Newbie 2019 | Game Over!

[GeorgeBailey]

Votecount 1.5

Redados(2)

~ ItalianoVD(34), N0bleNoob(17)

MiniMegabyte(2)

~ Micc(19), GeniusGamer(47)

shellyc(1)

~ Porkens(43)

Micc(1)

~ T-Bone(15)

ItalianoVD(1)

~ Redados(31)


Not Voting (2): shellyc(32), MiniMegabyte(23)

With 9 alive it takes 5 to eliminate.

Day 1 deadline is in (expired on 2020-07-24 16:20:10)

MOD REMINDERS

GeorgeBailey

FLAVOR

[Porkens]

Almost

[shellyc]

Micc is quite scummy to me, they haven't been contributing much as an SE. Also her reads post were SRing almost everyone, which is fairly suspect.

VOTE: Micc

[Porkens]

Shelly why does your reads post use many of the same words and phrases that red’s did?

[shellyc]

Also Porkens' vote is still parked on me, which was made BEFORE I started talking. You're questioning people, but have not formulated an actual suspicion and voted.

[shellyc]

Explain. I don't see this occurrence happening in my posts, after looking in ISO.

[Porkens]

Some reads:

N0bleNoob - Trying to push people to gain information. Has pushed Porkens about pushing, but funnily enough is also doing a lot of pushing. Pushing is good because it’s how we find information.

GeniusGamer - Originally, his posts don’t have a lot of content. He was making light observations but not really saying anything or pushing anyone. He is talking more now, but he is clearly still finding his footing. I’m getting serious “new player” vibes.

Porkens - Still doing a lot of pushing and being aggressive. This feels like a viable day one strategy to get more information out in the open.

@GeniusGamer (post 136) Ah. I understand now, it's absolutely great to have preliminary reads.

Some reads:
ItalianoVD: Seems pretty active and was pushing GeniusGamer, which is an alright sus at this stage in my opinion, for his wording.
GeniusGamer: Was pushed and defence is average. Sounds like a fellow newbie. He's starting to talk more though. Needs a closer look.
Porkens: Very aggressive and pushing people, which is how we get info. Strongest townread for now.
MiniMegabyte: newbie vibes, kinda on the quiet side, says he's lost, maybe a little scumleaning here not sure.
Redados, Micc and T-Bone, though posting, haven't posted a ton of game-advancing stuff. (though I understand work commitments etc.)

Talking about genius and me.

[shellyc]

it's just a SINGLE READ COLLECTION. Ok, the wording is similar. Is that a SR to you, that we might be partnered?

[Porkens]

You claimed to have not read red’s post before making your readslist, do you maintain that position?

[shellyc]

I do maintain this position.

[Porkens]

Aight. What do you find particularly scummy about Micc?

[ItalianoVD]

Italiano, I was questioning things that stood out to me. If there’s something specific you think I’m ignoring please point it out and I’ll tell you what I think.

No issues with that at all. Was going by your statement and it just seemed liked you weren’t going to be looking at the others, but your explanation makes sense.

Humans have bias, and I think avatars have an effect on reads. How you choose to present yourself is up to you.

Hmm, maybe that’s you. I find it strange that you are only suspicious of me because of an avatar. I thought you were playing around, but you’ve reiterated that you are not. Personally I don’t care what avatar a play has, anyone/everyone is just as likely to be guilty/innocent.

T-Bone kinda pinged me with his buddy buddy talk with Micc.

It actually wasn’t buddy buddy talk and TBone has mentioned he has thought Micc was scum.

Genius not voting is off putting to me because I think scum can be afraid of how their votes will make people read them.

Very good point. I’ve noticed the uneasiness to solidify a decision from the start, which is also why I’m reading him the way I am.

Italiano is a bit inconsistent. First calling post based reads bad and then doing quite. A bit of post based reads.

I didn’t call it bad, I said post based reads are not alignment indicative and can’t be relied on as sole read indicators.

Shelly has some questionable logic and she and red have a weird synergy going on. Mostly it’s Shelly shadowing red on certain things but there’s a touch of reciprocation. Red has also given some questionable justifications.

Let’s say for hypothetical purposes that both of Red and Shelly are town. Is it not possible that as new town players they found solace in having agreements together and not sure if you mentioned it but what would their alignment be in your opinion? TvT SvS or TvS?

