the conversation has moved on and I've already said my piece.

I'd rather have Pooky in the coalition over anyone but you klick as your slot and pooky's slots are the only 2 i'm sure of (yours because of votato )

koba I don't understand how you can be sure that pooky is town because to me, based on what I posted above, he seems scummy.

HURT: all

HEAL: SleeperSoul
HEAL: Deimos
HEAL: Klick
HEAL: koba

as far as I can tell I'm just adding koba to my previous coalition but I cleared it first to make sure.

I think Pooky is working from a starting point of 'Clover can't be townread' and is making his argument from that perspective.

There is a plausible reason for him to be doing that as town. But I find it more likely that he's scum who needs Clover available as a mis-execute.

Pooky posted a lot of content and played self-sacrifice to peel people off his wagon. If he was town he'd have done it post-hammer.

[Wug]

Prodding Wug.

hi

It doesn't make sense for Klick-scum to defend Clover that hard and attack me for a lynch on D1 - I flip town and he is in a way shittier position D2. He's much better off getting a Clover lynch followed by me getting lynched.

the latter is what in fact is happening

scum on coalition: pooky > dd > klick
scum off coalition: ald > don > deimos

might change my mind about dd-klick order

How much sense does a Pooky/Aldus team make? I'd argue very little

true
i wasn't thinking about teams
if pooky then could be dd scum

[Dumb and Dumber]

the latter is what in fact is happening

[DonCorleone]

Jesús H Christ, can we lynch pooky already

[DonCorleone]

Execute*

[DonCorleone]

We exe pooky to resolve the slot and see if scum were fighting for clover as a CW or if scum were very comfortable with competing wagons on town EoD1, and we go from there

[DonCorleone]

Yes it’s harder if pooky flips town because then we don’t basically lynch klick by default and we really have to think about it but if pooky flips scum which is still *very likely* then executing wug tomorrow is prob just GG

[Wug]

Yes it’s harder if pooky flips town because then we don’t basically lynch klick by default and we really have to think about it but if pooky flips scum which is still *very likely* then executing wug tomorrow is prob just GG

if pooky is town then we probably lose since everyone wants to exe me at some point
so i maybe want to be more sure about it

[Dumb and Dumber]

We exe pooky to resolve the slot and see if scum were fighting for clover as a CW or if scum were very comfortable with competing wagons on town EoD1, and we go from there

You enter a 3:2 LyLo on a Pooky townflip, it's important to fire correctly today or we probably lose.
It's much more beneficial to get a scum fire than a town fire today, so it's worth scrutinizing the reasoning behind a Pooky firing as Wug points out.
Please engage with my slot and help me see why everyone's so confident in scum!Pooky? "Info" firings just before LyLo are lame.

-Dumbass

[DonCorleone]

We don’t lose because of a pooky townflip, what are you saying lmao, we go to a 50:50 lylo which is the same as a 3p lylo ie better than 5p lylo, and we’re prob not in lylo either way

If we flip klick, and he’s green, that’s like the worst possible outcome in any scenario where pooky is town because then he’s this awful lynchbait slot who’s up against scum!you. Whereas if pooky red flips, we lynch off coalition the next day, and then we have a tough 3p lylo if the game isn’t over by then.

If I thought pooky was likely to greenflip, I’d reconsider, but rn I think you pushing for klick may be scum indicative for you bc a scum!pooky would be really bad for you

[Dumb and Dumber]

We're at 2v5 right now, right? A Pooky townflip means 2v3 and would require a correct firing both within the coalition and outside. How is it equivalent to a 3p LyLo? It's only mildly better than a full 5p LyLo from a global perspective. Scum NKs the town member in the coalition, making it a 1:1 and a 1:2 and expectations multiply.

Sure, that's the worst possible overall outcome, but any outcome where you fire town is bad enough. You have time to engage and sort...

If we're partners with Pooky this is a great opportunity for a bus, and a Klick townflip really gets us nothing the next day (as that guarantees a firing inside coalition next day, versus bussing and then scoring multiple firings outside the coalition).

Why do you think Pooky is likely to redflip?

Pooky, do you have a rebuttal to Aldusskel's quoted posts? If you're town you should be fighting your death more aggressively.

My other head will be present tomorrow.

-Dumbass

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

I don't really understand Aldus's case against me. It would be nice if he could present an actual case instead of just dumping a giant pile of quotes at me

[Datisi]

Prodding Deimos27 slightly early again.

[Dumb and Dumber]

Until DnD cares enough to get caught up, I don't really care enough to engage with them; Pooky gets executed today regardless, and either he's scum and I'm dead tomorrow, or he's town and I didn't engage with scum hooray

It's a little annoying that you keep refusing to engage with us. I'm working on getting caught up

I started reading exactly how the coalition ended up going down, and I don't entirely understand DC's progression to hammering the coalition. He was pretty firmly stating around page 48 that he thought that clover was scum, but he ended up lolhammering the coalition (with a Clover vote) as soon as there were 4 votes on it. To me that seems like DC has pretty decent scum equity, with a partner already on the coalition. Also from around those pages, DC/Klick don't seem aligned, so I'm currently thinking DC/Pooky by default

- Dumber

[Dumb and Dumber]

And I'm realizing that half the day phase is already gone. Oops, sorry about that.

I'm going to do some reading now

- Dumber

[Dumb and Dumber]

Spoiler:

Either heal me or towncase clover @koba

Klick swap me for clover

oh i didnt even know the deadline was for day 1 - thought it was just for coalition picking oops

HEAL: clover

HURT: DC
HEAL: clover

This progression does not make sense to me

[Dumb and Dumber]

Pooky, have you played any scumgames since coming back to the site?
If yes, can you link me?

- Dumber

[Dumb and Dumber]

Spoiler:

Pooky's entrance to today strikes me as really town.

Explain.

@Clover: Why did you put Pooky in your coalition?

Also, I'm not voting outside the coalition today. I'm not convinced Koba is scum though.

Sorry, just remembered you said this

Something about his hands-off approach feels distinctly like a town way of approaching a post-coalition fail. He's got this one-track mind and seems set on thinking Wug of all people is the play rn. But it's different from how Koba's doing it in that there doesn't seem to be any clear agenda to Pooky's actions other than solving (whereas from what I'm seeing Koba is setting up like five different things with what they're doing and is kinda just open-wolfing at this point).

VOTE: Pooky
Your scumread on Clover feels fake.

We have less than a day. I'll be leaving my vote here unless this doesn't take off and there's a viable Sleeper wagon.

Klick, at this point was your Pooky read more POE than anything else?

- Dumber