Mini mega could be mafia based on the “confused noob” posts but also could be ropebait.

So “confused noob” can only be from mafia?

Noble noob has said nothing about mini mega and vise versa, and the “I’m glad someone saw what I was doing there” post felt kinda like unnecessary justification to me.

Fair point. I can see that.

[ItalianoVD]

Micc is quite scummy to me, they haven't been contributing much as an SE. Also her reads post were SRing almost everyone, which is fairly suspect.

VOTE: Micc

Do you think he is scummy because he hasn’t been contributing? Or because he’s an SE? Also do you think SEs have an obligation to contribute more than anyone else? And how do you feel about Porkens who pretty much did the same thing with their readslist?

[Porkens]

Re: Micc-T It seemed jovial to me, like trying to engender fondness.

I’m leaning Shelly scum out of the two but I’m not that sold on either yet

[MiniMegabyte]

Aight. What do you find particularly scummy about Micc?

I have asked this question too

[GeniusGamer]

Genius not voting is off putting to me because I think scum can be afraid of how their votes will make people read them.

Very good point. I’ve noticed the uneasiness to solidify a decision from the start, which is also why I’m reading him the way I am.

It’s not an “uneasiness to solidify a decision”. I merely voted once I was sure that I had enough evidence. While I already had evidence, I was planning to wait for more. When it was pointed out to me that it was supposedly odd to not vote in the situation I was in, I decided to vote.

[T-Bone]

Tbone can you elaborate on that question? It does not make much sense to me.

Sorry. That was a little facetious of me. I actually think Micc is mafia right now, and I was just trying to make the awkward transition from RVS vote to serious one.

Can I ask why you think Micc is scum?

Gut, would be the short answer.

Specially in 172 I feel like Micc had expressed stronger reads on both Porkens and myself than you, but voted you anyway. It feels like to me Micc is shying away from the tougher lunch fights than voting for his strongest read. It's really common among SEs in newbie games, because, whether they are doing it intentionally or subconsciously, it's feels easier to mislim a newbie than an SE. It's an unfortunate meta on Newbie games because we have this setup where we ask more experienced players to play with newbies. When you're scum and experienced you gravitate to scumhunting the newbies.

I feel the opposite when I play as a town SE, I gravitate towards giving the newbies a lot of latitude and scrutinizing my fellow SEs more. I would feel worse about misliming a newbie on Day 1 than an SE. I'm not saying this is necessarily the "correct" way to approach things. That's how I approached it initially and to me, Micc throwing some scumish reads on Porkens and I and not voting either one of us feels sketch. Like yes, liming one of us would be harder, but if we're your scum reads than you should want to do it.

[ItalianoVD]

I am always suspicious of not voting your strongest scum read, voting when pushed, or simply not voting because of whatever reason. Our vote is our most powerful weapon against scum and when people are scared to use that power it throws my antennas up.

[Redados]

Everyone's reads so far (I tried my best, I may have missed some things):

ShellyC
59 - leans town on Redados, says GeniusGamer hasn’t been productive
108 - thinks Porkens isn’t scum
142 - Gives read on ItalianoVD which I don’t understand (?), reads town on Porkens, leaning scum on MiniMegabyte
160 - town vibes from T-Bone
170 - scum vibes from MiniMegabyte
277 - scum reads from Micc

N0bleNoob
107 - suggests that Porkens is pushing away attention from themself
185 - suspects those who call other people scum
248 - thinks that Shelly and MiniMegabyte voting for each other is supsicious

MiniMegabyte
176 - expressed suspicion on ShellyC for being inactive initially
225 - Leans town on Italiano, neutral on ShellyC

ItalianoVD
127 - says he doesn’t like GeniusGamer’s responses
129 - thinks Micc sounds like town
187 - Thinks T-Bone is town, thinks MiniMegabyte is town, thinks ShellyC is town. Likes N0bleNoob’s posting. Leans scum on GeniusGamer and Redados
193 - Reiterates ShellyC townie read
241 - leaning town on Micc

Redados
43 - gave “reads” on everyone but with no information in retrospect it’s kind of useless
134 - commented on GeniusGamer for not having content in his posts
174 - commented on ShellyC for having initial posts that were mostly observational and repetitive of what others were saying, commented on MiniMegabyte constantly saying that she was new or confused, commented on getting scumvibes from ItalianoVD, commented on initial fluff from GeniusGamer, commented on how Porkens’ pushing is good.
190, 196, & 199 - elaborated on scumvibes from ItalianoVD

GeniusGamer
44 - considering a wagon on ShellyC
240 - scummy vibes from MiniMegabyte

Micc -
32 - feels ItalianoVD’s posting is harmful
234 - comments on how Shelly’s pushed haven’t been useful, comments on N0bleNoob possibly being scum, comments on Mini misrepresenting her contributions to the game, says ItalianoVD feels town, says he doesn’t feel that Redados’ push was justified, says GeniusGamer was not really memorable, says that T-Bone’s actions don’t seem town-like.

Porkens

208 - Feels Micc is pro-town, initially suspicious of ItalianoVD
247 - Pinged by T-Bone, offput by GeniusGamer, calls Italiano inconsistent, calls Shelly out for questionable logic, calls Shelly and Redados out for synergy, calls MiniMegabyte out for possibly being mafia based on “confused noob” posts.
288 - leaning towards Shelly being scum

T-Bone

93 - says GeniusGamer’s post looks scummy
264 - thinks Micc is mafia, elaborates in post 291

I want to fill in holes here, so here are my thoughts and questions related to the lists above:

ShellyC hasn’t given thoughts on N0bleNoob, but she’s had thoughts on everyone else at some point. ShellyC, what are your thoughts on N0bleNoob?

N0bleNoob hasn’t really had any opinions on anyone. He’s cast doubt on Porkens’ methods of pushing and called Shelly and Mini suspicious. This looks pretty sketch to me. N0bleNoob, what are your thoughts on everyone?

MiniMegabyte is someone who I NEED to hear more from. She’s been active but not really moving the game forward. Mini, please share your thoughts on who you suspect is scum.

ItalianoVD - what do you think of Porkens’ alignment?

GeniusGamer - you need to call people out and have thoughts and opinions. You are playing very passively. I want to see you post more and think more.

Micc - what are your thoughts on GeniusGamer and Porkens?

Porkens - what are your thoughts on N0bleNoob?

T-Bone - you’ve expressed suspicion re: GeniusGamer and Micc. Do you still feel suspicious of GeniusGamer? If Micc is mafia, who is his partner?

[Redados]

After going through that, I'm going to share my gut alignment thoughts, which are in no order within lists:

Town:
ItalianoVD
Porkens
Redados
T-Bone

Neutral:
Micc

Suspicious:
ShellyC
N0bleNoob
MiniMegabyte
GeniusGamer

Obviously, right now, I am overly suspicious as there are not four mafia members in this game.

VOTE: N0bleNoob

[GeniusGamer]

Suspicious:
ShellyC
N0bleNoob
MiniMegabyte
GeniusGamer

Obviously, right now, I am overly suspicious as there are not four mafia members in this game.

VOTE: N0bleNoob

Is there any particular reason why you voted for N0bleNoob?

[Redados]

Suspicious:
ShellyC
N0bleNoob
MiniMegabyte
GeniusGamer

Obviously, right now, I am overly suspicious as there are not four mafia members in this game.

VOTE: N0bleNoob

Is there any particular reason why you voted for N0bleNoob?

I ISOd him to create my post. While doing that, I noticed that he was initially hesitant to give opinions where he would cast suspicion on someone (after RVS). When he has given opinions on people, I disagree with his logic. For example, he cast suspicion on ShellyC and MiniMegabyte for voting and unvoting for each other. I do get scummy vibes from those two right now, but I don't agree with his logic on why.

Most people are giving opinions on what they think the alignment of others is. If it's harder for scum to do that, that jives with the actions and posts of N0bleNoob.

I want to hear him give more thoughts and opinions on the alignment of others.

[GeorgeBailey]

N0bleNoob and Micc have been prodded!

They have (expired on 2020-07-21 14:55:30) to post before I start looking for a replacement.

[GeniusGamer]

Yikes. They’re not very active, huh?

[T-Bone]

I wouldn't be so concerned with activity right now. Life happens.